Page 6 of 8 FirstFirst ... 2345678 LastLast
Results 76 to 90 of 119
  1. #76

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Mr. Holmes View Post
    Yeah I think you have plenty to get over.
    Not really. I've read here where people refused to read Superman comics because they think the red trunks were stupid/childish.

    I'm just pointing out the FACT that the cape is the same thing.

    Sorry I'm ruining your personal Superman forum Mr. Holmes.

    Perhaps you can explain what the impetus would be for Superman to wear a bath towel/cape with his short sleeve tee shirt and put my mind to rest.

  2. #77
    Senior Member manduck37's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2012
    Posts
    1,010

    Default

    To me, the high collar on the costume just doesn't work. Coming at it from a character design perspective, the Nu52 costume has some big issues. Mainly that the costume is in conflict with what our new Superman is supposed to be all about. Not all elements of the costume are bad. The basics of Superman's costume are still there. The "S" didn't change all that much, it's still a blue suit, red cape, and red boots. The accent elements are what does it in for me. I'll break it down here, as to why the suit doesn't work for me.

    Our new Superman is a man of the people. He's all about protecting the little guy, the common person. He has a working class background. He's all about the working class people. He even set out to fight crime in jeans, work boots and a t-shirt. He's a blue collar guy. He grew up on a farm and came to the city to protect the little guy from corporate greed and corruption. It's all working class stuff in his mythos. He's more anit-establishment now. He's not friendly with the government or police. He'll do what needs to be done to protect people, establishment be damned. Nu52 Superman's concept was all workng class hero stuff. His entire origin is working class ideology.

    So we slap a costume on him that has a regal, noble, and militaristic style to it to really show that off. Wait, what? No, that's completely wrong. Superman is not a nobleman. He's not an aristocrat. He not a military man. He's never worked for the establishment, even in his secret identity. He's woking class in his secret identity and as Superman he fights for the working class. His suit needs to reflect that. In all honesty, the jeans and t-shirt look is perfect for what our new Superman is all about. A suit of ceremonial armor that looks regal and aristocratic is off base for the character. Good character design should always show you what the character is all about before you even see them spring into action. High collars, pointed sleves and thin angled belts present Superman as more of a hands off aristocrat than a hands on working man.

    The idea of making it "Ceremonial Armor" is pretty ridiculous too. Once again, by using the word "ceremonial" you're saying Superman is a hands off, sit back and watch kind of guy. Ceremony isn't about springing into action. If you have anyone in your family who is in a branch of the military, ask them about their ceremonial formalwear and what they wear in combat. It's a completely different uniform with a different purpose. My father is a Marine. If I asked him if he ever fought in his dress blues he's probably spend a good half hour to an hour explaining to me why I'm stupid. Ceremonail attire is not suited for combat. So why would Superman be wearing a non-functional suit of formal wear when he's a blue collar man of action? If he were going to wear something from Krypton, it's purpose would suit what he needs it for. Now, the suit does have it's uses. Things like changing to disguise him and being tough enough to handle what he does. Though it's the "ceremonial" part that bothers me. Ceremonial armor is never suited for combat. They should have just said it was Kryptonian armor and be done with it.

  3. #78
    It's Lexrules... GET HIM. Lexrules's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2012
    Posts
    5,827

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by manduck37 View Post
    To me, the high collar on the costume just doesn't work. Coming at it from a character design perspective, the Nu52 costume has some big issues. Mainly that the costume is in conflict with what our new Superman is supposed to be all about. Not all elements of the costume are bad. The basics of Superman's costume are still there. The "S" didn't change all that much, it's still a blue suit, red cape, and red boots. The accent elements are what does it in for me. I'll break it down here, as to why the suit doesn't work for me.

    Our new Superman is a man of the people. He's all about protecting the little guy, the common person. He has a working class background. He's all about the working class people. He even set out to fight crime in jeans, work boots and a t-shirt. He's a blue collar guy. He grew up on a farm and came to the city to protect the little guy from corporate greed and corruption. It's all working class stuff in his mythos. He's more anit-establishment now. He's not friendly with the government or police. He'll do what needs to be done to protect people, establishment be damned. Nu52 Superman's concept was all workng class hero stuff. His entire origin is working class ideology.

    So we slap a costume on him that has a regal, noble, and militaristic style to it to really show that off. Wait, what? No, that's completely wrong. Superman is not a nobleman. He's not an aristocrat. He not a military man. He's never worked for the establishment, even in his secret identity. He's woking class in his secret identity and as Superman he fights for the working class. His suit needs to reflect that. In all honesty, the jeans and t-shirt look is perfect for what our new Superman is all about. A suit of ceremonial armor that looks regal and aristocratic is off base for the character. Good character design should always show you what the character is all about before you even see them spring into action. High collars, pointed sleves and thin angled belts present Superman as more of a hands off aristocrat than a hands on working man.

    The idea of making it "Ceremonial Armor" is pretty ridiculous too. Once again, by using the word "ceremonial" you're saying Superman is a hands off, sit back and watch kind of guy. Ceremony isn't about springing into action. If you have anyone in your family who is in a branch of the military, ask them about their ceremonial formalwear and what they wear in combat. It's a completely different uniform with a different purpose. My father is a Marine. If I asked him if he ever fought in his dress blues he's probably spend a good half hour to an hour explaining to me why I'm stupid. Ceremonail attire is not suited for combat. So why would Superman be wearing a non-functional suit of formal wear when he's a blue collar man of action? If he were going to wear something from Krypton, it's purpose would suit what he needs it for. Now, the suit does have it's uses. Things like changing to disguise him and being tough enough to handle what he does. Though it's the "ceremonial" part that bothers me. Ceremonial armor is never suited for combat. They should have just said it was Kryptonian armor and be done with it.
    It's just plain stupid I agree. Taking the human element out of the suit sucks to no end. Taking The Kents away from that one vital part of his lore is wrong IMO. The suit was a symbol of both his worlds and the love he has for both.

  4. #79
    BANNED
    Join Date
    Nov 2012
    Posts
    1,004

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Lexrules View Post
    Sure but why the armor look. Still the stupidest idea this whole new suit is the fact that is a armor in nature. I know it might have gotten a little less slack if it had looked more like the Earth 2 Suit or even the Smallville suit. I could almost live without the trunk at this point but that damn collar and armor look with all those stupid lines REALLY needs to go NOW...
    The armor look looks cool. That's the reason and in a visual medium looking cool is essential for costumes. Superman running around in pjs his mother made him doesn't look cool.

  5. #80
    Senior Member Superlad93's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2012
    Posts
    2,547

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Lex Truthor View Post
    Nothing to get over, the cape is as stupid and useless as the trunks...

    Why would Superman in a world basically devoid of Superhero's, stuff a cape (bath towel) behind his short sleeve tee shirt?

    What would the rational purpose of THAT cape be?

    It doesn't work.
    In the new 52 he actually wore it with him where ever he would go because it was his "best friend" when he was a kid. It's been with him for as long as he can remember. It's just like the kid from Charlie Brown, Linus, it like a part of him. In issue 3 of Action comics he goes back for it even after being held captive and harmed.

    It also protected him during a time when he didn't really have the resistance he has now.

    Also he has small fragmented memories of his father and the people of Krypton wearing capes and armor so it wouldn't be a stretch to think that he was emulating what little he remembers of Krypton without even really knowing it.

    At this point in the new 52 it's the most important object in the world to Superman.

    So yes it had a story purpose (very important object to him etc) and a practical use that actually saved his life more than a few times (it's indestructible so he protected himself with it when he wasn't as strong.)

    Works just fine.

  6. #81

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Lex Truthor View Post
    Perhaps you can explain what the impetus would be for Superman to wear a bath towel/cape with his short sleeve tee shirt and put my mind to rest.
    It's indestructible and he had it at a time when he wasn't fully invulnerable. Seems pretty self-explanatory.

    EDIT: Oh, and all of Superlad's post.

    The main difference between trunks and the cape is that people think capes look cool and trunks look daft.

  7. #82
    Senior Member Superlad93's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2012
    Posts
    2,547

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by manduck37 View Post
    To me, the high collar on the costume just doesn't work. Coming at it from a character design perspective, the Nu52 costume has some big issues. Mainly that the costume is in conflict with what our new Superman is supposed to be all about. Not all elements of the costume are bad. The basics of Superman's costume are still there. The "S" didn't change all that much, it's still a blue suit, red cape, and red boots. The accent elements are what does it in for me. I'll break it down here, as to why the suit doesn't work for me.

    Our new Superman is a man of the people. He's all about protecting the little guy, the common person. He has a working class background. He's all about the working class people. He even set out to fight crime in jeans, work boots and a t-shirt. He's a blue collar guy. He grew up on a farm and came to the city to protect the little guy from corporate greed and corruption. It's all working class stuff in his mythos. He's more anit-establishment now. He's not friendly with the government or police. He'll do what needs to be done to protect people, establishment be damned. Nu52 Superman's concept was all workng class hero stuff. His entire origin is working class ideology.

    So we slap a costume on him that has a regal, noble, and militaristic style to it to really show that off. Wait, what? No, that's completely wrong. Superman is not a nobleman. He's not an aristocrat. He not a military man. He's never worked for the establishment, even in his secret identity. He's woking class in his secret identity and as Superman he fights for the working class. His suit needs to reflect that. In all honesty, the jeans and t-shirt look is perfect for what our new Superman is all about. A suit of ceremonial armor that looks regal and aristocratic is off base for the character. Good character design should always show you what the character is all about before you even see them spring into action. High collars, pointed sleves and thin angled belts present Superman as more of a hands off aristocrat than a hands on working man.

    The idea of making it "Ceremonial Armor" is pretty ridiculous too. Once again, by using the word "ceremonial" you're saying Superman is a hands off, sit back and watch kind of guy. Ceremony isn't about springing into action. If you have anyone in your family who is in a branch of the military, ask them about their ceremonial formalwear and what they wear in combat. It's a completely different uniform with a different purpose. My father is a Marine. If I asked him if he ever fought in his dress blues he's probably spend a good half hour to an hour explaining to me why I'm stupid. Ceremonail attire is not suited for combat. So why would Superman be wearing a non-functional suit of formal wear when he's a blue collar man of action? If he were going to wear something from Krypton, it's purpose would suit what he needs it for. Now, the suit does have it's uses. Things like changing to disguise him and being tough enough to handle what he does. Though it's the "ceremonial" part that bothers me. Ceremonial armor is never suited for combat. They should have just said it was Kryptonian armor and be done with it.

    The suit is a reflection of krypton and NOT Superman. Superman wears it out of respect (need at one point) and sentimentality. The man in the suit is what matters and what was trying to be said during the end of issue 8 of Action comics....."I'm still the same guy" says Superman.

    But for a what it's worth Superman agreed with what you were saying to an extent in the new 52. He flip flopped between suits; one for the people and one for when he fights the space monsters with the gods in the JL. He was very confused as to what he should be and do......man of the people or move on to godhood. He eventually had to see that this world was changing because of him and he needed to move forward to keep it going but he never lost where he came from.


    I keep saying in story it makes all the sense in the world but you can't be faulted if you just think it's ugly.

  8. #83
    It's Lexrules... GET HIM. Lexrules's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2012
    Posts
    5,827

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Aquacatlungfish View Post
    The armor look looks cool. That's the reason and in a visual medium looking cool is essential for costumes. Superman running around in pjs his mother made him doesn't look cool.
    If your mom made you PJ's you would be happy to wear them. Besides it was a gift from both worlds like I said. Armor is STUPID on Superman, He doesn't need it hence why he is called Superman. It is Earth's yellow sun that gives him his powers not the suit. You could have made this a Kryptonian cloth like in MOS instead of having every Kryptonian walk around in armor. These people must have never came out in the rain and most defiantly never came out in a lightning storm.

  9. #84
    BANNED
    Join Date
    Nov 2010
    Location
    The True North, strong and free!
    Posts
    2,061

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Conan The Barbarian View Post
    I think the suit will most likely evolve into this
    Classic boots return
    Collar goes
    Some of the lines will probably be gone as well

    I'd buy that for 50 years.

  10. #85
    Paladin Kurosawa's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2010
    Location
    344 Clinton St, Apt 3E
    Posts
    3,489

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Lex Truthor View Post
    Not really. I've read here where people refused to read Superman comics because they think the red trunks were stupid/childish.

    I'm just pointing out the FACT that the cape is the same thing.

    Sorry I'm ruining your personal Superman forum Mr. Holmes.

    Perhaps you can explain what the impetus would be for Superman to wear a bath towel/cape with his short sleeve tee shirt and put my mind to rest.
    I've never seen superheroes trip and fall over their trunks before. Capes have been ridiculed just as much as trunks, maybe more. Comic book nerds think capes are cool and are ashamed by trunks, to the general public they are both stupid and a subject of ridicule.

    Quote Originally Posted by manduck37 View Post
    To me, the high collar on the costume just doesn't work. Coming at it from a character design perspective, the Nu52 costume has some big issues. Mainly that the costume is in conflict with what our new Superman is supposed to be all about. Not all elements of the costume are bad. The basics of Superman's costume are still there. The "S" didn't change all that much, it's still a blue suit, red cape, and red boots. The accent elements are what does it in for me. I'll break it down here, as to why the suit doesn't work for me.

    Our new Superman is a man of the people. He's all about protecting the little guy, the common person. He has a working class background. He's all about the working class people. He even set out to fight crime in jeans, work boots and a t-shirt. He's a blue collar guy. He grew up on a farm and came to the city to protect the little guy from corporate greed and corruption. It's all working class stuff in his mythos. He's more anit-establishment now. He's not friendly with the government or police. He'll do what needs to be done to protect people, establishment be damned. Nu52 Superman's concept was all workng class hero stuff. His entire origin is working class ideology.

    So we slap a costume on him that has a regal, noble, and militaristic style to it to really show that off. Wait, what? No, that's completely wrong. Superman is not a nobleman. He's not an aristocrat. He not a military man. He's never worked for the establishment, even in his secret identity. He's woking class in his secret identity and as Superman he fights for the working class. His suit needs to reflect that. In all honesty, the jeans and t-shirt look is perfect for what our new Superman is all about. A suit of ceremonial armor that looks regal and aristocratic is off base for the character. Good character design should always show you what the character is all about before you even see them spring into action. High collars, pointed sleves and thin angled belts present Superman as more of a hands off aristocrat than a hands on working man.

    The idea of making it "Ceremonial Armor" is pretty ridiculous too. Once again, by using the word "ceremonial" you're saying Superman is a hands off, sit back and watch kind of guy. Ceremony isn't about springing into action. If you have anyone in your family who is in a branch of the military, ask them about their ceremonial formalwear and what they wear in combat. It's a completely different uniform with a different purpose. My father is a Marine. If I asked him if he ever fought in his dress blues he's probably spend a good half hour to an hour explaining to me why I'm stupid. Ceremonail attire is not suited for combat. So why would Superman be wearing a non-functional suit of formal wear when he's a blue collar man of action? If he were going to wear something from Krypton, it's purpose would suit what he needs it for. Now, the suit does have it's uses. Things like changing to disguise him and being tough enough to handle what he does. Though it's the "ceremonial" part that bothers me. Ceremonial armor is never suited for combat. They should have just said it was Kryptonian armor and be done with it.
    Awesome post. You completely get it. Even if they had to change the costume, the problem is the costume they designed didn't fit the character or the theme of the character, along with it being dated-not timeless like the classic but dated like Cable's costume or Cable himself. Plus, it is just an ugly as all hell design.

    Quote Originally Posted by Aquacatlungfish View Post
    The armor look looks cool. That's the reason and in a visual medium looking cool is essential for costumes. Superman running around in pjs his mother made him doesn't look cool.
    The armor is a terrible, terrible design and is not a costume worthy of the greatest icon of American pop culture ever.

    Quote Originally Posted by Lexrules View Post
    If your mom made you PJ's you would be happy to wear them. Besides it was a gift from both worlds like I said. Armor is STUPID on Superman, He doesn't need it hence why he is called Superman. It is Earth's yellow sun that gives him his powers not the suit. You could have made this a Kryptonian cloth like in MOS instead of having every Kryptonian walk around in armor. These people must have never came out in the rain and most defiantly never came out in a lightning storm.
    The fact that Martha made his costume from blankets that Lara wrapped him in is one of the beautiful aspects of the Superman myth. It's brilliant, the kind of brilliance that Bill Finger was known for.
    Last edited by Kurosawa; 01-28-2013 at 03:27 PM.
    Doomed Planet. Desperate Scientists. Last Hope. Kindly Couple.

  11. #86
    Inf‚me et fier de l'Ítre Auguste Dupin's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2011
    Posts
    5,105

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Kurosawa View Post
    I've never seen superheroes trip and fall over their trunks before. Capes have been ridiculed just as much as trunks, maybe more. Comic book nerds think capes are cool and are ashamed by trunks, to the general public they are both stupid and a subject of ridicule.
    Ho, come on, now, lots of people find capes cool. How many fantasy characters, or sci fi characters, wear capes for no practical purpose other than looking badass? You can graphically play with a cape. It can fall on your shoulders, flow with the wind, wrap yourself into it, throw it away with style to show that this time you're fighting seriously....What is graphically interesting with trunks? Nothing. There's nothing you can do with a trunk.
    "I'm going to paraphrase Nietzsche, when you judge a work, the work judges you."

  12. #87
    Veteran Member Sacred Knight's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2010
    Posts
    7,547

    Default

    The difference between the cape and the trunks is that the cape still serves an aesthetic appeal on the page, in regards to its appearance on a character in flight or simply whipping in the wind. The trunks doesn't have any such beneficial effect, hence why the fact they're no longer fashionable in modern culture hurts the appeal of using it anymore in costume design a hell of a lot more than the same fact hurts the idea of a cape. And even though they're not used as often as in the past, the idea that capes earn as much scorn as trunks is just grasping at straws. Everyone knows that's not true. Not everyone loves the idea of capes on superheroes anymore but no one can sit there and try to claim that they're considered as laughable a look as a pair of strongman trunks.

  13. #88
    BANNED
    Join Date
    Sep 2009
    Location
    221B Baker Street
    Posts
    18,005

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Lex Truthor View Post
    Not really. I've read here where people refused to read Superman comics because they think the red trunks were stupid/childish.

    I'm just pointing out the FACT that the cape is the same thing.
    Not sure you know what a "FACT" is.

    Sorry I'm ruining your personal Superman forum Mr. Holmes.
    Don't worry, you'd have to try harder.

    Perhaps you can explain what the impetus would be for Superman to wear a bath towel/cape with his short sleeve tee shirt and put my mind to rest.
    It's already been explained in-story. It's an alien, indestructible blanket he's had with him his entire life. What is the problem here?
    Last edited by Mr. Holmes; 01-28-2013 at 04:36 PM.

  14. #89
    Senior Member Coyote2010's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2012
    Posts
    1,940

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Kurosawa View Post
    I've never seen superheroes trip and fall over their trunks before. Capes have been ridiculed just as much as trunks, maybe more. Comic book nerds think capes are cool and are ashamed by trunks, to the general public they are both stupid and a subject of ridicule.



    Awesome post. You completely get it. Even if they had to change the costume, the problem is the costume they designed didn't fit the character or the theme of the character, along with it being dated-not timeless like the classic but dated like Cable's costume or Cable himself. Plus, it is just an ugly as all hell design.



    The armor is a terrible, terrible design and is not a costume worthy of the greatest icon of American pop culture ever.



    The fact that Martha made his costume from blankets that Lara wrapped him in is one of the beautiful aspects of the Superman myth. It's brilliant, the kind of brilliance that Bill Finger was known for.

    I love that connection of mother to mother, never made it, but it is Touching!

    I figure the Jethro/ Lil Abner Superman look is just what happens in a world where there was never Superheroes. He was inventing the idea. Instead of saying strong man he's saying working man. The cape, como dijo el Holmes, was the most indestructible substance on Earth and the only thing left from his parents.

    Seriously, tell me that tomorrow, Darwyn Cooke is bringing out the adventures of that Superman and I am there. With the Legion, vs. whoever, or even without. Sold American!

  15. #90
    Senior Member manduck37's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2012
    Posts
    1,010

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Superlad93 View Post
    The suit is a reflection of krypton and NOT Superman. Superman wears it out of respect (need at one point) and sentimentality. The man in the suit is what matters and what was trying to be said during the end of issue 8 of Action comics....."I'm still the same guy" says Superman.

    But for a what it's worth Superman agreed with what you were saying to an extent in the new 52. He flip flopped between suits; one for the people and one for when he fights the space monsters with the gods in the JL. He was very confused as to what he should be and do......man of the people or move on to godhood. He eventually had to see that this world was changing because of him and he needed to move forward to keep it going but he never lost where he came from.


    I keep saying in story it makes all the sense in the world but you can't be faulted if you just think it's ugly.
    Well just to clarify, I wasn't just talking about the in story aspects of the costume. I've actually enjoyed the explanation of the costume as seen in story (except the ceremonial stuff I mentioned). I'm talking about when Jim Lee sat down to design the suit primarily. As an artist and a character designer, you should make sure your design fits the concept. In this case, it sruck as being a bit off base. I do really enjoy young Superman wearing the cape for some extra protection or that the new suit is nanites that change as he needs them. There's some interesting and fun in story stuff. The look just needs to match the concepts better. And I did enjoy that Superman was wearing both costumes for a bit in Action.

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •