Superior Spiderman vs. JLA (with a twist)

[big_adventure]

Well Barry did circle the earth six times when he was effected with Bane venom toxin.

http://www.abload.de/img/btdk6-2ajkjw.jpg

http://www.abload.de/img/btdk6-3fnjcj.jpg

Don't know how well of a speed feat that is?

Actually, we have no idea how good a feat it is - it never gives us a timeframe. If it happens over a minute, it's good speed, but so far below light it's not funny. If it happens in a second, it's approaching lightspeed.

I'm willing to accept Spidey is only alive through the grace of God and terrible writing, but when did he fry a world with radiation? What tech feats does he have to suggest he can make it fire off in nanosecond speeds?

Very recent Spider Man arc. Ock prepped for and bitchslapped the Avengers (with PIS, but whatever), and set up a fleet of satellites in orbit to fry the world. It didn't fire, no, the heroes stopped it, but everyone absolutely believed in the technology.

And I can make something fire in a nanosecond, run by my cellphone. The beams aren't going to go faster than light, but since NuSupes doesn't have lightspeed reactions (or particularly close, that I've seen thus far), it doesn't matter, plus we're talking AoE.

[Hazard]

That feat was actually long discussed in a previous thread. The general consensus was that while it did indicate a ridiculously FTL travel speed, since we didn't see things from Clark's perspective, have any given time frame, or even an explicit explanation for how he found them, his reflexes aren't explicitly FTL since he could have followed their teleportation signal and slowed down ridiculously high mach once he got near the Earth or flew at full speed and searched the entire planet for them inch by inch at said FTL speed and still had that scene presented the same way.

Also, Arsenal, we get that you used to be a junkie. You can ditch the hat now, please.

More importantly, it's just a travel feat. Same as all others.

Even more importantly, the hat is awesome.

[Seto Kaiba]

Very recent Spider Man arc. Ock prepped for and bitchslapped the Avengers (with PIS, but whatever), and set up a fleet of satellites in orbit to fry the world. It didn't fire, no, the heroes stopped it, but everyone absolutely believed in the technology.

It did fire somewhat. He gave everyone a small preview of what he could do and he had the side of the earth facing the sun on it's knees in pretty short order. So it wasn't really an idle threat. Still, that and the way he prepared for the Avengers was pretty impressive.

[Eternal Torment]

More importantly, it's just a travel feat. Same as all others.

Even more importantly, the hat is awesome.

Arsenal keeps his hat better than Risk keeps his arms.

[Gram]

Re: that Kid Flash feat. It doesn't actually have a time frame. RR just said some random tiny number; he certainly wasn't measuring since he didn't know what Bart was gonna do until it was over and Bart didn't give it one. Still, it was done casually, mid-sentance, so that's pretty good.

Yeah, it does. Red Robin had a stop-watch in his hand and that was the entire point of that scene, he was checking how fast Kid Flash could move.

0.04 seconds is not random, it's specific. If Robin wanted to say some random number he would have said "in a second" or "a few seconds."

That feat was actually long discussed in a previous thread. The general consensus was that while it did indicate a ridiculously FTL travel speed, since we didn't see things from Clark's perspective, have any given time frame, or even an explicit explanation for how he found them, his reflexes aren't explicitly FTL since he could have followed their teleportation signal and slowed down ridiculously high mach once he got near the Earth or flew at full speed and searched the entire planet for them inch by inch at said FTL speed and still had that scene presented the same way.

Also, Arsenal, we get that you used to be a junkie. You can ditch the hat now, please.

Except, you know. We didn't see any of that happen. We have Red Hood's conversation with his comrades as a time-frame, and the text implied that it took around a minute for the teleportation and Kal's arrival to happen.

I still think it's still very nit-picky to dismiss that but whatever.

[Hazard]

.04 seconds is likely the author doing exposition through Robin.

Yeah, there is no way for Robin to time that, but I say we roll with it because it is obviously the author's intention there.

[Surtur]

Very recent Spider Man arc. Ock prepped for and bitchslapped the Avengers (with PIS, but whatever), and set up a fleet of satellites in orbit to fry the world. It didn't fire, no, the heroes stopped it, but everyone absolutely believed in the technology.

I think someone mentioned he demonstrated the technology, which is fine, but if he hadn't then everyone absolutely believing in it..wouldn't actually be a feat. Otherwise Perfect Cell would be a solar system buster on these boards.

And I can make something fire in a nanosecond, run by my cellphone. The beams aren't going to go faster than light, but since NuSupes doesn't have lightspeed reactions (or particularly close, that I've seen thus far), it doesn't matter, plus we're talking AoE.

If it's that easy to make things that fire off in nanoseconds then why in rumbles isn't every single person with halfway decent prep skills not making their various things..well, fire off in nanoseconds then?

More to the point, if what you're saying is true and Ock is that smart then..why isn't he capable of making the things fire off at lightspeed then? He was given a month to prep. You'd think making such a thing would be child's play for the guy if you can rig up something to fire in nanoseconds with a mere cell phone.

[big_adventure]

I think someone mentioned he demonstrated the technology, which is fine, but if he hadn't then everyone absolutely believing in it..wouldn't actually be a feat. Otherwise Perfect Cell would be a solar system buster on these boards.



If it's that easy to make things that fire off in nanoseconds then why in rumbles isn't every single person with halfway decent prep skills not making their various things..well, fire off in nanoseconds then?

More to the point, if what you're saying is true and Ock is that smart then..why isn't he capable of making the things fire off at lightspeed then? He was given a month to prep. You'd think making such a thing would be child's play for the guy if you can rig up something to fire in nanoseconds with a mere cell phone.

You are missing the point of speed issues in rumbles.

1. In an unprepped match, obviously you can't rig anything, so the fact that triggering something at the bell/whistle/gong doesn't matter.

2. In a prepped match with, for example, Wally West or Norrin Radd, you need to be so much faster than "nanosecond" or any real practical time that it doesn't matter that anyone can trigger a trap that quickly.

3. ANYONE with access to any modern computer tech can make something that can fire off in 1/1000000000th of a second, trivially, with one-sided prep. This is not complicated, and you don't really need to show it as a feat. Someone with access to Marvel super science should be able to do MUCH better, though I'm not handwaving it. We ALWAYS allow one-sided prep to include seeding traps, setting up lasers and whatever.

The problem here is that I can't tell you whether Otto's proven damage output is enough to take down Superman - I have zero question that he can make it fire fast enough to find out though, since NuSupes hasn't really shown anything above high mach reflexes (not travel speed - that's FTL, obvously) - and even that is pretty indefinite. Could Otto do that to the Surfer? No, of course not, because him and all of his toys will be turned into a Dora the Explorer tea set before Otto's automatic triggers can fire. But against a mach-XX speedster? Of course he can, because ANYONE can, if they have a) acces to modern technology (not even comics stuff) and b) have the proven ability to fire off AoE weapons via an electrical trigger.

[Becoming An Anthropologist]

The green stuff doesn't seem to be prominent in Dc anymore. Ock being able to whip something up that could 'hit harder than having to bench press the earth' (talking about the guy who outmuscled clark and beat him down) doesn't seem likely. But assuming for a second Ock could, it's arguable that Superman's cap would protect him anyway. The cap being invulnerable shouldn't be common knowledge at this point.

Also, Supes I peg supes Ftl myself from that pluto and reading stuff...but as far as travel speed Kara's also shown some. She basically left the solar system while holding her breath. That's before she even had a good grasp on her powers... they should both pretty comfort FTL flyers at this point.

[Captain Morgan]

NuSupes hasn't really shown anything above high mach reflexes (not travel speed - that's FTL, obvously) r.

NuSupes is clocking in at near light due to reading 10 years worth of medical training in a few minutes, pre-JLA. Barry is explicitly faster than him, so...

[big_adventure]

The green stuff doesn't seem to be prominent in Dc anymore. Ock being able to whip something up that could 'hit harder than having to bench press the earth' (talking about the guy who outmuscled clark and beat him down) doesn't seem likely.

Don't confuse strength with durability. That said, I keep forgetting about the stupid reading feat - that's pretty spectacular if it's not SMvFL - and since there isn't another confirming feat, it might well be.

Though, to be honest, it seems like they are rapidly building Supes up to pre-crisis levels here. All this time, we thought Johns was stiff for Barry Allen and Hal Jordan, but clearly it's Clark who floats his boat. Next reboot in 5...4...3...2...

[Pendaran]

That said, I keep forgetting about the stupid reading feat - that's pretty spectacular if it's not SMvFL

It's had a lot of question marks put on it by people who took a look at its depiction in the last big NU Supes speed arguement. Though I'm fine with it being part of marking him at near light.

[Gnarl]

The problem here is that I can't tell you whether Otto's proven damage output is enough to take down Superman - I have zero question that he can make it fire fast enough to find out though, since NuSupes hasn't really shown anything above high mach reflexes (not travel speed - that's FTL, obvously) - and even that is pretty indefinite. Could Otto do that to the Surfer? No, of course not, because him and all of his toys will be turned into a Dora the Explorer tea set before Otto's automatic triggers can fire. But against a mach-XX speedster? Of course he can, because ANYONE can, if they have a) acces to modern technology (not even comics stuff) and b) have the proven ability to fire off AoE weapons via an electrical trigger.

Well...If Ottos area of expertice is radiation, and he is good enough in that field that Reed Richards asks his advice...Superman does have problems with certain frequencies of radiation. Kryptonite and red sunlight. (Are those still in as weaknesses? I don't follow DCNu.) Basically, is his strong suit hitting Supermans weak suit? I'd have no problem with a Reed Richards trap messing up Superman with radiation. If Otto is even close to that level...

[big_adventure]

Well...If Ottos area of expertice is radiation, and he is good enough in that field that Reed Richards asks his advice...Superman does have problems with certain frequencies of radiation. Kryptonite and red sunlight. (Are those still in as weaknesses? I don't follow DCNu.) Basically, is his strong suit hitting Supermans weak suit? I'd have no problem with a Reed Richards trap messing up Superman with radiation. If Otto is even close to that level...

Thing is, Otto lacks prep feats for dealing with people on Superman's level, Reed most certainly does NOT. I'm certainly not saying that he CAN'T, just that he lacks the feats for doing so. He recently prepped for taking out Thor, and it worked, but it required a particular McGuffin, the Rhino and a shit-ton of PIS (Thor not using his vastly superior speed to kill the entire Octo-group the instant the fight started, for example, also effectively ignoring Rhino since he was sure he could no-sell his shots). Hell, it's a great healing feat for Thor, since he got through-body impaled through the chest/heart with the tooth of the world serpent (said McGuffin) yet was back next issue. Of course, that was not a one-sided prepped Khazan fight, where Otto could have automatically triggered AoE traps. And, Otto's PIS/CIS prefers idiots in costumes fighting other idiots in costumes rather than, you know, "winning."