Justice League #16 Discussion/Spoilers

[Robotman4]

*sniff*
B-but William Magnus is supposed to be a good guy, not T.O. Morrow.
I don't think I could stand it if Goldrush turns out to be some kind of New 52 bronze-age Red Tornado.

I think Magnus and the Metal Men are still very much good guys. Morrow has always belittled him in the past. He was just being his normal old jealous self and taking sh!t about Will.

[Harbinger of Apocalypse]

Really good issue. Orm really did live up to his name as Ocean Master and loved his dual abilities of control of water and lightning. Plus, the way he trapped his foes in tornados of water was just visually quite nice. Another thing I liked was how alien the Atlantean army looked... their bodysuits, their mech walkers, just everything. And nice to see Tula... a drift assassin... very nice. But anyway, I had no problem with Orm winning and Superman had that awesome scene where he just vaporised the water to convince them to turn back. Batman was out for most of the issue I think, at least in terms of action sequences.

Anyway, loads of shoutouts there. Loved Red Tornado being linked to Morrow! Was worried he would be gone from Earth since a female version is shown in Earth-2. And Project: Metalmen? Cyborg got some great moments as well and loved the call for new Leaguers. Very nice to see Firestorm among the candidates as well since he's a character that has suffered a bit in the reboot due to shifting writers and all. Kind of hoping the character makes it into the League so Johns can write a cool Firestorm.

[Frank Fournier]

It was sustained so i Have no Problem. If it was just a shot of it she would have been able to shake it off but he kept raining it down on them till they were out.
Wonder Woman has always been extremely resistant to magic.

If only WW's bracelets were STILL working like that below:





"The special Amazon metal in my bracelets acts as a lightning rod - - attracting lightning without harm to me".

Oh well...



WW must be thinking during that sustained magical lightning:
"...forgot...to use...m-m-my...bracelets..."
OR
"...being...Zeus'...daughter?... U-u-useless..."

[Movieartman]

damn, Reis is like on a whole nother level man

[Conway]

The art was great, it was the scenes that actually had action that the writing got out of control though.

Anyone else a little mad that Nightwing wasn't on Cyborg's call list?

[Movieartman]

The art was great, it was the scenes that actually had action that the writing got out of control though.

Writing was Fantastic

[Namtab]

Anyone else a little mad that Nightwing wasn't on Cyborg's call list?

Maybe there was a reason for that...

The only thing that bugged me on that last page was that the colorist forgot (or didn't know) that New 52 Black Lightning's lightning is now actually black.

[DrSimonHurt]

i don't THINK goldrush is red tornado, i was sure they mentioned red tornado being a he...

i wonder if gold rush isn't a retooled lady luck(the white haired woman on the original promo art for justice league) as there seemed to be a massive amount of wealth linked to the character from what I remember. gold rush would be a fitting name i suppose?

I am so pleased that Vixen might get another shot. and also Zatanna instead of deadman as the JLD member is total win for me. i just hope some or all of the ladies stick around. its about time the testosterone levels decreased a bit around this title.

my guesses though is that after the arc, hawkman and GA leave(maybe one of them could be the traitor), Black Canary goes back to BoP, Zatanna to JLD, leaving us with element woman, firestorm, Goldrush, Vixen CM and Black Lightning, with the rest of the league. hey maybe they can get Mera to join up, thatd be cool!although the gender balance might be almost equal then, and we cant have that can we?

I'm thinking that the JLA and JL are actually the same team, at this point. JL just focuses on the founding members.

On that final page, you have the JL's new core team, with a few members appearing in JLA also.

[Conway]

Writing was Fantastic

I'll agree that the scenes with Cyborg had fantastic writing. It reminded me of last years Aquaman run, great stuff. "Throw [my lung] in the trash" is brilliant.

The scenes with Batman felt like another one of Johns' "Trash The Bat Show". The trinity getting taken out by a bolt of lightning was lazy... wait I meant laaaaaaaazzzzzzzzzyyyy. Orm was totally one dimensional and dull. And the "dialouge" was almost as bad as Batman DotF, okay maybe not that bad, but still oddly expositional. Arthur is the only person that felt in character, and his character is an emotional mess torn between two worlds, so the action scenes feel messy.

[DochaDocha]

The scenes with Batman felt like another one of Johns' "Trash The Bat Show". The trinity getting taken out by a bolt of lightning was lazy... wait I meant laaaaaaaazzzzzzzzzyyyy.

I had mixed feelings about how the 4 members were defeated. Lifting his trident in the air and summoning lightning did feel lazy, or at least it just seemed too easy. These are heavy hitters, I'd have hoped Orm would've had some sort of doomsday device that could overpower AM, SM, and WW in seconds. But, if those three were going down in 2-3 panels, then Batman has to go down in 1.

[LoneNecromancer]

So when Johns jobs Green Lantern (Bats swiping his ring, Supes breaking his chains with ease, WW smashing through the bubble with one strike) that's all fine and dandy, but the moment he does it to the Trinity that's unacceptable and just part of his vendetta against their characters.

[Conway]

So when Johns jobs Green Lantern (Bats swiping his ring, Supes breaking his chains with ease, WW smashing through the bubble with one strike) that's all fine and dandy, but the moment he does it to the Trinity that's unacceptable and just part of his vendetta against their characters.

Not a GL fan, but I see your point. I just feel that Batman is a ninja stealing a ring shouldn't be too tough, and his constructs are only as strong as his will so how easy it its for Supes or WW to break them would vary based on the story. But if I was a GL fan I would be annoyed too.

As for the lightning;
Bruce is always insulated against electricity and can redirect wherever he wants, or is wearing a talisman that defends against magic attacks.
Diana is the daughter of Zeus, the guy that throws the lightning, was trained by the God of War, and has special bracelets that can act as lightning rods.
Superman got shocked by nanobots from Krypton that knew how to cause him pain, Orm didn't even know who he was.

Also, Superman can squat the planet earth for 5 days straight while being out of the sun, but he can't take a punch from Aurthur's little brother? (I'll just skip over the whole Superman saving the nuclear sub from the bottom of the ocean but no one from Atlantis knowing about him.)

[Jabare]

The art was great, it was the scenes that actually had action that the writing got out of control though.

Anyone else a little mad that Nightwing wasn't on Cyborg's call list?

I don't know if Cyborg and Nightwing have even met. And I'm not sure Cyborg came up with the list on his own. It seems like members he and Batman if not the whole league were looking at. So Nightwing not being on the list might speak more to Batman than Cyborg. Also DC's against putting Nightwing on the Justice League with Batman. Jim Lee's essentially said so in two interviews.

[thepenguin]

Not a GL fan, but I see your point. I just feel that Batman is a ninja stealing a ring shouldn't be too tough, and his constructs are only as strong as his will so how easy it its for Supes or WW to break them would vary based on the story. But if I was a GL fan I would be annoyed too.

As for the lightning;
Bruce is always insulated against electricity and can redirect wherever he wants, or is wearing a talisman that defends against magic attacks.
Diana is the daughter of Zeus, the guy that throws the lightning, was trained by the God of War, and has special bracelets that can act as lightning rods.
Superman got shocked by nanobots from Krypton that knew how to cause him pain, Orm didn't even know who he was.

Also, Superman can squat the planet earth for 5 days straight while being out of the sun, but he can't take a punch from Aurthur's little brother? (I'll just skip over the whole Superman saving the nuclear sub from the bottom of the ocean but no one from Atlantis knowing about him.)

Batman has a magical talisman to help against magic? Now I have heard it all. Batman should have been dead many times over. But he gets a pass all the time. He's lucky he might still be around to fight another day.

Superman can take a punch dude. He proved he could. He was not taken out. So what are you saying is no one can hit him? Lifting weights has zero to do with taking a punch And Orm's trident is magical. It's not just lightning.

Daughter of Zeus...what does that have to do with it? Have we seen her in this new 52 control and manipulate lightning? The God Mode thing Azz tossed out ONCE might as well not be written because then she should have tossed her cuffs and beaten up Orm. She might even need two swords to even beat Orion. Thing is no one really knows WW's powers in the new 52. She keeps getting tinkered with by Gods in her own book. Least in JL we have some sense of consistency in her powers.

What's so hard in getting that the Atlanteans can be a force to be reckoned with and Orm is powerful? If nothing could happen to these guys then what's the point of a story and facing foes? And they all struggled with Darkseid. They never took him on in any sense of that word for those who wondering if this is the same team. It was a boom tube that saved them

[LordAllMighty]

I'm just happy Vixen and Black Canary are back to being "Justice League level" characters.

Agree, 100%