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  1. #1
    "Dark Hero" The Animal Man's Avatar
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    Default dumbest complaint i heard about superman....

    somebody told me they actually liked New 52 Superman better than anything involving new 52 batman and went as far as to say wonder woman's relationship is a hundred times better than the one with Lois Lane

    Why?...this guy's British so he doesn't give a crap about superman's truth justice and the american way trait of his character and he(and a few others)thought Lois Lane was a bit too bland and needed rescuing far too often and wonder woman made more sense given the power sets and everything

    I'm sorry...but what?! it seems completely idiotic for someone to say superman shouldn't be viewed as the all american icon and defender of the states because this reader is British and he couldn't care less about someone being portrayed in a patriotic light he rather superman be seen as an international alien...(Yeah this guy says he prefers Superman feeling awkward and distanced from others because he isn't human and he shouldn't feel that comfortable because it doesn't make any sense for him to be...)

    when i tried to argue that taking away someone like Lois Lane and shoving someone else into clark's life as his lover just seems weird at this point since they have been girlfriend/wife for so long already it's like Marvel's Issue with Mary Jane

    his response...Ever Heard Of Retconning?...

    *facepalm*i try to argue with him and all he does is say "Well why should it be like the old days? things are different they need to be more modern"

    so all in all this guy hates Superman being an american hero and he hates Lois Lane because to him she's just a generic damsel in distress with no reason to exist other than to be rescued but he thinks wonder woman's a perfect match because they both have powers! and aren't humans...perfect right?..WRONG!!!

    jeez...thinking about this gives me a headache worse than the one i have right now
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  2. #2
    Elder Member zryson's Avatar
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    Well, everybody thinks differently. I know some people dont like Lois Lane and really like the relationship Superman/Clark is having with Diana/Wonder Woman. I personally dont and think their relationship is poorly written (something I have noticed is widespread across the new 52 titles). For me Superman will always be with Lois Lane. Its one of those classic duo's. But I understand DC likes to shuffle things around and try to increase sales/interest in their comics.

  3. #3

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    In the old days it was just truth and justice. The American way was added much later.
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  4. #4
    Junior Member Dark Chris's Avatar
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    Why should a European like thay guy and like me care and understand the "american way" (as a concept, it sounds totally stupid)?

    And I believe that in a DCU where Superman is even more away from the human nature, he should date WW. She was raised in an island without men, away from the rest civilization.
    Last edited by Dark Chris; 04-26-2013 at 02:01 AM.

  5. #5
    Senior Member Dark-Flux's Avatar
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    Because British people dont care about truth and justice?

    Superman should serve as an inspiration for and fight for the liberties of all mankind, not just americia. The ideals of truth and justice arnt preached soley by america you know.

    And god forbid DC try mixing up the statues quo...

  6. #6
    He's Always Right Ismail's Light's Avatar
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    A lot of people like New 52 Superman because he's aggressive and forward. Anti-authoritarian and all "fuck the law". In an era where Cyclops behaves like a dickbag and Wolverine pretends he's a saint, everyone's trying the opposite side of the "crime-fighting-attitudes" spectrum for a change. I'm still waiting for Batman to start handing out candy to teenage delinquents and apologizing to the Penguin for violating his Constitutional rights, whilst Nightwing laments the good ol' days when his comic wasn't completely shit and when Batman would drag aforementioned juvenile delinquents through the streets by their ears before drop-kicking their asses in the Gotham river.

    If someone likes Superman with Wonder Woman, fine by me. I don't tend to think Superman's romantic endeavours, or Wonder Woman's for that matter, have much significance in the ultimate scheme of things. If Superman wants to boink as many hot women as he can before saying goodbye to bachelorhood and waiting for the next reset/reboot where he gets to experience the joys of one-night stands once more, go at it. If Wonder Woman wants to nail as many sexy dudes as she can before rediscovering the joys of lesbianism and kinky S&M bondage with her Amazon sisters, let her. Not gonna stop my enjoyment of their respective comic titles.

    Superman doesn't stand for the American Way. He is the American Way. The same American Way that has the brave U.S boys busting down foreign dictator's doors and hauling their asses out into the street for the peasantfolk to take their rage out on. Or, he used to, anyway. Even this New 52 Supes ain't got shit on the Golden Age guy. Not until he breaks into the home of a woman who poisoned her husband to inherit his wealth and spanks her senseless with a smirk on his face.

    Now, what was the question?

  7. #7
    Elder Member MajorHoy's Avatar
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    The guy likes things that are different from what you like . . . he's willing to embrace the fact that this is a new version of Superman, and the character shouldn't be held back by nearly 75 years of history that . . . wait for it . . . no longer apply because his past was basically erased by the events from Flashpoint. I may not agree with some of his preferences, but this is the 21st Century, not the 20th Century. Why shouldn't he be treated differently if it's basically a different character now?

    So, where do you get off calling his differing viewpoints "dumb", especially since I thought you had said in another thread you hadn't read any of the New 52 Superman books yet?

    (And also, you may be a bit young, but I remember decades of stories that took place before Superman and Lois was married. Have you ever read any of the bizarre "Superman's Girl Friend, Lois Lane" stories from back in the 1950's and 1960's?)
    Last edited by MajorHoy; 04-26-2013 at 09:38 AM.
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  8. #8
    Senior Member adkal's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Animal Man View Post
    Why?...this guy's British so he doesn't give a crap about superman's truth justice and the american way trait of his character...

    ...I'm sorry...but what?! it seems completely idiotic for someone to say superman shouldn't be viewed as the all american icon and defender of the states because this reader is British and he couldn't care less about someone being portrayed in a patriotic light he rather superman be seen as an international alien...(Yeah this guy says he prefers Superman feeling awkward and distanced from others because he isn't human and he shouldn't feel that comfortable because it doesn't make any sense for him to be...)
    Quote Originally Posted by Dark Chris View Post
    Why should a European like thay guy and like me care and understand the "american way" (as a concept, it sounds totally stupid)?
    I'm British and have a completely different view to the 'absolutist' one you just outlined. '...this guy's British so...' Seriously? Am I supposed to start labeling Americans and others with generalisations, or would that be wrong of me to do so?

    The basis of the 'American Way' is something which, frankly, anyone and everyone should be able to embrace:

    Life
    Liberty
    (and the pursuit of) Happiness

    That the actions, effects, and image of the nation has, in certain areas, been contrary to that, doesn't negate the fact that the basis of the 'American Way' is actually universal.

    his response...Ever Heard Of Retconning?...
    It's not a 'retcon'. This is a whole new continuity. There's a difference.


    so all in all this guy hates Superman being an american hero and he hates Lois Lane because to him she's just a generic damsel in distress with no reason to exist other than to be rescued but he thinks wonder woman's a perfect match because they both have powers! and aren't humans...perfect right?..WRONG!!!
    Lois is not generic, and certainly not a 'damsel in distress'. If you feel so strongly about this then you should take the time to address it with him, bit by bit. Maybe he hasn't been exposed to certain aspects of the mythos. Maybe his views are 'informed' on misunderstandings. Don't generalise, though, as that tends to be counter-productive.

  9. #9
    Mattress Tester T Hedge Coke's Avatar
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    How many times is Superman going to have to establish he's not an American citizen or strong arm, before the last of the nationalists get it?

    Also: Lois is ^#&@!ing awesome. Down with ignorant Lois-bashing!

  10. #10
    Elder Member Mat001's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Animal Man View Post
    somebody told me they actually liked New 52 Superman better than anything involving new 52 batman and went as far as to say wonder woman's relationship is a hundred times better than the one with Lois Lane

    Why?...this guy's British so he doesn't give a crap about superman's truth justice and the american way trait of his character and he(and a few others)thought Lois Lane was a bit too bland and needed rescuing far too often and wonder woman made more sense given the power sets and everything
    Obviously this guy hasn't really read a Superman comic in the last 27 years. Otherwise, he'd know that quite a bit of that time, Lois was able to take care of herself. And for a time, it was written that she had SCU training. And most definitely, this person never read the honeymoon arc of "The Wedding And Beyond", where she single-handedly rescued her husband, who was without his powers. Somebody needs to get him some comics with Lois kicking ass and taking names. I suggest showing him "Return Of The Krypton Man", Superman: The Man Of Steel #4, "Man Of Steel" #4, "Metropolis SCU", "The Wedding And Beyond", "Superman Vs Aliens", Superman: The Man Of Steel Annual #6, "Last Son", "The Death Of Clark Kent" and "Flashpoint: Superman".

    I'm sorry...but what?! it seems completely idiotic for someone to say superman shouldn't be viewed as the all american icon and defender of the states because this reader is British and he couldn't care less about someone being portrayed in a patriotic light he rather superman be seen as an international alien...(Yeah this guy says he prefers Superman feeling awkward and distanced from others because he isn't human and he shouldn't feel that comfortable because it doesn't make any sense for him to be...)
    It's fine when he first shows up in Metropolis, like in "Birthright", "Secret Origin" and "Superman And The Men Of Steel". But five to ten years later, depending on which continuity you subscribe to, Clark should be past that point.

  11. #11
    "Dark Hero" The Animal Man's Avatar
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    i tried to talk to him about this some more but he put his foot down and ended it by saying he knows more about comics than i do and hates me talking about the wonder woman/superman relationship like it's so bland

    i told him superman wants a kindred spirit and he freaked out saying how can i not believe that Wonder Woman is his kindred spirit since they both have super powers they both have had secret identities and they both find it hard to fit in around the people constantly with them

    so the discussion with him is over if i tried to bring it up again there will be trouble
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  12. #12
    Elder Member Mat001's Avatar
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    In other words, a typical fanboy.

  13. #13
    "Dark Hero" The Animal Man's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mat001 View Post
    In other words, a typical fanboy.
    I Can't Really Say...this guy never talks about comic books all that much until someone brings it up

    i was just hoping to have a decent discussion with some people and he just destroys it all by saying "Wonder Woman's A Better Girlfriend Than Lois Lane" And "Superman Shouldn't Feel Human at all he's an alien..."

    he made a key point that since he's British he doesn't give a crap about superman being the all american hero or the truth justice nonsense it doesn't appeal to him or make any sense
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  14. #14
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    I remember a spot in the Doomsday movie where Superman was rescuing Lois and as a result an entire building was crushed. That was the moment I didnt like Lois anymore (although her clearly not liking Clark in the Reeve movies until she knew he was superman was close) She presumably got hundreds of people in that building killed cuz she did the opposite of what she was told, and ran TOWARDS the battle with the killer monster. What a blankey blank I thought as I watched.

  15. #15
    Senior Member adkal's Avatar
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    Which people does Diana find it difficult to fit in with? Regular humans? Generally, she's fine with the other Amazons (sure, there's some forced strife now and then but generally she's fine).

    Thing is, a lot of people have social difficulties or discomforts and various points of their lives, but they don't (usually) let that define them. An extreme example is a girl I know who, over the years, has had to have a series of reconstructive surgeries on her face after a horrific accident when she was a baby. She's never let that hold her back, though, and has set her sights on becoming a doctor. She's always in a lot of pain, but you wouldn't know it.

    There's nothing wrong with being a bit of an outsider.

    There's nothing wrong with feeling a little out of place.

    It's something everyone goes through, but it's wrong for someone to be defined by it.

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