Throwdown!! "dying wish" vs "the other"

[RyanParkerMan]

Except "The Other" further muddied the waters.

Those sequences could have been Peter's subconscious trying to explain or trying to make sense of what was happening to him.

[Meehaul]

The Other creates an alternative origin story by stating that it was "destiny" for Pete to become Spidey and that the bulk of his villains were linked to him via this mystical "totem" connection. That pretty dramatically alters the origin story--a story premised on the idea that it was a random accident that could have happened to anyone and further relied on a (pseudo)scientific explanation for the bite itself. The randomness of the event was central to the idea of a nerdy teen having great powers thrust upon him. A number of the ensuing stories have referenced the mystical connections, as has Madame Web, so it appears The Other is at least quasi-cannon. This is a bit like the sad turn Scooby Doo made from explaining away supernatural phenomena as natural phenomena to introducing an actual supernatural element into the stories. The Other was really awful.

[Chris S.]

The Other creates an alternative origin story by stating that it was "destiny" for Pete to become Spidey and that the bulk of his villains were linked to him via this mystical "totem" connection. That pretty dramatically alters the origin story--a story premised on the idea that it was a random accident that could have happened to anyone and further relied on a (pseudo)scientific explanation for the bite itself. The randomness of the event was central to the idea of a nerdy teen having great powers thrust upon him. A number of the ensuing stories have referenced the mystical connections, as has Madame Web, so it appears The Other is at least quasi-cannon. This is a bit like the sad turn Scooby Doo made from explaining away supernatural phenomena as natural phenomena to introducing an actual supernatural element into the stories. The Other was really awful.

While the pages Mets added do muddy the argument a bit, I never took what JMS said as fact. Ezekiel was offering up the idea that it was a possibility that Peter was called for a higher reason. It left it open to interpretation. It was like saying that this is one possible reason you gained powers or that you were conceived.

The Other did force that a bit, and part of me may have just dismissed it from my memory. It felt like because of what Ezekiel had done this weird "Web of Life" had been attached to Spider-Man. Thus the events of The Other took place. But I don't know...

And I always took Madame Web's talk to be adding to the story. It just adds another element.

[Meehaul]

Right, it adds another bad element, imho. Even offering another interpretation lessens the power of the original story--especially because it doesn't compliment the story, it changes it. JMS wrote good TV dialogue, but never offered a compelling vision for the character, in my view.

[Mister Mets]

"Dying Wish" is a good storyline. I'm not sure it's a perfect grade, but that's more of a question of what differentiates a good story from a great story, and whether there's a tendency to reward too highly stories that are consequential and the payoff to years of subplots.

"The Other" was a mess. Plots were introduced and forgotten. Years later, some of the people here can't figure out what was going on in the sequence in which Spider-Man is told that his origin wasn't an accident. Two major beats were never explained. We didn't know what was making Peter Parker sick. Nor was it clear how Morlun managed to come back from the dead. There were some good moments, but there were also some screw-ups, including that issue in which Peter took MJ & Aunt May to Doctor Doom's castle. And Pat Lee delivered some of the worst Spider-Man art in recent memory, botching moments that called for emotion and nuance.

[Meehaul]

Oh man...I thought I had safely repressed all memories of that artwork.

[Chris S.]

Oh man...I thought I had safely repressed all memories of that artwork.

I've always disliked Deodato. I felt like JMS run was the worst when Deodato took over. Coincidence...

[Will.S]

Oh man...I thought I had safely repressed all memories of that artwork.

I thought Mike's work looked really good there actually, really captured the surreal creepy tone of the story.

[RyanParkerMan]

"Dying Wish" is a good storyline. I'm not sure it's a perfect grade, but that's more of a question of what differentiates a good story from a great story, and whether there's a tendency to reward too highly stories that are consequential and the payoff to years of subplots.

"The Other" was a mess. Plots were introduced and forgotten. Years later, some of the people here can't figure out what was going on in the sequence in which Spider-Man is told that his origin wasn't an accident. Two major beats were never explained. We didn't know what was making Peter Parker sick. Nor was it clear how Morlun managed to come back from the dead. There were some good moments, but there were also some screw-ups, including that issue in which Peter took MJ & Aunt May to Doctor Doom's castle. And Pat Lee delivered some of the worst Spider-Man art in recent memory, botching moments that called for emotion and nuance.

Hard to argue with any of that. Actuallym you can't argue with any of it. Thats why in a previous post I said the story had a lot of potential. The idea was cool. At times, the story was really good, but it was so long and messy. We didn't need Peter on the moon, or Peter and MJ and May in Doom's castle. WE didn't need May shooting robots...

And the two major beats that were missed I thought were going to be the heart of the story. Why was Peter dieing? We will ever know? How did Morlun come back? I'm dieing for a writer to come in and explain all this because it could be a really cool story.

[Chris S.]

Hard to argue with any of that. Actuallym you can't argue with any of it. Thats why in a previous post I said the story had a lot of potential. The idea was cool. At times, the story was really good, but it was so long and messy. We didn't need Peter on the moon, or Peter and MJ and May in Doom's castle. WE didn't need May shooting robots...

And the two major beats that were missed I thought were going to be the heart of the story. Why was Peter dieing? We will ever know? How did Morlun come back? I'm dieing for a writer to come in and explain all this because it could be a really cool story.

I'd love to see a book by JMS or someone explaining some of the behind the scenes things going on at Marvel. From what we've read there is a lot of speculation that his stories were changed. Or who was really running the ship on The Other storyline. Something like the Ben Reilly story would be interesting.

[Russell]

I'm surprised by this poll.

Dying Wish was far and away the better story. The Other had potential, but my problems are the same as many other posters. The wrong artists illustrated the wrong issues, too much was left unresolved and it ultimately amounted to nothing. Peter's death didn't have the emotional 'kick' it did in Dying Wish, and I think Peter died better in Dying Wish than in The Other. It is truer to life that even a heroic person can fall, although I did appreciate how his love for MJ helped him get up and 'kill' Morlun one last time.

Still, DW wins for me. That's a 9-9.5/10, whereas the other is a 6-6.5, IMO

[Russell]

I'd love to see a book by JMS or someone explaining some of the behind the scenes things going on at Marvel. From what we've read there is a lot of speculation that his stories were changed. Or who was really running the ship on The Other storyline. Something like the Ben Reilly story would be interesting.

I don't know if I'd want to see this. I believe the later parts of his run (Sins Past onwards) were heavily influenced by the editorial department so as to pave the way for OMD. The Weiderman story was probably the last story fully conceived by JMS. I like to think as JMS as a champion of the marriage, but I think in truth he was as willing as anyone else to do away with it, and his issue seems to be with the way they got rid of it, not that it was done away with. Years later he may say he was a fan of the marriage this whole time and wanted it to stay, but it's easy to say anything years after the fact.

[Mister Mets]

Hard to argue with any of that. Actuallym you can't argue with any of it. Thats why in a previous post I said the story had a lot of potential. The idea was cool. At times, the story was really good, but it was so long and messy. We didn't need Peter on the moon, or Peter and MJ and May in Doom's castle. WE didn't need May shooting robots...

And the two major beats that were missed I thought were going to be the heart of the story. Why was Peter dieing? We will ever know? How did Morlun come back? I'm dieing for a writer to come in and explain all this because it could be a really cool story.

I don't know. It's a significant enough story that it's still in print, so new readers will continue to be disappointed by it, but it seems that it would be difficult for a new writer to organically reintroduce plot threads from a story that came out seven years ago, and kinda sucked.

[RyanParkerMan]

I don't know. It's a significant enough story that it's still in print, so new readers will continue to be disappointed by it, but it seems that it would be difficult for a new writer to organically reintroduce plot threads from a story that came out seven years ago, and kinda sucked.

I don't think it would be too hard. All you need to do is reintroduce Morlun and you can easily pick up on Peter's illness, how Morlun keeps coming back, and what Spider-Man truly is.

Dan Slott reintroduced the power set theme when Kaine killed the Queen in Spider-Island with his stingers. Yost has continued with that theme. Kaine mentions night vision early on in Scarlet Spider. The next issue of Scarlet Spider might directly address the transformation process in The Other.
It seems it will. I don't have the issue next to me but I think it's called "The man who dreamt of being a spider"