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  1. #31
    BUY LOKI: AGENT OF ASGARD Kieran_Frost's Avatar
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    Other great episodes not yet mentioned:
    • "Civil Defense" (season 3)
    • "Homefront"/"Paradise Lost" (season 4)
    • "Children of Time" (season 5)
    • "A Call To Arms" (season 5)
    • "Rock and Shoals" (season 6)


    Quote Originally Posted by SephirothDZX View Post
    Granted, Generations has bunch of other problems beyond that which is why it's maybe the worst Trek movie (opinion).
    I always think Star Trek: Generations (1994) gets a bad rep; it had some great moments (Picard's beautiful scene with Deanna)... it was only Data's "amusing" emotion chip that left such a bitter taste (and it was AWFUL). Malcom McDowell was a good villain, too.

    Quote Originally Posted by SephirothDZX View Post
    Well I wasn't meaning to compare him to Stewart. I just meant in general, I don't care for him as an actor.
    Awww... what's wrong with Avery Brooks? He always seems really nice in interviews, and in terms of talent he always pleased me (great in American History X (1998))

    Quote Originally Posted by The Batman View Post
    Regarding "The Visitor," while I agree that Cirroc Lofton was often one of the show's weaker links, that episode works because of Tony Todd and Avery Brooks. It's a solid episode because of how good Old Jake is, not how merely passable Young Jake was.
    Very fair point, Tony Todd did a great job... I guess I was just put off my Cirroc (any Cirroc story). I so rooted for the Prophets in "Reckoning".

    Quote Originally Posted by Cyke View Post
    Well, to be fair, a lot of the TNG writers wanted to do more follow-up episodes (for example, a true sequel to "Inner Light"), but were vetoed by the Powers That Be who wanted to keep the show as traditionally stand-alone as possible. Still, one could argue that they got the last laugh, if one considers all of DS9 to be one rather large sequel to Chain of Command.
    Haha! Good point.
    "I don't know how to please you Lord, but I think the fact I try to please you, pleases you."

  2. #32
    Senior Member SephirothDZX's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kieran_Frost View Post
    I always think Star Trek: Generations (1994) gets a bad rep; it had some great moments (Picard's beautiful scene with Deanna)... it was only Data's "amusing" emotion chip that left such a bitter taste (and it was AWFUL). Malcom McDowell was a good villain, too.
    Well, I don't mean to derail the entire thread but here's my gripes with Generations (note, I know I'm nitpicky):

    1- The Kirk/TOS link is completely unnecessary. It just shows that the studio doesn't have full confidence in the TNG cast for some silly reason.

    2- Recycled Star Trek 6 footage

    3- How is Malcom McDowell's sun killer rocket able to get from that planet to the sun in a matter of seconds? Just looking at the rocket, it pretty clearly looks like it has no warp drive on it which means it travels at sub-light speed (this is also backed up by the fact that its explosion later on when Picard sabotages it is pretty small). Assuming the planet is within the traditional habitable zone of its system and is Earth-like, light takes 8 minutes to travel from our sun to the planet. The only way McDowell's rocket could get to the sun within a matter of seconds is if the planet is right next to the star, which it clearly isnt. This whole gripe can be summed up with "hey guys, science called"

    4- Why is everything so fricken dark on the Enterprise D all of a sudden?

    5- Why did the emotion chip grow like 5 times its size since its appearance in the series?

    6- How come Riker and Worf think up of a silly over complicated plan to trigger the Bird of Prey's cloaking device when they could have simply changed their shield frequency and then spent all day peppering that Bird of Prey while probably playing a game of Poker in the meantime.

    7- The alternating between the TNG uniforms and the DS9/Voyager styled uniforms bugs me. Wouldn't a uniform change be universal (and thus work with the idea of what a uniform is supposed to be)? Considering they couldn't even get appropriately sized uniforms for everyone and had to borrow DS9 uniforms for some characters, they should have just stuck with the TNG uni's.

    There's a bunch of other little things I could say but its early in the morning and I don't feel like turning my nitpicky nerd meter to 11 :) I like the concept of Generations I just think its execution is rather poor (kind of like Star Trek 5). And in general I swear the people who wrote the TNG movies are people from a parallel dimension where TNG sucked.

    Quote Originally Posted by Kieran_Frost View Post
    Awww... what's wrong with Avery Brooks? He always seems really nice in interviews, and in terms of talent he always pleased me (great in American History X (1998))
    Go watch The Captains. He seems like a decent guy but he also seems like he has few screws loose, he says and does some stuff that even leaves Shatner a bit speechless.
    Eh, Comics is a pretty cool guy...

  3. #33
    BUY LOKI: AGENT OF ASGARD Kieran_Frost's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SephirothDZX View Post
    Well, I don't mean to derail the entire thread but here's my gripes with Generations (note, I know I'm nitpicky):
    1- The Kirk/TOS link is completely unnecessary. It just shows that the studio doesn't have full confidence in the TNG cast for some silly reason.
    I don't think it was so much "lack of confidence" as passing the movie torch. Much like Leonard Nimroy in Star Trek (2009); it was passing the torch from old to new.

    Quote Originally Posted by SephirothDZX View Post
    3- How is Malcom McDowell's sun killer rocket able to get from that planet to the sun in a matter of seconds? Just looking at the rocket, it pretty clearly looks like it has no warp drive on it which means it travels at sub-light speed (this is also backed up by the fact that its explosion later on when Picard sabotages it is pretty small). Assuming the planet is within the traditional habitable zone of its system and is Earth-like, light takes 8 minutes to travel from our sun to the planet. The only way McDowell's rocket could get to the sun within a matter of seconds is if the planet is right next to the star, which it clearly isnt. This whole gripe can be summed up with "hey guys, science called"
    4- Why is everything so fricken dark on the Enterprise D all of a sudden?
    5- Why did the emotion chip grow like 5 times its size since its appearance in the series?
    This is a LITTLE nit-picky (I mean... surely minor faults can't make something "the worst"?)

    Quote Originally Posted by SephirothDZX View Post
    6- How come Riker and Worf think up of a silly over complicated plan to trigger the Bird of Prey's cloaking device when they could have simply changed their shield frequency and then spent all day peppering that Bird of Prey while probably playing a game of Poker in the meantime.
    I thought they mentioned that? They changed the shield modulation; and then the Bird of Prey again copied it, using Geordie's visor?

    Quote Originally Posted by SephirothDZX View Post
    There's a bunch of other little things I could say but its early in the morning and I don't feel like turning my nitpicky nerd meter to 11 :) I like the concept of Generations I just think its execution is rather poor (kind of like Star Trek 5). And in general I swear the people who wrote the TNG movies are people from a parallel dimension where TNG sucked.
    Ha! A far less fun "mirror universe". It's a shame TNG never did a mirror universe episode.

    Quote Originally Posted by SephirothDZX View Post
    Go watch The Captains. He seems like a decent guy but he also seems like he has few screws loose, he says and does some stuff that even leaves Shatner a bit speechless.
    Hmmmm... I'll need to go watch this...
    "I don't know how to please you Lord, but I think the fact I try to please you, pleases you."

  4. #34
    Elder Member dupersuper's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by CBR News View Post
    If this week's 20th anniversary of the "Star Trek: DS9" series meant nothing because you've never seen the show, SPINOFF ONLINE presents five episodes to make you hooked.


    Full article here.
    The page won't load.

    Quote Originally Posted by marshal99 View Post
    I doubt that's the reason. At the time TNG was moving into movies but still doesn't explain why the USS enterprise wasn't at the front of the federation defence when the dominion was invading. Could have shown the ship and a brief cameo appearance by Picard or Riker and it could be done.
    There are tonnes of ships in the big space battle scenes, just assume the Enterprise was 1 in the most important ones. Also, we see them fight in the war in various novels.

    Quote Originally Posted by ChrisIII View Post
    (Worf also appears in all the movies, which is a continuity problem with DS9 in Nemesis).
    How so?

    Quote Originally Posted by SephirothDZX View Post
    5- Why did the emotion chip grow like 5 times its size since its appearance in the series?
    To play Devils advocate on this 1: it was damaged when Data shot Lore: he may have had to modify it to get it working again, which may be why it fused so violently to his neural net. Do I get a Baldie or No-Prize?
    Pull List; seems to be too long to fit in my sig...

  5. #35
    Senior Member SephirothDZX's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kieran_Frost View Post
    Ha! A far less fun "mirror universe". It's a shame TNG never did a mirror universe episode.
    TNG mirror universe = Picard has hair

    Also, if we're using the evil goatee logic... what would Mirror Universe Riker be? Mustache and mutton chops?

    Quote Originally Posted by dupersuper View Post
    To play Devils advocate on this 1: it was damaged when Data shot Lore: he may have had to modify it to get it working again, which may be why it fused so violently to his neural net. Do I get a Baldie or No-Prize?
    Good theory, I like that.
    Eh, Comics is a pretty cool guy...

  6. #36
    BUY LOKI: AGENT OF ASGARD Kieran_Frost's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SephirothDZX View Post
    TNG mirror universe = Picard has hair
    You...you... MONSTER!!!

    Quote Originally Posted by SephirothDZX View Post
    Also, if we're using the evil goatee logic... what would Mirror Universe Riker be? Mustache and mutton chops?
    LOL!!! Awww... the awesome episode that never was...
    "I don't know how to please you Lord, but I think the fact I try to please you, pleases you."

  7. #37
    CBR Dark Tourny Master Robotech Master's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by dupersuper View Post
    How so?
    Worf leaves Starfleet after the end of the Dominion War. Nemesis, taking place shortly after the Dominion War, has him as the Enterprise E's tactical officer with not even a line of dialogue to explain.
    "It's your parting gift. In that it will part you; part of you over here, part of you over there, part of you way over there, staining the wall!" Lord Shen

  8. #38
    Senior Member ChrisIII's Avatar
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    Did anybody see Brooks in "The Captains" documentary (In which Shatner interviews the captain actors from the other shows as well as new Kirk Chris Pine)? I've yet to see it but I've heard Brooks's interview is very strange.


    I think the Time to...novels try to explain all the inconsistencies between Insurrection and Nemesis...why Data seems less emotional, why Worf ends up back on the Enterprise, Riker and Troi's engagement and why Wesley's back in Starfleet. Of course they're not canon though.
    Last edited by ChrisIII; 01-08-2013 at 11:26 AM.

  9. #39
    Senior Member SephirothDZX's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ChrisIII View Post
    Did anybody see Brooks in "The Captains" documentary (In which Shatner interviews the captain actors from the other shows as well as new Kirk Chris Pine)? I've yet to see it but I've heard Brooks's interview is very strange.
    It is quite strange, if you ask me. There's a couple of moments where Shatner looks straight at the camera and has a very "what the shit is this guy saying?" look on his face.
    Eh, Comics is a pretty cool guy...

  10. #40
    Elder Member dupersuper's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Robotech Master View Post
    Worf leaves Starfleet after the end of the Dominion War. Nemesis, taking place shortly after the Dominion War, has him as the Enterprise E's tactical officer with not even a line of dialogue to explain.
    I don't see that as a continuity problem so much as untold stories between the DS9 finale and ST 10. I'm sure some novel or comic I've yet to read tells the tail.

    Quote Originally Posted by ChrisIII View Post
    Did anybody see Brooks in "The Captains" documentary .
    Sadly no. I so want to see that.

    Quote Originally Posted by ChrisIII View Post
    I think the Time to...novels try to explain all the inconsistencies between Insurrection and Nemesis...Riker and Troi's engagement
    That seems extremely consistent with Insurrection, as that's the film in which they got back together.
    Pull List; seems to be too long to fit in my sig...

  11. #41
    Elder Member The Batman's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SephirothDZX View Post
    It is quite strange, if you ask me. There's a couple of moments where Shatner looks straight at the camera and has a very "what the shit is this guy saying?" look on his face.
    Well, rumour is that Brooks is very talented to be sure, but also very passionate, and very intense, for lack of a better word. What I saw in Captains was only surprising because from everyone I know who's met him at a convention, he's been friendly and engaging.

  12. #42
    Elder Member The Batman's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kieran_Frost View Post
    I don't think it was so much "lack of confidence" as passing the movie torch. Much like Leonard Nimroy in Star Trek (2009); it was passing the torch from old to new.

    That, and a chance for the two captains of the Enterprise to meet. Even if the movie ultimately didn't pay off on that promise, there's potential there and cause for excitement.

  13. #43
    Elder Member The Batman's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SephirothDZX View Post

    3- How is Malcom McDowell's sun killer rocket able to get from that planet to the sun in a matter of seconds? Just looking at the rocket, it pretty clearly looks like it has no warp drive on it which means it travels at sub-light speed (this is also backed up by the fact that its explosion later on when Picard sabotages it is pretty small). Assuming the planet is within the traditional habitable zone of its system and is Earth-like, light takes 8 minutes to travel from our sun to the planet. The only way McDowell's rocket could get to the sun within a matter of seconds is if the planet is right next to the star, which it clearly isnt. This whole gripe can be summed up with "hey guys, science called"
    I wondered why he couldn't just go back into the Nexus in a ship. That's how Kirk got there. That's how Soran got there the first time. Wouldn't it have been easier to buy, borrow, or steal a spaceship than to blow up a series of suns?

    4- Why is everything so fricken dark on the Enterprise D all of a sudden?
    I think this was just a matter of trying to make sets that were built for the small screen look credible on the big screen.

  14. #44
    Senior Member ChrisIII's Avatar
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    Regarding the uniforms, they were going to have updated TNG uniforms that basically were a mix of the Wrath of Khan uniforms and the traditional TNG uniforms. However for some reason this didn't work out and they used the DS9 uniforms (Which didn't quite fit on some actors, such as Frakes). They changed it too late in production, and the first wave of action figures all had the unused uniforms!

    Of course both TNG films and DS9 eventually got a new design, although Voyager still stuck with the DS9 type throughout it's entire run (Since they probably didn't know, being lost and all).
    Last edited by ChrisIII; 01-09-2013 at 05:39 AM.

  15. #45
    Senior Member SephirothDZX's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Batman View Post
    I wondered why he couldn't just go back into the Nexus in a ship. That's how Kirk got there. That's how Soran got there the first time. Wouldn't it have been easier to buy, borrow, or steal a spaceship than to blow up a series of suns?
    Or, when Picard and Kirk leave the Nexus to go stop Soran.... why do they return to just before Picard got sent into the Nexus? Why return to the point where things could so easily go wrong so fast? Why not just return to a point where Soran is much more easily apprehend-able, such as when he's on that one space station (or heck, talk Kirk into just returning to the Enterprise-B.. Soran was there too). Picard could have prevented a few of Soran's other catastrophes and also prevented the destruction of the Enterprise-D (yeah, technically he didn't know it was destroyed until afterwards... but he still could have prevented it).

    Generations ending if it used some slightly better logic - Picard leaves the Nexus, returns to the Enterprise bridge just as he is beamed off the ship originally, sits in his chair and tells Data to lock onto coordinates blah-blah-blah on the planets surface (Soran's location) and fire a torpedo or two, ask for a cup of Earl Grey, and then tell LaForge to stay out of Engineering for a little while.

    Quote Originally Posted by ChrisIII View Post
    Regarding the uniforms, they were going to have updated TNG uniforms that basically were a mix of the Wrath of Khan uniforms and the traditional TNG uniforms. However for some reason this didn't work out and they used the DS9 uniforms (Which didn't quite fit on some actors, such as Frakes). They changed it too late in production, and the first wave of action figures all had the unused uniforms!

    Of course both TNG films and DS9 eventually got a new design, although Voyager still stuck with the DS9 type throughout it's entire run (Since they probably didn't know, being lost and all).
    Now that you mention it I think I do remember some stuff about the uniforms round the time Generations was made. I dont know why they didn't just stick with the TNG uniforms though, those are still the best Trek uniforms in my opinion. I don't mind the uniforms that the movies and DS9 got later, though I thought they were a bit too grey and lacked enough color.
    Last edited by SephirothDZX; 01-09-2013 at 07:23 AM.
    Eh, Comics is a pretty cool guy...

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