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  1. #1

    Default Is X-O Manowar a Marvel amalgamation?

    I took advantage of the Comixology sale on Valiant's X-O Manowar sale where the 1st 11 issues are $0.99 apiece. First off, it is a fantastic story. However, as I was reading it, it seemed like the character was an amalgamation from the Big Three Avengers. The main character, Aric, is a brash, arrogant warrior like Thor. He is a man out of time like Captain America. He also has a highly advanced suit of armor like Iron Man.

    After reading the book, I did a little research on the title and saw that he was created by Jim Shooter who was the Editor in Chief at Marvel for a while. Has it ever been stated where his inspiration for the character came from? Also, as I have not read any of the original series (just the wiki page on Comicvine), can anyone confirm that his personality is similar to how it was originally conceived?
    Last edited by Cap10nate; 05-14-2013 at 05:35 AM. Reason: Grammar
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  2. #2
    Senior Member Captain Craig's Avatar
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    This description has been used before and it is relevant. It's also worth noting that in the original 90's era the suit produced a ring that Aric could wear to summon it/control it from a distance. People would toss in the ring as a loose comparison to GL. The ring has yet to appear in the new incarnation, it seems to be psychically linked to Aric.
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  3. #3
    Senior Member hunter_peterson's Avatar
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    Yeah, that's kinda the point. A lot of the Valiant characters are different spins on Marvel concepts because Shooter wanted to buy Marvel and couldn't, so he made new characters that were spins on the classic Marvel ones. So XO is a man out of time like Captain America with the personality of Thor and the powers of Iron Man. But that combination itself is unique and highly entertaining, so it's not a rip-off or anything. It's more like an homage. He's also commonly described as Conan in Iron Man armor.

    You see it with some of the other Valiant mainstays, but they're not just Marvel-influenced. Bloodshot is the Punisher with the backstory of Wolverine and nanotech Venom powers. Shadowman is Daredevil with Brother Voodoo's background, with a bit of feel of the Phantom. Harbinger's characters are Marvel's mutants, but with only variations on psychic powers, so their battles are more like Akira. And Harada himself is a mixture of Professor X and Magneto. HARDCorps are basically Weapon X super soldiers. Ninjak is ninja James Bond.

    It goes on and on, but you could say the same for most characters, really. And they twist the basic premise in really interesting ways, I think. Valiant is innovative precisely because they tweak, subvert and reinvent these archetypes. The Valiant characters have a definite Marvel ancestry, but they stand on their own and are fantastic. The characters are incredibly exciting and I'm in a constant state of excitement for more from the company!

    Oh, and I think Aric is pretty similar to his previous incarnation. Maybe slightly more brash? I think that's largely because he's less editorially restricted, though. I really hope we get some more character-focused issues soon... the big action is great, but I want to really get under his skin just a little bit more soon.
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  4. #4

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    Quote Originally Posted by hunter_peterson View Post
    Yeah, that's kinda the point. A lot of the Valiant characters are different spins on Marvel concepts because Shooter wanted to buy Marvel and couldn't, so he made new characters that were spins on the classic Marvel ones. So XO is a man out of time like Captain America with the personality of Thor and the powers of Iron Man. But that combination itself is unique and highly entertaining, so it's not a rip-off or anything. It's more like an homage. He's also commonly described as Conan in Iron Man armor.

    You see it with some of the other Valiant mainstays, but they're not just Marvel-influenced. Bloodshot is the Punisher with the backstory of Wolverine and nanotech Venom powers. Shadowman is Daredevil with Brother Voodoo's background, with a bit of feel of the Phantom. Harbinger's characters are Marvel's mutants, but with only variations on psychic powers, so their battles are more like Akira. And Harada himself is a mixture of Professor X and Magneto. HARDCorps are basically Weapon X super soldiers. Ninjak is ninja James Bond.

    It goes on and on, but you could say the same for most characters, really. And they twist the basic premise in really interesting ways, I think. Valiant is innovative precisely because they tweak, subvert and reinvent these archetypes. The Valiant characters have a definite Marvel ancestry, but they stand on their own and are fantastic. The characters are incredibly exciting and I'm in a constant state of excitement for more from the company!

    Oh, and I think Aric is pretty similar to his previous incarnation. Maybe slightly more brash? I think that's largely because he's less editorially restricted, though. I really hope we get some more character-focused issues soon... the big action is great, but I want to really get under his skin just a little bit more soon.
    Thank you for the responses. I have really enjoyed reading X-O so far and the previews for some of the other books. I wasn't too sure about the history of Valiant except for Shooter's involvement. I like Aric's character. I think that blending the character archetypes together works very well for him.
    But let justice run down like water, And righteousness like a mighty stream.

  5. #5
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    Default Indies: XO/Amalgamation

    Quote Originally Posted by Cap10nate View Post
    I took advantage of the Comixology sale on Valiant's X-O Manowar sale where the 1st 11 issues are $0.99 apiece. First off, it is a fantastic story. However, as I was reading it, it seemed like the character was an amalgamation from the Big Three Avengers. The main character, Aric, is a brash, arrogant warrior like Thor. He is a man out of time like Captain America. He also has a highly advanced suit of armor like Iron Man.

    After reading the book, I did a little research on the title and saw that he was created by Jim Shooter who was the Editor in Chief at Marvel for a while. Has it ever been stated where his inspiration for the character came from? Also, as I have not read any of the original series (just the wiki page on Comicvine), can anyone confirm that his personality is similar to how it was originally conceived?
    I also ran across some early Valiant as well as some of Shooters follow up with Defiant Comics.There are a couple of Shooter columns in the Defiant titles that leave me confused. Why was Shooter forced out of Valiant and who did this?Also did the lawsuit against Defiant waged by Marvel over Marvel's Plasmer title and his Warriors of Plasm which Shooter won but ended up costing him 200,000 in legal fees anyway end up deep sixing Defiant? What the heck was going on during this era? Also in one Defiant column he mentioned one staffer being owed 28,000 in back pay by the guys who took over Valiant.Are any back pay issues being resolved by Valiants current owners for staff or creators? Is this why it took 8 yrs.to get Valiant up and running?

  6. #6
    Senior Member havok1977's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Alton View Post
    I also ran across some early Valiant as well as some of Shooters follow up with Defiant Comics.There are a couple of Shooter columns in the Defiant titles that leave me confused. Why was Shooter forced out of Valiant and who did this?Also did the lawsuit against Defiant waged by Marvel over Marvel's Plasmer title and his Warriors of Plasm which Shooter won but ended up costing him 200,000 in legal fees anyway end up deep sixing Defiant? What the heck was going on during this era? Also in one Defiant column he mentioned one staffer being owed 28,000 in back pay by the guys who took over Valiant.Are any back pay issues being resolved by Valiants current owners for staff or creators? Is this why it took 8 yrs.to get Valiant up and running?
    I believe that Shooter being asked to leave Valiant was a joint decision by the creative committee at the time: Bob Layton, Barry Windsor-Smith et al. While Im not familiar with the details I understand that the motive was that he had a certain vision for the direction of the Valiant U that didn't fit with that the rest of the team had in mind going forward, so he was let go around the time Unity wrapped.

    This article is very informative about the happenings during those days - http://www.valiantfan.com/valiant/valiantdays.asp


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  7. #7
    Verily VALIANT! BugsySig's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Alton View Post
    I also ran across some early Valiant as well as some of Shooters follow up with Defiant Comics.There are a couple of Shooter columns in the Defiant titles that leave me confused. Why was Shooter forced out of Valiant and who did this?Also did the lawsuit against Defiant waged by Marvel over Marvel's Plasmer title and his Warriors of Plasm which Shooter won but ended up costing him 200,000 in legal fees anyway end up deep sixing Defiant? What the heck was going on during this era? Also in one Defiant column he mentioned one staffer being owed 28,000 in back pay by the guys who took over Valiant.Are any back pay issues being resolved by Valiants current owners for staff or creators? Is this why it took 8 yrs.to get Valiant up and running?
    Part of the reason Shooter was forced out was that the rest of the team wanted to sell the company, which they eventually did to Acclaim, while he did not.

    The law suit definitely helped sink Defiant, as did the bursting if the 90s bubble shortly thereafter. At the time, Marvel was trying to eliminate or purchase as much of the competition as possible. They bought Malibu and the Ultraverse, trashed Defiant, etc. The suit was totally bogus too...slight similarity in name but nothing even close conceptually.

    As far as back pay, that would have been an issue during the bankruptcy hearings. At that point, anyone with a claim needs to file it with the courts before the IPs are sold and the profits turned over to the creditors. Much of the delay in getting the publisher back up and running involved those types of issues being brought up after the bankruptcy and sale, as well as filings made for the VALIANT trademarks by one of the losing bidders, a group called VIP (Dynamic Forces), which were never granted but held up the process.

    Then there was the fact that Shooter was brought in as EIC of the new VALIANT and a plan was put in place to purchase the license for the Gold Key characters as part of a relaunch in 2010. Then Shooter, supposedly, convinced Dark Horse to buy the license instead and bolted with the plans for them to DH. All because he didn't like taking orders from a couple of "kids"...Guess the joke was on him as we've seen how that has all played out. Apparently there is a suit involving that as well.
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  8. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by Captain Craig View Post
    This description has been used before and it is relevant. It's also worth noting that in the original 90's era the suit produced a ring that Aric could wear to summon it/control it from a distance. People would toss in the ring as a loose comparison to GL. The ring has yet to appear in the new incarnation, it seems to be psychically linked to Aric.
    Based from this week's issue, I think the regrown hand of Aric has taken the place of the ring. ;) Good planting of the seed by Venditti in the first few issues of X-O but unfortunate that people might think that they are aping Iron Man 3 with RDJ's Tony Stark summoning his new armor with his hand.
    I don't think there's a current mainstream American superhero comic book that can touch Hawkeye right now. Brilliant all the way. Entertaining and technically outstanding at the same time.

  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by BugsySig View Post
    Part of the reason Shooter was forced out was that the rest of the team wanted to sell the company, which they eventually did to Acclaim, while he did not.

    The law suit definitely helped sink Defiant, as did the bursting if the 90s bubble shortly thereafter. At the time, Marvel was trying to eliminate or purchase as much of the competition as possible. They bought Malibu and the Ultraverse, trashed Defiant, etc. The suit was totally bogus too...slight similarity in name but nothing even close conceptually.

    As far as back pay, that would have been an issue during the bankruptcy hearings. At that point, anyone with a claim needs to file it with the courts before the IPs are sold and the profits turned over to the creditors. Much of the delay in getting the publisher back up and running involved those types of issues being brought up after the bankruptcy and sale, as well as filings made for the VALIANT trademarks by one of the losing bidders, a group called VIP (Dynamic Forces), which were never granted but held up the process.

    Then there was the fact that Shooter was brought in as EIC of the new VALIANT and a plan was put in place to purchase the license for the Gold Key characters as part of a relaunch in 2010. Then Shooter, supposedly, convinced Dark Horse to buy the license instead and bolted with the plans for them to DH. All because he didn't like taking orders from a couple of "kids"...Guess the joke was on him as we've seen how that has all played out. Apparently there is a suit involving that as well.
    Thanks for all the background.What a mess.Glad to see it was all old business. Just wondering if Shooter bolted to Dreamworks with GK?

  10. #10
    Lik Dis If U Cry Evertim olbassey's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by erwinrafael View Post
    Based from this week's issue, I think the regrown hand of Aric has taken the place of the ring. ;) Good planting of the seed by Venditti in the first few issues of X-O but unfortunate that people might think that they are aping Iron Man 3 with RDJ's Tony Stark summoning his new armor with his hand.
    I love this addition to the story. Anybody--**cough** lanterns **cough**--can put on a ring and wield its powers, but Aric's new hand is his gift from Shanhara. You know the X-O armor's having a lot of fun with the Visigoth.
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  11. #11
    Senior Member fishbonex's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by olbassey View Post
    I love this addition to the story. Anybody--**cough** lanterns **cough**--can put on a ring and wield its powers, but Aric's new hand is his gift from Shanhara. You know the X-O armor's having a lot of fun with the Visigoth.
    Except Anybody--**cough** CAN'T **cough**--, the rings choose their wearer and then determine if that wearer is capable, if not it leaves. And even if accepted, it takes an enormous amount of skill and willpower to get thee ring to do anything.

    X-O is not like anything from marvel, it's a stretch to say he is by combing 3 loose traits of 3 characters.

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