Thunderbolts #4 *Spoilers*

**Damage** · 02-10-2013, 02:22 PM

Originally Posted by Bionder

I have been re-reading in the last days PunisherMax (Aaron's run) with Dillon's art and i can tell that besides his art he can draw good action sequences for many panels. So i assume that the lack of action fluidity is Way's fault he is the man who builds all the action.

And I've been re-reading Marvel Knights Punisher and Punisher War Zone Vol.2, and I'm sure that Dillon did a much better job in those books than the job he is doing in this one. I don't know what's going on, maybe he is not eager to work on this book.

**IndigoMX9** · 02-10-2013, 03:46 PM

Originally Posted by scouse mouse

What I have noticed is that there are lots of large, sparsely filled panels on each page. I think you are right in that Way's scripts don't really give Dillon much to work with as he seems to scripting the action 'off panel'!

The reader has to assume a lot of what transpired and that's the biggest problem with this book. I really want this book to succeed, but when it was announced a lot of fans loved the idea of the characters coming together, but they wouldn't touch the book because of the creative team and I totally understand that now. I hope things turn around.

**TsaiMeLemoni** · 02-10-2013, 06:04 PM

^ We can only hope that Noto will bring in some people. Also that things improve of course!

**Bionder** · 02-10-2013, 10:45 PM

Originally Posted by Damage

And I've been re-reading Marvel Knights Punisher and Punisher War Zone Vol.2, and I'm sure that Dillon did a much better job in those books than the job he is doing in this one. I don't know what's going on, maybe he is not eager to work on this book.

If he didn't wanted to work in this book he wouldn't accepted, i guess. Like i said before i think the main problem is the script, he didn't loose the "talent", the writer has to build all the action scenes the artist has to draw them to the "paper". So, if there is something missing here, i don't believe it's Dillon's due to his work all these years on the Punisher.

This is the only title with Punisher in it, i don't like the idea with him to work with others but i want this to be succeeded.

**Candid Rook** · 02-11-2013, 08:54 AM

Originally Posted by Bionder

If he didn't wanted to work in this book he wouldn't accepted, i guess. Like i said before i think the main problem is the script, he didn't loose the "talent", the writer has to build all the action scenes the artist has to draw them to the "paper". So, if there is something missing here, i don't believe it's Dillon's due to his work all these years on the Punisher.

I totally agree. Anyone who has a problem with the way the action scenes have been executed so far should be laying the blame at Way's feet, not Dillons. Have to say that this was an entertaining enough issue. The landmine thing was a bit silly but, as Bionder pointed out, its a comic book. I've read worse. We can just take it that the super duper chest plate and madmans body contained the blast in some way which protected his face and legs. That aside, this was much better than the previous 2 issues. Hopefully things keep improving.

**Candid Rook** · 02-11-2013, 09:04 AM

Originally Posted by scouse mouse

I enjoyed this issue as well. It's nice that we are getting some back story as to what gas been going on in Kata Jaya. The Punisher scene was cool and I'm also wondering if the blonde soldier with the young General Awa could possibly be Thunderbolt Ross? It would give extra depth to his reasons for wanting to free the Kata Jayans from their dictatorship! I am more than ready for Phil Noto to take over the art chores now though!

No, pretty sure that was the CIA contact that recruited him.

**Candid Rook** · 02-11-2013, 09:29 AM

Originally Posted by TsaiMeLemoni

^ We can only hope that Noto will bring in some people. Also that things improve of course!

Yeah, lets not lose sight of the fact that, Noto coming on board or not, things have to drastically improve on the scripting front. Its only saving grace so far has been a decent portrayal of Punisher and Deadpool. Can't really comment on Elektra, though I am finding it silly that she has been captured for 2 weeks and has only met Madman and General Awa in the last couple of issues.

**scouse mouse** · 02-11-2013, 09:50 AM

Originally Posted by Candid Rook

No, pretty sure that was the CIA contact that recruited him.

I meant the soldier on Kata Jaya who asks Awa why he has all the locals digging extra holes, which apparently were going to be their graves.

**Candid Rook** · 02-11-2013, 10:01 AM

Originally Posted by scouse mouse

I meant the soldier on Kata Jaya who asks Awa why he has all the locals digging extra holes, which apparently were going to be their graves.

Yeah. I thought that was the same guy. Even if it isn't it seems clear from the dialogue he is CIA, not airforce.

**million_suns** · 02-11-2013, 12:21 PM

I'm getting through the series, but I agree with others here. It all feels a bit broken up and well, action-lite at the moment. Way still seems to be finding his voice with some characters, and I've never liked Steve Dillon's art - it kept me from Jason Aaron's PunisherMAX for a long long time, until I just sort of read around it. I'll see this arc out, and take a look at the next story, with the new artist, see how that flies.
Mainly reading this because of the Punisher aspect, and because I am, due to the brilliance of Jeff Parker, a confirmed Rulkamaniac.

**Damage** · 02-11-2013, 03:40 PM

Originally Posted by Bionder

If he didn't wanted to work in this book he wouldn't accepted, i guess. Like i said before i think the main problem is the script, he didn't loose the "talent", the writer has to build all the action scenes the artist has to draw them to the "paper". So, if there is something missing here, i don't believe it's Dillon's due to his work all these years on the Punisher.

This is the only title with Punisher in it, i don't like the idea with him to work with others but i want this to be succeeded.

Yeah, maybe I'm being a little harsh on Dillon. I agree that Way's storytelling has not been too consistent, with continuous flashbacks and choppy action scenes. The story is not bad, but the problem is the way in which he narrates it.
Moreover, it would also be interesting to see more of some other characters that have been a little apart until now, like Elektra and Venom. Way seems to be treating the Punisher with respect, I think he tries to emulate the characterization that Garth Ennis made of the character. Hopefully with the incorporation of Noto and the arrival of the second story arc, things will start to take off.

**IndigoMX9** · 02-11-2013, 05:26 PM

I just saw this review of #4 http://www.ign.com/articles/2013/02/...bolts-4-review

The series marks a step down for every character involved (including Elektra, who wasn't even doing anything in the months prior to Marvel NOW!). Red Hulk lacks the strong characterization he enjoyed in Jeff Parker's Hulk series. The same goes for Frank Castle and Greg Rucka's Punisher, Flash Thompson and Rick Remender's Venom/Secret Avengers, and so on. Characterization of any sort is at a minimum, but the action and plot are never compelling enough to make up for that shortfall.

He said everything that we've been saying. Why couldn't Jeff Parker, Greg Rucka or Rick Remender work on this book? I hope things turn around fast.

**XxSnakeProxX** · 02-11-2013, 05:42 PM

Yup I enjoyed #4 as well. I thought #1 was pretty good, then 2 and 3 left me bored and wondering if this story had any real point beside getting these guys together in one book. Finally, #4 feels like its hitting its stride. But honestly, I cant wait until Dillon is off. I like his art at first glimpse, but he is terrible at capturing any action or motion. It all comes across as flat and boring.