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Retro315 · 03-14-2009, 07:10 AM

I was re-reading 52 and I had a wild thought about the demon on Bat-Mite's back in Batman, R.I.P. check it out.

In "Dark Knight Down" Batman goes into the desert to have his demons cut out of him by the Ten-Eyed Tribe of the Empty Quarter, there are six of them. 12 arms, 60 fingers, 60 eyes.

In "The Fiend With Nine-Eyes" one of their number shows up, pissed, exactly where Bruce is, ranting and raving. He only has nine fingers. This much we know, of course. Where's the connection?

In "Batman, R.I.P." we see Bruce's backup Zur En Arrh personality take over, and he envisions his conscience, his natural, normal "Bruce Wayne" state as Bat-Mite, and we see that little demon hanging off of his back. And I got to thinking ...

Perhaps they didn't cut out all of Bruce's demons after all. This Nine-Eyed Man must have been one of the surgeons, and because he didn't have all ten eyes on his fingers because of the missing finger, the surgery is incomplete. So while it was mostly removed from Bruce, his demons still cling by a thread.

Anyway, how that plays out with Bruce painting cave-paintings in prehistoric times is beyond me ... but that's what re-reading Morrison gets you.

mofo · 03-14-2009, 10:54 AM

high 5 dude

nepenthes · 03-16-2009, 02:18 AM

interesting. i like it.

someone here posted a line from a poem or novel that seemed to describe the demon perfectly. i was pretty much convinced it was the exact source Morrison was drawing on. I hope they see this thread and post it again.

MikhailJones · 03-22-2009, 11:13 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by nepenthes

interesting. i like it.

someone here posted a line from a poem or novel that seemed to describe the demon perfectly. i was pretty much convinced it was the exact source Morrison was drawing on. I hope they see this thread and post it again.

"But I saw the other, too...the Archon, the one who had been with me all along, spindly arms close to mine, black-mandibled skull bobbing in back of my own. I'm not alone." - Robert Charles Wilson, Plato's Mirror

Tanjint · 03-22-2009, 11:58 AM

Grant Morrison's Invisibles blatantly discusses Archons. They are among the main villains of the series.

-T

MikhailJones · 03-22-2009, 12:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tanjint

Grant Morrison's Invisibles blatantly discusses Archons. They are among the main villains of the series.

-T

On Wikipedia, itself later mentioned by the Joker: One of the meanings for Archon - "Servants of the Demiurge, the "creator god", that stood between the human race and a transcendent God that could only be reached through gnosis." Ha ha.

Retro315 · 03-22-2009, 12:33 PM

Archons as servants of God are also somewhat interchangeable with angels or demons. This little one is definitely putting off the demonic vibe (since literally the Ten-Eyed Tribe were supposed to cut out the demons).

Which kind of brings up the point of ancient traditions (medieval included) of bloodletting. A mystic or medic would cut you and "bleed out" the demons, and so these Ten-Eyed Men seem to be an extension of that - making such ninja-precise cuts that you don't die from the bleeding.

Another thing to note, is that the poem referenced above, about spindly arms definitely describes a similar "demon hanging on your back" as Tony Daniel drew for us ... but merely says "spindly arms", not "Six spindly arms" ... the multiple arms both gives it a kind of "Alien Facehugger" freak vibe, but also could point towards Hindu and Buddhist mythology (especially true considering that Batman has studied a lot of Buddhist meditation, Nanda Parbat itself is in the Himalayas in a "Tibet-like" setting, with the old secret valley motif, and so that's how Batman would visualize this thing).

I'm still not certain how to interpret the way that Charlie Caligula seemed to be able to see Bat-Mite and the Archon (which is a sure sight shorter to type and read than "the demon monkey on Bat-Mite's back"). However, I'll note that the REAL Caligula believed he was a god, presented himself as a physical living god to the public, which was extreme behavior from one or two egomaniacal emperors in all of Roman history. Not to mention that Caligula was insane ... which seems like all the connection you'd need to Morrison's trend of "gods in the DCU and how we perceive them" ideas.

03-14-2009, 07:10 AM	#1
Retro315 Senior Member Join Date: Aug 2008 Location: Utica, NY Posts: 4,557	The Little Demon on Bat-Mite's Back. I was re-reading 52 and I had a wild thought about the demon on Bat-Mite's back in Batman, R.I.P. check it out. In "Dark Knight Down" Batman goes into the desert to have his demons cut out of him by the Ten-Eyed Tribe of the Empty Quarter, there are six of them. 12 arms, 60 fingers, 60 eyes. In "The Fiend With Nine-Eyes" one of their number shows up, pissed, exactly where Bruce is, ranting and raving. He only has nine fingers. This much we know, of course. Where's the connection? In "Batman, R.I.P." we see Bruce's backup Zur En Arrh personality take over, and he envisions his conscience, his natural, normal "Bruce Wayne" state as Bat-Mite, and we see that little demon hanging off of his back. And I got to thinking ... Perhaps they didn't cut out all of Bruce's demons after all. This Nine-Eyed Man must have been one of the surgeons, and because he didn't have all ten eyes on his fingers because of the missing finger, the surgery is incomplete. So while it was mostly removed from Bruce, his demons still cling by a thread. Anyway, how that plays out with Bruce painting cave-paintings in prehistoric times is beyond me ... but that's what re-reading Morrison gets you.

03-14-2009, 10:54 AM	#2
mofo The female paraquat Join Date: May 2006 Location: Toronto Posts: 1,004	high 5 dude __________________ It's warping me

03-16-2009, 02:18 AM	#3
nepenthes deep green Join Date: Dec 2007 Posts: 3,941	interesting. i like it. someone here posted a line from a poem or novel that seemed to describe the demon perfectly. i was pretty much convinced it was the exact source Morrison was drawing on. I hope they see this thread and post it again. __________________ *Action Comics, Batman, Wonder Woman, Swamp Thing, Animal Man, Batwoman, JL Dark, Frankenstein, Birds of Prey, All Star Western, The Flash!*

03-22-2009, 12:33 PM	#7
Retro315 Senior Member Join Date: Aug 2008 Location: Utica, NY Posts: 4,557	Re Archons as servants of God are also somewhat interchangeable with angels or demons. This little one is definitely putting off the demonic vibe (since literally the Ten-Eyed Tribe were supposed to cut out the demons). Which kind of brings up the point of ancient traditions (medieval included) of bloodletting. A mystic or medic would cut you and "bleed out" the demons, and so these Ten-Eyed Men seem to be an extension of that - making such ninja-precise cuts that you don't die from the bleeding. Another thing to note, is that the poem referenced above, about spindly arms definitely describes a similar "demon hanging on your back" as Tony Daniel drew for us ... but merely says "spindly arms", not "Six spindly arms" ... the multiple arms both gives it a kind of "Alien Facehugger" freak vibe, but also could point towards Hindu and Buddhist mythology (especially true considering that Batman has studied a lot of Buddhist meditation, Nanda Parbat itself is in the Himalayas in a "Tibet-like" setting, with the old secret valley motif, and so that's how Batman would visualize this thing). I'm still not certain how to interpret the way that Charlie Caligula seemed to be able to see Bat-Mite and the Archon (which is a sure sight shorter to type and read than "the demon monkey on Bat-Mite's back"). However, I'll note that the REAL Caligula believed he was a god, presented himself as a physical living god to the public, which was extreme behavior from one or two egomaniacal emperors in all of Roman history. Not to mention that Caligula was insane ... which seems like all the connection you'd need to Morrison's trend of "gods in the DCU and how we perceive them" ideas.

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03-22-2009, 11:58 AM	#5
Tanjint Hip-Hop Hippie Join Date: Jun 2008 Posts: 1,256	Grant Morrison's Invisibles blatantly discusses Archons. They are among the main villains of the series. -T