Jason Todd:WTF?

[Captain Jim]

Yeah, Elseworlds stuff was clearly outside continuity, but I was talking about other stuff.

[carabas]

Originally Posted by Captain Jim

I know that sort of thing will drive a lot of you crazy, but that's his opinion. And it doesn't seem a lot different from how Grant Morrison operates, quite frankly.

With the difference that Morrison just came right out and said he was going to be altering past continuity before the first issue even shipped, making perfectly clear what he was doing. And that Morrison's run didn't spin out of Legends Of The Dark Knight.

[nepenthes]

Originally Posted by Captain Jim

Well, the point is that Loeb obviously viewed it as being in continuity and had been led to think it was by the editors at the time. Of course, as I mentioned earlier, DC very rarely makes pronouncements about these things.

Also, a clarification. I think I may have implied that I had this correspondence with him right after TLH. It was actually after right after DV, though the conversation was related to both. And the issues in DV were related to Robin, because this was part of my conversation with him. I don't remember the particulars either, but there was some some conflict in some of the details. Loeb's comment was that his view of continuity was that (for instance) it was Dick Grayson who became Robin, not Jimmy Olsen. But the details of how it happened were not carved in stone.

I know that sort of thing will drive a lot of you crazy, but that's his opinion. And it doesn't seem a lot different from how Grant Morrison operates, quite frankly.

I understand that Loeb might view TLH as continuity, but I'm thinking that his idea of continuity is a little different to most other peoples. He takes the big picture approach too far without any regard to the contradictions and what they mean. And that's cool of course but to me it makes it a "soft continuity" story. Even internally, the number of villains in TLH makes no sense storywise as myself and a few others have pointed out.

Loeb simply set out to write a Godfather type Batman story about Harvey Dent featuring a bunch of villains; perhaps the logic of including so many Batmans villains was inconsequential to that purpose; as maxi series he might have felt more inclined to follow his own whims in portraying Batmans early days; and because it was ever branded outright as Elseworlds he'd be inclined to believe it was published as continuity.

As Carabas implied, at least Morrisons stories have a way of implicitly acknowledging when he's changing continuity, and more importantly the continuity itself a critical platform for developing new themes or story. That's a big difference to Loebs cavalier, slapdash approach imo. Also I think the fact it spun out of LotDK and what you've elaborated about Dark Victory could also be important.

[FunkyGreenJerusalem]

Originally Posted by nepenthes

He takes the big picture approach too far without any regard to the contradictions and what they mean. And that's cool of course but to me it makes it a "soft continuity" story.

I think that's the right way to go about it.
It's not like we ever saw Batman's first year as it happened, like we did with Spider-Man, and as Batman Begin's and Dark Knight showed, people love seeing his origin story.

and because it was ever branded outright as Elseworlds he'd be inclined to believe it was published as continuity.

Go read interviews and solicits of the day - nothing implies that this is set out of continuity.
It's just a look at his early adventures.

As Carabas implied, at least Morrisons stories have a way of implicitly acknowledging when he's changing continuity, and more importantly the continuity itself a critical platform for developing new themes or story.

Morrison's great trick is that though he plays a bit loose with continuity, most changes he's made have actually brought it closer to, or reflected, stories that did happen, that've just fallen from memory for many.
You may think it's lame to mention the time he and Dick were stuck in a submarine in the harbour for a few weeks, but, it did happen in the books.