I agree with you on Talia. What Morrison is doing to the character sucks but I disagree with you that it can't be changed. Morrison's Talia is not written in stone. This is the comic world where recon happens all the time. DC can and should recon Morrison's Talia in the not too distance future. My views on Talia is not going to change based on Morrison mischaracterization of her. I love Talia. I see her as a complex character. The dynamic potential between Ras, her, Batman and Damian are amazing to me and I was hoping Morrison would play on that. I see them as dark (Ras), dark grey (Talia), light grey (Damian) and white (Batman). Hopefully, someone in DC will see the potential and the rich story that can come from that. In the mean time, I have my head canon of them.Superhero Comics stretch the imaginations of the impossible beyond belief. When a favorite character passes on, we often wait for their inevitable return in anticipation or anger. The return of our favorite characters often happen due to circumstances that would cause our eyes to roll further than we ever thought possible into the back of our heads, but superhero comics create a world where we full embrace absurdity of the situation. Clearly death is not an obstacle, but there are some things characters may never overcome.
I love nearly everything about batman and the dynamics in his relationships and love interests are no exception. I love his relationship with Catwoman and I have loved in years long past his relationship with Talia. I loved this dynamic a bit more than the dynamic with Catwoman. I love redemption stories, I love stories where people overcome the life that was given to them, and someone like Talia overcoming her upbringing to do good always rang with me, it was a huge underdog story, and working with the disenfranchised I found it incredibly appealing because it put on a much larger scale, as superhuman comics often do, the struggles of going against your upbringing. Many in the realworld sometimes find this impossible, but Talia’s story always had a glimmer of hope. The events of Batman Inc of completely removed that hope, and have made Talia an irredeemable character and it tears me up inside because I loved the dynamic so much between her and Bruce.
Talia offered a dynamic that Catwoman didn’t have; while the modern Catwoman has been a thief with a conscience, Talia was the loyal daughter of an international Terrorist an upbringing that does not bode well if your placing bets on humanitarian of the year. Despite coming from two different moral backgrounds there was a genuine affection and respect that went beyond attraction between the two. Batman saw good in Talia and while Talia played up her role as a villain she also played up to her ability to do good.
There is an innate underlying tension between the two though that I loved about the relationship that is not found in Batman’s relationship with Catwoman, with catwoman her loyalties are to herself and batman, with Talia they were torn between Batman and her Father. A dynamic that can be found in real relationships throughout history, just rarely with the fate of millions in the balance. The tension could only last for so long for readers as Talia would too often help Batman and Betray her father. While Talia had a history of following her father’s orders she has also aided the JLA in stopping her father and helped Superman take down Lex Luther while she was running Lexcorp on top of helping bats in the past. The status quo needs to change so here comes Death and the Maidens.
I always looked at Death and the Maidens as an unfinished story. At the end of it Batman loses, on all counts. Talia is brainwashed by her sister, kills her father, and renounces her Love for Batman with Batman tragically never knowing she was brainwashed. This story still left me with a lot of hope for Batman and Talia’s dynamic to spark up again, but as Nyssa’s story is played out its never addressed again.
I had hopes when Grant Morrison came on to Batman and we were introduced to Damien Wayne. Many of the atrocious acts Talia committed throughout much of Grant’s early run could still be attributed to Death of the Maidens in my mind but the events that have transpired in the latest volume of Batman Inc have dashed that idea. Talia has brainwashed a child army and cold heartedly killed people with no real reason other than to hurt batman and destroy him. Also Morrison’s life history of Talia never referenced Death of the Maidens and Implied she was always as insane or evil as her father. This is evil on a level that was never seen prior to Death and the Maidens with the character. I remember in a JLA story where Talia became upset with her father that he used her in an assassination plot, this is a long way from that Talia.
I called this a funeral of A Bruch/Talia Shipper because it pains me that after Morrison’s run we can never look at Talia as a redeemable character and now so soon after a reboot could never see her as a viable love interest again. Yes we have Damien Wayne who I believe will survive, but I can’t help but think of the potential of future stories where Damien would have been tempted between two parent’s that loved him or a story where Talia could be a romantic figure again with Damien still in the picture, but sadly those stories can’t happen because I cannot say I am a fan of the Bruce/Talia relationship when she is at Hitler levels of Evil and we can’t blame it on the Brainwashing.
What happened to the Bruce/Talia Dynamic is worse than death for someone who was a fan of that dynamic. Dead comicbook characters come back, but a relationship with batman cannot recover from mass murder, trying to kill your son, cloning Batman’s son and using said clone to kill Batman, and Brainwash children into killing cops. This is worse than death. Dead characters come back, this is something this dynamic can’t recover from and for me it stinks. Because what Morrison has done is told me the entire character was a psycho that planned on ruling the world all along and I can’t even read past stories with fondness
As a whole when it comes to Batman continuity this story makes little sense from Talia’s character perspective but in the confines of Grant Morrison’s history it works. With the exception of Hammering how evil Talia is, it is a well written story. But I can’t enjoy it because of the hope I had we would see another Batman Talia Romance in the Future and now it will never happen. Talia isn’t as popular as Magneto to be able to recover from something like this.
I miss the days where comics had hope for a brighter future. This series is ending where even if Damien Wayne lives there is no Happy ending, because the villain is a woman who was one of Batman’s great love interest and Damien’s mother. The story ends with a kid being rejected by his mom and the reveal she had always been evil and it really sucks for me this comic no matter what ends on a bad note, with no chance for redemption part of what drew me so much to the Talia Dynamic in the first place.
I’ve always been fascinated with the side characters because we know batman will survive, and I always had hope Talia would rebound from Death and the maidens but I can’t continue to be a shipper for a relationship with hitler because there is no chance of redemption, this is worse than a character death, Death means their is hope for a return in comics, but is that true when a character becomes Hitler? Writers and Editors can write about a man who can fly, resurrection, mortals beating Gods, and Batman ultimately defeating Leviathan; but the idea that anyone can be redeemed and overcome evil in their hearts? That is something no writer or editor feels they can do or fans will allow. I haven’t read my last batman comic, but I have read my last issue of batman inc because hope is missing in this comic, why read a story when hope is lost and I have to accept Batman and Damien had lost from the beginning.
I hope there could be a comicbook way to explain away what happened with Talia and would like to see a great Batman/Talia Love dynamic in the future, but in regards of that happening in the pages of main bat books, I might as well believe the Red Skull will fight to end genocide and prejudice and that feels pretty sick. I can't root for Hitler Just no way. You Suck DC this is way worse than a character death, no one can survive a rebranding like this.