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  1. #1
    Mild-Mannered Reporter
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    Default REVIEW: Young Avengers, #3

    In "Young Avengers" #3 by Kieron Gillen and Jamie McKelvie, the cast comes together more as Miss America Chavez flies into Asgardia and Loki
    has a new scheme to break Wiccan's spell.


    Full review here.

  2. #2
    Senior Member 1derer's Avatar
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    A solid review, and I'd also give it four stars.

    I agree that the ending was the weakest part of this issue, and I also think that the endings on both #1 and #2 have also been slightly weak.

    Gillen's overall story is very good, but I tend to get a perfunctory "and let's end the issue off with an oomph" feeling from the endings of his YA issues (this is not something I noticed from his other work). That, and the continued sidelining of Kate and Noh-Varr, are my main critiques of the book. I don't know if the latter is a negative for most people, but when I read it, it takes me out of the story. I feel the same way when a television show announces that a character won't be appearing in an episode by mentioning that they're off doing something else (e.g., "Daphne is off at fat camp.")
    Last edited by 1derer; 04-01-2013 at 08:46 AM.
    Primary pulls: X-Factor, Hawkeye, Young Avengers, Avengers Arena, X-Men: Legacy, Uncanny X-Force, FF, Archer and Armstrong

  3. #3
    Completely sauced... klinton's Avatar
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    I could never be a reviewer. I read the issue and saw America, Teddy and Billy being awesome, Loki being hilarious...and a buncha other stuff. Where the reviewer gets critical in the second part of the review: I can see what they're saying, but that was so over my head when I read the issue. :p

    Glad to see it's getting good reviews though! :D
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  4. #4
    BUY LOKI: AGENT OF ASGARD Kieran_Frost's Avatar
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    Great review, very well put; and I agree that the "weakest part" was the not-to-exciting cliffhanger. Kudos, Jennifer Cheung!
    "I don't know how to please you Lord, but I think the fact I try to please you, pleases you."

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    I dont know, I am used to slowly developing storylines, and have not problem so far regarding non appearance of characters and paced reveals and plot points. I would rather have fleshed out characters than KA-POW! and SKAAASH! on every page. Also I dont care if there is cliffhanger or not on the end of issues, I am enjoing it if I like the characters. As I said, complaints about drawing, ramming homosexuality on to readers, and pandering of all kind which boggs down the pace.

    Still, the best parts of the run for me now, the spread ( is it so called two fronting pages ) of the attack on Astro Boys fetish of a habitat, two pages of escaping from otherworldly prison, horryfingly broken down Theodore, who says that strawberys are his favorite, only thing that I liked of facial expressions, so sad, just want to hug him and help him overcome his sinfull desires... errr... batlle the interdimensional parasite, and hillarious humor and complexity of Kid Loki, which is realy a stellar find for me - favorite quipp two pictures about a stage name William should take.

  6. #6

    Default Thanks!

    Thanks for reading my review, everyone!

    Opus, it's not so much that I require or demand specifically a dramatic cliffhanger ending for every issue, as in that the ending itself felt weak in terms of plotting or originality, especially compared to most of the issue and also the other, stronger elements of Gillen's work on YA. Also, we probably have to agree to disagree, but I like the dynamic that Hulkling and Wiccan's relationship adds to YA, and I don't think their gayness is being "shoved" at readers any more than say, Miss America Chavez's ethnicity is being presented aggressively or only for token political purposes. I appreciate that you like and care about Teddy as a character despite apparently objecting to his sexuality. I also hope I haven't offended you with my own opinions; mostly, I'm glad you're reading and enjoying comics!

    Kieran_Frost, thanks for the compliment! I appreciate it.

    Klinton, I'm glad you weren't offended by the mild criticisms. Despite my nitpicks, I think Young Avengers is really good and I look forward to reading it every month now.

    Also, hi again, 1derer! I'm glad you are also enjoying YA as well as Hawkeye (and Archer and Armstrong!). I would also like to see more of Kate and Noh-Varr too (the opening sequence of YA #1 was awesome), but I assume and hope that Gillen will tend to that shortly.

  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jennifer_Cheng View Post
    Opus, it's not so much that I require or demand specifically a dramatic cliffhanger ending for every issue, as in that the ending itself felt weak in terms of plotting or originality, especially compared to most of the issue and also the other, stronger elements of Gillen's work on YA. Also, we probably have to agree to disagree, but I like the dynamic that Hulkling and Wiccan's relationship adds to YA, and I don't think their gayness is being "shoved" at readers any more than say, Miss America Chavez's ethnicity is being presented aggressively or only for token political purposes. I appreciate that you like and care about Teddy as a character despite apparently objecting to his sexuality. I also hope I haven't offended you with my own opinions; mostly, I'm glad you're reading and enjoying comics!
    I am sorry, english is not my language. I wrote about the cliffhanger ending because, I understood your point, but am making a presumption that a cliffhanger ending for whatever reason is the norm in american comics, being serialized and all. In these kind of stories that go on for several issues, I understand authors need to make readers interested what will happen next, and are forced to make whatever suspensfull finish, to make them buy the next issue. And sometimes they are apt to chose whaterwer they can. So I am saying that you are right if you think it is weak ending, but I mostly am interested in the characters as long they remain fleshed out and interesting as they are now, and the events are interesting. So they could easily heve ended the issue with four of them sitting and drinking whatever Magnum is, I would want to see what is in store further.

    We will have to settle for agreeing that we dissagree, I wrote in the some other thread about my issues of William and Theodore's relationship and why I feel it is both shoved and pandering to certain audiences, as well as aletrnative parental unit of America's. Glad that the authors are not turning these characters in the soapboxes for some agenda, as happened in Glee. For Theodore I feel that he is wronged upon by the writer.

    Previously, in Children Crusade they assassinated my favorite characters, wheter actually ( Casey and Vision 2.0 ) or in character ( Kang 1.0 and Eli ). So I got to care for those that remained. Here in the first issue, I cringed when Theodore gives his explanations, for the decision to draw him as crying. It felt that it made him less of a man and more of a boy. His word were not of some crybaby, but of a mature man, who is avare of his responsebilities, brave and willing to pursue them, even at the odds of his enormous personal loss and sacrifice ( I dont know if anyone remembers this but he is in fact a Prince of two worlds, though for those who read it, I wonder how is Super Skrull enjoing that role now) and the only person who could understand him, is acting as a spoiled brat. For some reason Theodore is written as a punching bag, bad things are constantly happening to him, and yet he is always supportive and caring and ready to help, and mature beyond his age, maybe because of his alien origin. I think the writers should be careful, for William is hardly at par with him, and more of a little kid, immature and thoughtless. Here is an idea: Glee crossover: Theodore gets with Blaine!

    I am hardly going to be offended by anything, as am a self proffesed racist, homophobe, technophobe, and have heard and been written to some pretty imaginative insults, when stating my opinions. So, there is nothing to worry. And thank you for giving your time for reading opinions upon your article, and taking effort to review the book with carefull eye and open mind, though I might not agree as for what you concluded in it.

  8. #8
    Junior Member RobertoDaCosta's Avatar
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    Seriously, am i the only one around here who doesn't watch Game of Thrones and had no idea what they r taling about?
    that was a big let-down for me..
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  9. #9
    BUY LOKI: AGENT OF ASGARD Kieran_Frost's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by RobertoDaCosta View Post
    Seriously, am i the only one around here who doesn't watch Game of Thrones and had no idea what they r taling about?
    that was a big let-down for me..
    Anyone could get the concept of that moment, even if they don't watch the show.
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  10. #10
    Senior Member PretenderNX01's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kieran_Frost View Post
    Anyone could get the concept of that moment, even if they don't watch the show.
    I happen to love the series but sometimes you get a wee defensive in apologizing for the occasional flaw.

    The GoT was a little too obscure for me and only made better when the talkback threads explained who they were. It's not like referencing Wizard of Oz or something.
    I feel like he could have tossed in a few descriptions of character type, just saying "I'm so-and-so" with no explanation as to why was a little much.

    Loki:I'm so-and-so
    MAC: Whaaaaa?
    Teddy: you think you're like a whatever who does something?

    Or at least start the letters column with a not to people who don't watch Game of Thrones: "For those of you who don't get it, Loki was saying..."

    Actually that's basically been my only complaint of the series really.

  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by PretenderNX01 View Post
    I happen to love the series but sometimes you get a wee defensive in apologizing for the occasional flaw. .
    This series HAS NO FLAWS!!!!

    Quote Originally Posted by PretenderNX01 View Post
    The GoT was a little too obscure for me and only made better when the talkback threads explained who they were. It's not like referencing Wizard of Oz or something.
    I feel like he could have tossed in a few descriptions of character type, just saying "I'm so-and-so" with no explanation as to why was a little much.
    I disagree. I hope I don't come off as too aggressive But I don't agree it needed to be explained; the joke works because Loki picks the most popular character of a well-known show and, in trying to relate to "the youth", says he's him. Yes, knowing the double-wording Lannisters makes it juicy, but the frame of the joke works (at-least enough that the the complaints of "I don't get it, worst series ever" shouldn't been given much attention - certainly not as much as it has been). We all have enough intelligence to work out what the joke was, even IF we don't know the show.
    "Who's your favourite character in Bubble Gum Fairy Kingdom?"
    "Glitterlash"
    "Glitterlash"
    "I'm Glitterlash!"

    Clearly Glitterlash is the most popular character, since BOTH people say his name. Then saying "I'm Glitterlash" followed by a glare, makes the joke. It didn't need explaining; and merely gave a little extra joy to those who watch the show (which is a lot of people, by the way!); it's not like Loki asked who their favourite character is in Vicious. Game of Thrones is a very topical, modern, popular show.

    No matter what show he referenced, SOMEONE wouldn't get it (there is no show we all watch); but referencing THE main current fantasy T.V show to superhero comic fans (to me) should require no explanation. If someone didn't get the Sound of Music reference in Avengers: Children's Crusade, would so many defend it as "should have explained it more"? Of course not, but why the double standard? I would assume more superhero comic fans have seen Game of Throne (a fantasy T.V. show; since sci-fi and fantasy go hand-in-hand) than the Sound of Music (a musical from the 60's). Does Lord of the Rings require detailed explanation when referenced to comic fans?

    And GOD, you are right... I do sound aggressive. Sorry. :( I'm not angry... just passionate! :D
    Last edited by Kieran_Frost; 06-26-2013 at 02:54 AM.
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  12. #12
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    The joke is a little weird, because in the books Tyrion's in a very different place than he's in the Tv show while the issue came out (guessing from the reactions Loki got). Loki might have been ironic, but that kinda clashes with the whole trying to connect via pop culture thing.

  13. #13
    BUY LOKI: AGENT OF ASGARD Kieran_Frost's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bland View Post
    The joke is a little weird, because in the books Tyrion's in a very different place than he's in the Tv show while the issue came out (guessing from the reactions Loki got). Loki might have been ironic, but that kinda clashes with the whole trying to connect via pop culture thing.
    I assume it was a reference to the series, not the books. How is he different in the book? (DON'T SPOIL FUTURE PLOTS *waves fist* )
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  14. #14
    Senior Member PretenderNX01's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kieran_Frost View Post
    "Who's your favourite character in Bubble Gum Fairy Kingdom?"
    "Glitterlash"
    "Glitterlash"
    "I'm Glitterlash!"

    Clearly Glitterlash is the most popular character, since BOTH people say his name. Then saying "I'm Glitterlash" followed by a glare, makes the joke.
    But the reader doesn't know if the kids are glaring because Loki is grudgingly right in declaring himself Glitterlash or wrong.
    It still doesn't work for me.

    Quote Originally Posted by Kieran_Frost View Post
    It didn't need explaining; and merely gave a little extra joy to those who watch the show (which is a lot of people, by the way!); it's not like Loki asked who their favourite character is in Vicious. Game of Thrones is a very topical, modern, popular show.
    To you. Because you watch it, you have a bias in thinking everyone's heard of it an no one is at a disadvantage in reading a reference to it in a comic book. It's like a version of "white privilege" only it's "Game of Thrones fan privilege". LOL

    5 Million people watch GoT, some 10 million watch America's Got Talent- if Loki declared himself to be the Howie Mandel I would still expect some sort of explanation with it.

    No matter what show he referenced, SOMEONE wouldn't get it (there is no show we all watch); but referencing THE main current fantasy T.V show to superhero comic fans (to me) should require no explanation.
    But there are some references that are more universal.

    If someone didn't get the Sound of Music reference in Avengers: Children's Crusade, would so many defend it as "should have explained it more"? Of course not, but why the double standard? I would assume more superhero comic fans have seen Game of Throne (a fantasy T.V. show; since sci-fi and fantasy go hand-in-hand) than the Sound of Music (a musical from the 60's). Does Lord of the Rings require detailed explanation when referenced to comic fans?
    I would say more people in general (and in fandom) have seen Sound of Music than GoT, like hundreds of millions versus 5 million. And Sound of Music transcends genre, which YA and superheroes do as well. We wouldn't be having this discussion if all capes fans watched all swords and sorcery.

    And frankly, a series like YA is going to have many gay fans who probably know their musicals more than some HBO naked-girls-and-dragons show.

    I'll have to go back a re-read YA:CC to see but if it didn't get complaints from people who never saw SoM, then it may have been presented better. Of course the whole series got criticized so it may not be the best example.

    And depending on what aspect of Lord of the rings is presented, it may too need an explanation. Mind you LotR made hundreds of millions off of more than 5 million viewers ;)
    Still, I know a Gandalf and a Frodo but I wouldn't know why Loki chose one over the other. Especially if Loki chose a character who isn't the star but rather chose some favorite. "I'm the Kate Blanchet elf". What?

    Quote Originally Posted by Kieran_Frost View Post
    I assume it was a reference to the series, not the books. How is he different in the book?
    You mean not everyone reads the books? I assume everyone read the books first, it's the popular book series. LOL. Hmm and you can't tell which is being referenced?

    No worries about being passionate, but once in a while all awesome things have a slip-up. It doesn't make them less awesome over all.
    Last edited by PretenderNX01; 06-26-2013 at 04:07 PM.

  15. #15
    BUY LOKI: AGENT OF ASGARD Kieran_Frost's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by PretenderNX01 View Post
    But the reader doesn't know if the kids are glaring because Loki is grudgingly right in declaring himself Glitterlash or wrong.
    BOW BEFORE GLITTERLASH!!!!

    Quote Originally Posted by PretenderNX01 View Post
    To you. Because you watch it, you have a bias in thinking everyone's heard of it an no one is at a disadvantage in reading a reference to it in a comic book.
    5 Million people watch GoT, some 10 million watch America's Got Talent- if Loki declared himself to be the Howie Mandel I would still expect some sort of explanation with it.
    Your numbers seem very off. According to HBO, the second season of Game of Thrones had an average gross audience (including all repeats and on-demand viewings) of 11.6 million viewers. This isn't even taking into account of the 3.9 million illegal downloads (which made it the most pirated show of 2012... by a HUGE margin). This is not some cult sci-fi show, this is THE most watched sci-fi/fantasy show currently on T.V. in the world.

    Quote Originally Posted by PretenderNX01 View Post
    I would say more people in general (and in fandom) have seen Sound of Music than GoT, like hundreds of millions versus 5 million. And Sound of Music transcends genre, which YA and superheroes do as well. We wouldn't be having this discussion if all capes fans watched all swords and sorcery.
    The Sound of Music doesn't transcend genre... it's a musical, plain and simple.

    Quote Originally Posted by PretenderNX01 View Post
    And frankly, a series like YA is going to have many gay fans who probably know their musicals more than some HBO naked-girls-and-dragons show.
    Touché

    Quote Originally Posted by PretenderNX01 View Post
    I'll have to go back a re-read YA:CC to see but if it didn't get complaints from people who never saw SoM, then it may have been presented better.

    But... but... I don't get it. What's a vonTrapp? Where's the context... waaaaaaaaah, this series is horrible because one small in-joke went over my head, waaaaaaah! :P ;)

    Quote Originally Posted by PretenderNX01 View Post
    Of course the whole series got criticized so it may not be the best example.
    No it didn't; it got praised. The delays got criticized and the last issue got some complaints purely because of who they killed and who quit. Look back at the reviews, the first 7 issues (before deaths) got a lot of praise, it was only the delays people hated. :)
    Last edited by Kieran_Frost; 06-27-2013 at 06:26 AM.
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