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  1. #16
    Senior Member Bookem Danno's Avatar
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    This was an enjoyable read even if the Avengers DID look incompetantly bad, though, to make Frank look good.

    Spider-man's joke about getting her name right was funny - but upon reconsideration it's curious how he knew that was a quirk of hers.

    Cap was NOT funny. I didn't like his portrayal. What kind of planning and character analysis is he content with here? He sent in Thor to give a Marine a pep talk to do the honorable thing and break Rachel out of jail? Huh? Then he praises Punisher(the fugitive)'s loyalties anticipating he will break the law. Then he misjudges horribly what number and what specific Avengers (from the much bigger lineup) to call in for this stake out (better suited for the Secret Avengers). He sidelines Iron Man for being bullet-proof. Huh? He is only miffed for Wolverine's alleged insubordination. Huh? And as mentioned above leaving ONLY Spidey to guard a virtually unguarded Rachel at the courthouse. Huh? Terrible strategizing by him yet again. No wonder it's taking him longer than a year to get to Zola.

  2. #17
    disgruntled at best renne's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bookem Danno View Post
    Spider-man's joke about getting her name right was funny - but upon reconsideration it's curious how he knew that was a quirk of hers.
    well he did work with her during the omega drive crossover. it's possible he learned then.

    He sent in Thor to give a Marine a pep talk to do the honorable thing and break Rachel out of jail?
    i might be wrong here, but wasn't the pep talk about doing the right thing and turning himself in, and not actually about breaking rachel out of jail?

  3. #18
    Veteran Member Hypestyle's Avatar
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    I've been avoiding this mini because I was skeptical of the idea of Frank being basically portrayed (again) as an unhinged maniac and from there being manhandled by all of the metas for the sake of being able to declare "once and for all" that his style of justice isn't acceptable. So I don't know, I guess I may pick up the TPB, we'll see.

  4. #19
    Senior Member Captain Craig's Avatar
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    Not unhinged.
    Rucka's Punisher is the dedicated, calculating, methodical version---the boogeyman of the streets who appears when he's ready for you to see him.
    Which is what happens here. You don't see Frank until he's ready to play his trump card. In this case Spidey literally doesn't know he's been played until it's too late.
    "Freedom is the Right of ALL Sentient Beings" - Optimus Prime
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  5. #20

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    Quote Originally Posted by Hypestyle View Post
    I've been avoiding this mini because I was skeptical of the idea of Frank being basically portrayed (again) as an unhinged maniac and from there being manhandled by all of the metas for the sake of being able to declare "once and for all" that his style of justice isn't acceptable. So I don't know, I guess I may pick up the TPB, we'll see.
    I don't know why you would assume that. If you have been reading rucka's run up until now you would know it was always important to Rucka to show that frank wasn't an unhinged maniac. That he was fully responsible for and aware of his actions and their consequences.
    Last edited by Candid Rook; 02-02-2013 at 05:44 AM.

  6. #21

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    Quote Originally Posted by Bookem Danno View Post
    This was an enjoyable read even if the Avengers DID look incompetantly bad, though, to make Frank look good.

    Spider-man's joke about getting her name right was funny - but upon reconsideration it's curious how he knew that was a quirk of hers.

    Cap was NOT funny. I didn't like his portrayal. What kind of planning and character analysis is he content with here? He sent in Thor to give a Marine a pep talk to do the honorable thing and break Rachel out of jail? Huh? Then he praises Punisher(the fugitive)'s loyalties anticipating he will break the law. Then he misjudges horribly what number and what specific Avengers (from the much bigger lineup) to call in for this stake out (better suited for the Secret Avengers). He sidelines Iron Man for being bullet-proof. Huh? He is only miffed for Wolverine's alleged insubordination. Huh? And as mentioned above leaving ONLY Spidey to guard a virtually unguarded Rachel at the courthouse. Huh? Terrible strategizing by him yet again. No wonder it's taking him longer than a year to get to Zola.
    How did the Avengers look incompetently bad? Just because they fell for Frank's decoy? In story it made sense and shows that frank was tactically smarter than they thought, which fits his character. Didn't think Rucka showed cap as dumb either. He was just outplayed in this instance. He actually left Spidey AND iron man to guard Rachel. His bulletproof comment was referring to why he wanted iron man to stay back with Rachel.

    If anything last issue made them seem dumber, since Thor actually had frank and, instead of bringing him back, just let him go so they could pull this decoy nonsense. Thinking about that, it has actually taken the shine off the mini for me because its a major flaw in the plot. This issue just seems unnecessary in the context of the previous issue.
    Last edited by Candid Rook; 02-02-2013 at 08:12 AM.

  7. #22

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    Quote Originally Posted by Captain Craig View Post
    I can only do a pile on with the rest for praising this issue.

    What happened here, especially concerning Tony, was set up from the start. Tony has zero respect for Frank. He alluded to as much by even dismissing they should be discussing him. I also thought it to be an understood that Frank took out Tony outside the suit. Inside the suit would've necessitated not only a fight but it would've alerted the others most likely via some manner. Now I think what also is at a play is the lack of Logan AFTER Steve tells him "if I see you I'll assume your not working with us". I think it possible next issue reveals the unseen assistance Logan offered in some capacity.

    Black Widow walking us through how Frank would most likely get back into the country. Also, how she wanted it known Frank had his decoys in full body armor. Some respect there from her as well.
    Thor patrolling the skies. Spiderman caught totally off guard, which was great since he's been the most arrogant in this story.

    My only real plot hole is just how long had Frank, as IM been hiding behind the judge's bench? Did he know the location before, like when he took out Tony, and get there before the cops and Spidey? Even if he did I find it odd Spidey and/or the cops wouldn't have searched that courtroom first, before entering and setting up what they thought would be a trap. Other than that the issue only confirms how sad it'll be when Rucka's run concluded.

    Please let Rachel live, Please let Rachel live, Please let Rachel live.....and vanish into the MCU quietly for now.
    Frank wasn't playing hide and seek behind the Judges bench in an Iron Man suit. He was posing as Iron Man in plain sight. Iron Man was meant to be there with Spider-man guarding Rachel. Spider-man was expecting him to turn up. I can see why the art made that confusing though. It isn't too clear what is happening. Even with the dialogue telling the tale.
    Last edited by Candid Rook; 02-02-2013 at 08:34 AM.

  8. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hypestyle View Post
    I've been avoiding this mini because I was skeptical of the idea of Frank being basically portrayed (again) as an unhinged maniac and from there being manhandled by all of the metas for the sake of being able to declare "once and for all" that his style of justice isn't acceptable. So I don't know, I guess I may pick up the TPB, we'll see.
    Same here. Reading the posts as this story goes along makes this sound pretty epic, and clever. This is one case where spoilers can make you splurge.

  9. #24

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    This issue was just plain awesome


    I love it when frank out thinks his opponents

  10. #25
    Elder Member XPac's Avatar
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    I'll admit I don't really follow Iron Man these days... can just anyone put on his suit and work it now? I thought it was a bit more complcated than that.

    Still, as jobbing goes I don't think the Avengers ended up looking as bad as I frankly expected. When you read about a potential mis-match this extreme you kind of expect the worst. But it wasn't too bad at all. Not exactly the best showing for Earths Mighties Heroes, but you can't expect that in someone else's book. So overall I'm okay with it.

  11. #26
    Futurist Detective TonyStark1012's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by JET ACE LOGAN View Post
    This issue was just plain awesome


    I love it when frank out thinks his opponents
    Me too. Tony learned not to underestimate Frank the hard way. Usually people who do end up 6 feet deep! I don't think Frank gets anywhere the respect he deserves for his prep/planing/detective skills that other characters get. Also the Avengers weren't jobbed out. Frank does this kind of thing quite a bit. This isn't the first time he's fought people more powerful then him. The man is a warrior and a survivor.
    "That's not just "one man"! That's TONY FREAKING STARK. You're intel should've warned us that he was James Bond and "Q" wrapped in the same guy!" Cobra

  12. #27
    Junior Member Bionder's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by TonyStark1012 View Post
    Me too. Tony learned not to underestimate Frank the hard way.
    Don't know what exactly happened to Tony ( probably a big headache) but i would like to see that graphicaly.

  13. #28
    Senior Member Bookem Danno's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by TonyStark1012 View Post
    Me too. Tony learned not to underestimate Frank the hard way.
    Are you referring to a specific backissue? Have we ever seen Tony talking to Frank in-story yet?

  14. #29
    Junior Member Bionder's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bookem Danno View Post
    Are you referring to a specific backissue? Have we ever seen Tony talking to Frank in-story yet?
    If you check issue #1 and #4 you will see many quotes from Tony underestimating Frank. Only Cap and Logan give him a proper respect since the beggining.

  15. #30

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    Quote Originally Posted by XPac View Post
    I'll admit I don't really follow Iron Man these days... can just anyone put on his suit and work it now? I thought it was a bit more complcated than that.

    Still, as jobbing goes I don't think the Avengers ended up looking as bad as I frankly expected. When you read about a potential mis-match this extreme you kind of expect the worst. But it wasn't too bad at all. Not exactly the best showing for Earths Mighties Heroes, but you can't expect that in someone else's book. So overall I'm okay with it.
    I think it didn't come across as jobbing because it made sense. It wasn't as if Frank got Thor in a mystical armbar or knocked him out with a punch. He beat them by basically distracting them and avoiding the fight in the first place. He took a major player out when he was vulnerable to attack.


    As regards Tony's armour, if it was an Iron Man book Punisher would have been inescapably trapped inside it I'm sure. Since its a Punisher book and Greg already laid groundwork, showing bits of Iron Mans armour in Punishers workshop, lets assume Frank found a way of hacking the armour and getting past its defenses. He isn't a technological genius but he is an expert at gathering intel that would allow him to do that.

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