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  1. #46
    It's Lexrules... GET HIM. Lexrules's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DrSimonHurt View Post
    The actual "Death of Superman" story hasn't stood as true canon since it came out. Do you really believe Bill Clinton was president three years ago, when he died?

    ALL STORIES become retcon and non-canon the moment the timescale slides. Death of Superman was a quick casualty. Green Lantern and Batman are running on old continuity, you just have to accept that Flashpoint was a story-driven timescale that facelifted the whole thing and brought the recent stories forward.

    That said, I just read Action #16.

    Some light spoilers here....

    ...
    ....
    ....







    .....


    one more

    .....



    Okay.

    Superman died three years ago. It seems that his original death was also the direct result of a Fifth Dimension attack. Back then, the sky went red due to red son radiation and Superman was killed by an enemy. The Daily Planet called it "Doomsday, the day Superman died". Named so because the sky went red and rained blood. The 'bad guy' that killed Superman is never named directly, but the day itself is referred to as Doomsday. Most likely, that's just Grant giving the creature a new origin for his name, as he's been doing with most of the villains he's used in this arc(K-man, Metal-Zero, etc). So a monster/enemy killed Superman on what is known as Doomsday.

    Quite a few cool things happen in the story, which eventually leads to Lex unleashing a new enemy. The Little Man refers to the day this new enemy arrives as "Super-Doomsday", sort of a follow-up to the first Doomsday. It is a sort of upgraded Superdoom.

    The book doesn't go much into the day he died, only that it was on Doomsday, three years ago and they put up a statue. The fight destroyed a lot of Metropolis and Superman put it back together.

    At first, I was questioning whether Morrison was saying that the big monster from the 90's still killed Superman, or someone else did on Doomsday. But, when the little man names the new enemy Super-Doomsday as a tribute, I realized that Morrison is just giving us a new origin for his name. So a horrible monster killed Superman on Doomsday, rather Doomsday killed Superman. This falls in line with the original story, which used the phrase "Doomsday for Superman", before Doomsday became the monster's actual name.
    Well this is new and I'm glad he gave it some kind of explanation. This is all you could ask for. I now have less problem with it as it was explained. Only took 16 issues but what the hell.

  2. #47
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    Spoilers continue...


    Yeah, the people of Metropolis don't know the creature's name or what it was. That probably falls in line with it being a horrible creature with no name(removing all that mess later on when Doomsday became intelligent and could talk).

    They just know that the monster killed Superman on Doomsday, a dark day in their history.

    I really like the new take. As the sky turns red, it shows people all over town in fear, noting that this happened years ago when Superman died. The red sky is for these people what the Joker is for Gotham in Death of the Family.

  3. #48
    It's Lexrules... GET HIM. Lexrules's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DrSimonHurt View Post
    Spoilers continue...


    Yeah, the people of Metropolis don't know the creature's name or what it was. That probably falls in line with it being a horrible creature with no name(removing all that mess later on when Doomsday became intelligent and could talk).

    They just know that the monster killed Superman on Doomsday, a dark day in their history.

    I really like the new take. As the sky turns red, it shows people all over town in fear, noting that this happened years ago when Superman died. The red sky is for these people what the Joker is for Gotham in Death of the Family.
    The Red Sky could also be a homage to Crisis on Infinite Earths as well.

  4. #49
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    Quote Originally Posted by DrSimonHurt View Post
    The actual "Death of Superman" story hasn't stood as true canon since it came out. Do you really believe Bill Clinton was president three years ago, when he died?

    ALL STORIES become retcon and non-canon the moment the timescale slides. Death of Superman was a quick casualty. Green Lantern and Batman are running on old continuity, you just have to accept that Flashpoint was a story-driven timescale that facelifted the whole thing and brought the recent stories forward.

    That said, I just read Action #16.

    Some light spoilers here....

    ...
    ....
    ....







    .....


    one more

    .....



    Okay.

    Superman died three years ago. It seems that his original death was also the direct result of a Fifth Dimension attack. Back then, the sky went red due to red son radiation and Superman was killed by an enemy. The Daily Planet called it "Doomsday, the day Superman died". Named so because the sky went red and rained blood. The 'bad guy' that killed Superman is never named directly, but the day itself is referred to as Doomsday. Most likely, that's just Grant giving the creature a new origin for his name, as he's been doing with most of the villains he's used in this arc(K-man, Metal-Zero, etc). So a monster/enemy killed Superman on what is known as Doomsday.

    Quite a few cool things happen in the story, which eventually leads to Lex unleashing a new enemy. The Little Man refers to the day this new enemy arrives as "Super-Doomsday", sort of a follow-up to the first Doomsday. It is a sort of upgraded Superdoom.

    The book doesn't go much into the day he died, only that it was on Doomsday, three years ago and they put up a statue. The fight destroyed a lot of Metropolis and Superman put it back together.

    At first, I was questioning whether Morrison was saying that the big monster from the 90's still killed Superman, or someone else did on Doomsday. But, when the little man names the new enemy Super-Doomsday as a tribute, I realized that Morrison is just giving us a new origin for his name. So a horrible monster killed Superman on Doomsday, rather Doomsday killed Superman. This falls in line with the original story, which used the phrase "Doomsday for Superman", before Doomsday became the monster's actual name.
    That sounds awesome. I love that Morrison seems to have done with the idea of DoS.

  5. #50
    Veteran Member El Sombrero's Avatar
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    This preview looks incredible. I was down on Action Comics for a while but the last issue was unbelievable and this looks dramatic / epic as all hell. Good to see Morrison seems to be wrapping up his run on a high note.

  6. #51
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lexrules View Post
    The Red Sky could also be a homage to Crisis on Infinite Earths as well.
    Keep in mind that according to Morrison, the red in the Crisis wasn't due to the Crisis itself, but was just a sign that the multiverse had been breached and the bleed was visible as the universe was actually injured.

    So in Morrison's mind, the repeated attacks on Superman's timeline from various points originating from the Fifth Dimension are manifesting as damage done to the multiverse.

    There's also an implication that the red sky may actually be our sun turning into red radiation, which explains why Superman was able to be killed three years ago, and possibly today.

  7. #52
    Senior Member manofsteel1979's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DrSimonHurt View Post
    Keep in mind that according to Morrison, the red in the Crisis wasn't due to the Crisis itself, but was just a sign that the multiverse had been breached and the bleed was visible as the universe was actually injured.

    So in Morrison's mind, the repeated attacks on Superman's timeline from various points originating from the Fifth Dimension are manifesting as damage done to the multiverse.

    There's also an implication that the red sky may actually be our sun turning into red radiation, which explains why Superman was able to be killed three years ago, and possibly today.
    I guess this question will answer itself when I read the actual issue later...but is there a mention how long Superman stayed dead? Was he gone and then suddenly back...or was he gone a few weeks like in the original story? If the later is still so, I can imagine that during this period as Metropolis recovered. John Henry Irons may have returned and put on his Steel suit, this time adding the "S" in Superman's honor and became a sort of replacement Superman, That would be a nice tip of the hat to the original "Reign" Story.

    Also, I haven't been keeping up with Green Lantern...but does anyone know whether or not in the New 52 history, if Coast City was still destroyed at any point? If so, is it said how?

  8. #53
    Veteran Member Sacred Knight's Avatar
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    Sounds to me almost like Morrison is keeping the monster's identity oblique because he's leaving it up to editorial to make up their minds on who they want it to be, and we know from experience how many times they can change their minds before making a decision. Just leaving it a mystery is is good for Superman not only from a clean continuity standpoint in that regard, but also just in terms of story as I find the idea that he was killed by a monster that no one knows the identity of even up to the present day a very intriguing mystery to move forward with. It can end up being anyone, from "classic" Doomsday with a revised origin (I still favor the First Worldkiller route), or something completely new.

    As for GL, I think Coast City was destroyed this time around, and it was just a case now that Mongul was the lone perp in the destruction. But apparently a recent issue of New Guardians is throwing the whole Hal/Parallax thing into question again, I'm not sure on the specifics I just remember readers complaining about it last month or so. If its all still on though, a good direction to go I think, to still tie Superman into the story a bit, would be to have it that the fall out of Doomsday (already am digging referring to the day by that name) left Earth's heroes preoccupied and Mongul saw it as a good chance to attack.

    I also would love it if something about this day or the second Fifth Dimension attack in this issue be used somehow to conjure up an eventual new origin for Cyborg Superman. It'd be cool if he were re-introduced with a tie still to the death in some fashion or another. Like have Henshaw and his wife in space when the red sun occurred on Doomsday, doing a space walk or something and were poisoned by the radiation.
    Last edited by Sacred Knight; 01-09-2013 at 02:48 AM.

  9. #54

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    Can't wait to read this, its gonna be hard to top the last issue!
    "It is wrong to assume that art needs the spectator in order to be. The film runs on without any eyes. The spectator cannot exist without it. It ensures his existence." -- James Douglas Morrison

  10. #55

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    Great issue. Not nearly as great as the last one, but lots of good stuff.

    Little confused about the Legion seen here, though -- it appears to be the Reboot/Post-Zero Hour Legion, with Sensor in her snake form.

    Hmm.

    Anyway, plot moves forward, some more interesting ideas, some great visuals...no one does big like Morrison does big. It's all colliding, and it's almost hard to believe that everything ends next issue, even an oversized issue.

    Loved it. Possibly best of the week, I'll have to re-read it and compare to the other contender (Dial H, a must for any fans of Morrison).
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  11. #56
    Senior Member misslane38's Avatar
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    Forgive my ignorance, but has Grant Morrison reinvisioned how blue kryptonite functions? His blue kryptonite seems to have an emotional and spiritual affect on Superman. Has that ever been the case in the past? I'm just asking because I think it's a fascinating idea.

  12. #57

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    It's new. Pre-Crisis it used to be the equivalent of Green K for Bizarros. Post Crisis, for a while, it made Bizarro's super intelligent, but then in the Geoff Johns era it was again Green K for Bizarros.

    So this is new.
    Check out my New Blog! Just a random assortment of ideas, thoughts, and reviews!

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  13. #58
    Senior Member misslane38's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Desaad View Post
    It's new. Pre-Crisis it used to be the equivalent of Green K for Bizarros. Post Crisis, for a while, it made Bizarro's super intelligent, but then in the Geoff Johns era it was again Green K for Bizarros.

    So this is new.
    Thank you. I'm excited to see how it might be used in the future.

  14. #59
    Inf‚me et fier de l'Ítre Auguste Dupin's Avatar
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    An issue as to be expected considering the last few issues. Those who loked them will probably like this one, those who didn't......won't.
    I'm on the side who loves it.
    Things start to come together: the Legion (although how exactly they fit in is yet to see.....apparently they seem to come from a future turned wrong and helping Superman will prevent it from happening), Superdoom (with Luthor coming back for a few pages as a way of introducing the threat.....then joining the battle against the Superbeast like in issue 9?), Krypto (who has a big damn hero moment, before.....learning his place I guess), Lois and Jimmy, Mister Mistic Triple X..... We finally learn what Blue Kryptonite does, and well.....they weren't joking when they said it was the deadliest.
    The whole thing is basically Superman facing the whole Anti Superman Army on two moments in time (plus, the Legion part). It's big, it's full of action it......actually took me a second reading to completely understand how the two different moments in time worked together (but it's obvious when you get it), and it ends on a desperate situation.....with a Superman that seems to have already figured some way out.
    Great, as always.
    "I'm going to paraphrase Nietzsche, when you judge a work, the work judges you."

  15. #60

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    So the Doomsday fight happened but the Lex Luthor fight when he wore the Kryptonian battle armor didn't? Or did they just rebuild the statue after that?



    Can't wait to see what happens in the next issue.
    "It is wrong to assume that art needs the spectator in order to be. The film runs on without any eyes. The spectator cannot exist without it. It ensures his existence." -- James Douglas Morrison

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