BATMAN #16 Review/Discussion/Spoilers

[Captain Jim]

I was enthusiastic about this arc but #16 just didn't grab me. Mainly, it is probably because I am not a fan of horror and this story is just becoming more and more a horror story

I take my hats off to Synder.
Brilliant! The Joker is truly scary

One has to remember that Snyder began as a horror writer. Personally, I like what he's doing here. The Joker had become too watered down over the years. In this storyline we're seeing a Joker who is truly crazy and truly scary.

[Emissary of Justice]

Even AFTER reading the issue, I can't get behind it. Part of the problem is that I just can't get behind Joker being a credible threat. After having seen Bruce, Dick, Tim, and to a lesser extent Barbara and Jason kick his ass so many times, it's hard to view his latest master plan as threatening. And now we're supposed to believe that somehow, in the span of Bruce going from the cave to Arkham, Joker has managed to defeat ALL of them?

This isn't like his past appearances though. He's going at them all on an extremely personal level and has taken them all out of their game, forcing them to play on his terms with a plan he's plotted out for at least an entire year. Snyder even further spells this out with Bruce's need to reach The Joker while he's not prepared for him to finally take the advantage. None of them have been able to confront him on their terms.

Well on page 2(of this thread) Tiberious has a great idea of what the punch line is. I personnally don't think the platter will have Alfreds head or face on it. It will have the Jokers.

Except the Joker's wearing his own face.

If Alfred is wearing the joker's face, then who attacked Alfred with the hammer?..

If Alfred's wearing the Joker's face, there was no physical attack. It was a mental breakdown with "the attack" taking place in Alfred's head.

I highly doubt that. It would make no sense because if it were Alfred's head or face or whatever why would Penguin and Two Face be so surprised like they were?

They don't give a shit about Alfred.

Not head, but face. Why surprised? Everyone the Joker's involved and targeted is noticing how personal he's making this. If it's Alfred's face on the platter, they'd shortly realize Bruce Wayne is Batman. In Gotham City, the public Bruce Wayne persona is Bill Gates and Paris Hilton rolled into one and Alfred's always with him.

Having no evidence that the Joker did the kidnapping means nothing; dude is a criminal god in this series. I think (and really hope) that Alfred was taken in the fashion we've already seen and there's no smoke and mirrors there.

Yes, it does. His appearance as "criminal god" has been through Batman's typical methods, being prepared. With Alfred's kidnapping, he merely appears behind him inside the house. For there to be not a shred of forensic evidence, nothing was out of place when there should be hairs and shoe marks.

[booyah]

Yes, it does. His appearance as "criminal god" has been through Batman's typical methods, being prepared. With Alfred's kidnapping, he merely appears behind him inside the house. For there to be not a shred of forensic evidence, nothing was out of place when there should be hairs and shoe marks.

Agree to disagree.

[Seattle Freeze]

One has to remember that Snyder began as a horror writer. Personally, I like what he's doing here. The Joker had become too watered down over the years. In this storyline we're seeing a Joker who is truly crazy and truly scary.

I understand Snyder's background but to me Joker can be dangerous and scary and original without being so grotesque. Was the tapestry of living bodies really scary or shocking? I don't think so. I think it was just disgusting and unnecessary.

Besides, just because he began as a horror writer doesn't mean he still has to write as one. Creative people often switch genres to try something different. Doesn't this show he is still a horror writer and can't be different?

[Batman9]

Everybody else think that 13 was the best of this arc too?

[NinjaMic]

Not even gonna lie, I enjoyed the backup more than the main story.

[HeroComplex]

Not even gonna lie, I enjoyed the backup more than the main story.

The backup was just a continuation of the main story?

[Batman9]

Back up was an exact continuation of the main story. So did Snyder tell Tynion to do the plate thing?

[infinitEEntropy]

The backup was just a continuation of the main story?

Yeah. They honestly could have just made it part of the main story.

Making it a "back up story" is just DC's way of justifing selling the book for 3.99 by saying that it is extra content.

[Vil_Dee]

The preview pages for Batman #17 have Bats and Joker fighting in a cave. . .is it. . . the batcave! dun dun duuuuuun!

I can see the whole batfamily folding their arms and going "so he couldn't have found the batcave, huh?"

[batman23]

Everybody else think that 13 was the best of this arc too?

I think it was issue 15 honestly.

Was the tapestry of living bodies really scary or shocking? I don't think so. I think it was just disgusting and unnecessary.

This. It's just trying too hard

[slowens]

Another mediocre issue of Batman that CBR lauding as a four and a half star book. This issue should have been called "Deus Ex Machina: The Comic".

After all it sure was convenient that Batman;
A) had his glowy red nickel(?) thing to stop Mr. Freeze with
B) fought freeze right before Clayface and had the foresight to take the Freeze Gun with him
C) was riding a horse (up stairs for some reason?) that could take a freeze blast to the face for him. Sidenote: Batman should be convicted of animal cruelty for punching a horse in the face only to hop on him and force him to take a freezing to the face.

Also, Bats was pretty certain that Joker or the other villains had no other way of hurting those hostages once he cut the power. He was ready to pull up a chair and wait till the cops came. It's not like four villains could possibly come up with a way to kill someone that didn't involve an electrified chainsaw. It's only when his own "family" was in trouble did Bats give a damn.

This issue really made me wonder how Snyder's Superman book will be. Is he going to invent a new power for Superman every time he can't figure out a way for Superman to beat a villain? Maybe he'll bring back the "Great Wall brick replacing vision" from "Superman IV". Or he"ll invent "Plot solving super breath" that blows away plot holes and any corners he should write himself into.

Just a lazy, boring issue. But y'know keep making this a top book, whille good, innovative, struggling artists and writers who truly love the medium (not just Batman pajamas) figure out how to pay they're bills.

[Batman9]

Another mediocre issue of Batman that CBR lauding as a four and a half star book. This issue should have been called "Deus Ex Machina: The Comic".

After all it sure was convenient that Batman;
A) had his glowy red nickel(?) thing to stop Mr. Freeze with
B) fought freeze right before Clayface and had the foresight to take the Freeze Gun with him
C) was riding a horse (up stairs for some reason?) that could take a freeze blast to the face for him. Sidenote: Batman should be convicted of animal cruelty for punching a horse in the face only to hop on him and force him to take a freezing to the face.

Also, Bats was pretty certain that Joker or the other villains had no other way of hurting those hostages once he cut the power. He was ready to pull up a chair and wait till the cops came. It's not like four villains could possibly come up with a way to kill someone that didn't involve an electrified chainsaw. It's only when his own "family" was in trouble did Bats give a damn.

This issue really made me wonder how Snyder's Superman book will be. Is he going to invent a new power for Superman every time he can't figure out a way for Superman to beat a villain? Maybe he'll bring back the "Great Wall brick replacing vision" from "Superman IV". Or he"ll invent "Plot solving super breath" that blows away plot holes and any corners he should write himself into.

Just a lazy, boring issue. But y'know keep making this a top book, whille good, innovative, struggling artists and writers who truly love the medium (not just Batman pajamas) figure out how to pay they're bills.

I'd suppose someone who reads comics for a living might know more, but I could be mistaken. Either way, I think you'll find this interesting

[The Greatest Hero]

If Alfred's wearing the Joker's face, there was no physical attack. It was a mental breakdown with "the attack" taking place in Alfred's head.

That doesn't make sense because they say the security footage of Alfred getting beaten by the Joker.

[Batman9]

I think it was issue 15 honestly.



This. It's just trying too hard

IMO it goes 13>15=16>14. Likely 17 will top them all.

I'm indifferent to the tapestries, really isn't a big deal at all. I think it's morbid and shocking, but also it's 3/4 of a page and actually sends a message.
1. Joker is nostalgic
2. Joker has done f'ed up stuff
3. Joker is one sick crazy little sh*t