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  1. #1
    Challenger of the Unknown Kirika's Avatar
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    Default They switch places: Superman and Captain America

    I'll be blunt, I'll always take Superman over Captain America, even though for the most part, I'm lean more towards Marvel than I would DC, but the fact is, Superman is to me, the more iconic of the two, and that's why I made this thread. What would happen if, not only do these two trade places, but along with them, their actual influence, renown, and fame that they carry in their respective universes carried over with them? How well would they influence the new homes? How would you personally like the change in this happened for real and both companies traded characters? What kind of relationships can you see them forming with a number of character in each universe?

    For example: How Do you think Superman would feel about Spiderman, Hulk, Thor, and Tony Stark? And just the same way how would Captain America feel about Batman, Wonder woman, Captain Marvel, and Flash?

  2. #2
    Elder Member Pendaran's Avatar
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    Well, DC New York would be safer, considering it only sometimes has the Teen Titans defending it, unless you mean Cap plunks into Metropolis in which case he will need to right quick use his rolodex powers to get someone there that can handle the Superman scale problems that happen in that city a lot.

    Conversely, Superman, I mean, New York is so chock full of heroes that he's not going to make a /huge/ change on its day to day.

    Otherwise, they both pretty much fill the needed "inspiring iconic dude to get people to do large scale teamups and fight a thing" role interchangeably so there's no huge loss that way.

  3. #3
    Elder Member Pendaran's Avatar
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    I suppose more indepth... the Marvel Universe is vastly more dysfunctional in its hero community than the DCU, at times, for instance Operation Galactic Storm, large groups of them will basically tell Cap to fuck himself and do what they want anyway, as far as how much overall influence he has at times, without touching crap like Civil War. I dunno that Superman is going to be happy/used to handling something like that.

    The DCU by comparison, it's not a land of shining hero harmony, but they do generally get along better. That would be like some kind of blessed vacation for Cap.

    With /that/ said, the DCnU seems to be going for a more on edge headstrong version of all these people (that upcoming Trinity War junk for one thing) so Cap might actually find himself with a more familiar experience..
    Last edited by Pendaran; 12-27-2012 at 06:10 PM.

  4. #4

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    To me these characters are very similar ideologically.

    Quote Originally Posted by Kirika View Post
    What would happen if, not only do these two trade places, but along with them, their actual influence, renown, and fame that they carry in their respective universes carried over with them? How well would they influence the new homes? What kind of relationships can you see them forming with a number of character in each universe?

    For example: How Do you think Superman would feel about Spiderman, Hulk, Thor, and Tony Stark? And just the same way how would Captain America feel about Batman, Wonder woman, Captain Marvel, and Flash?
    I think Stark would rub Superman the wrong way and I can image Tony getting his hands on some Kryptonite. I think Supes would help Banner to become a better hero, obviously he'd easily be able to stop Hulk on a rampage. Superman would also be a bright star in what is otherwise a much darker galaxy of Marvel heroes.

    I'm not sure Cap could have had the kind of influence on the DCU that Supes does. I could imagine the Cap flashbacks in books like G.I. Combat or The Losers. Maybe they could have Cap lead a Suicide Squad team? even better Cap leading The Justice League of America
    "It is wrong to assume that art needs the spectator in order to be. The film runs on without any eyes. The spectator cannot exist without it. It ensures his existence." -- James Douglas Morrison

  5. #5
    Elder Member Pendaran's Avatar
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    I'm not sure Cap could have had the kind of influence on the DCU that Supes does.
    Being fair, in the great grand scheme of things, the main influence either of them mostly have is being able to rally hero teams. It's not like Superman was actually able to stop stuff like President Luthor, for one thing.

  6. #6
    Elder Member dupersuper's Avatar
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    They both inspire the heroes as needed, and Caps more hands on, strategic leadership may even get the JL better organized, but I do worry about all those times Supes personally saved the world/universe/omniverse. Cap couldn't wrestle angels or push Warworld through a boom tube to the big bang or drag Earth through hyperspace or absorb an anti-sun...
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  7. #7
    Senior Member Slade's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ood Omega View Post
    To me these characters are very similar ideologically.



    I think Stark would rub Superman the wrong way and I can image Tony getting his hands on some Kryptonite.
    Where would he get Krptonite in the MU?

  8. #8
    The King is always around BYC's Avatar
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    Marvel got the better end of the trade IMO. Although Superman is a leader and an inspiration, his power levels are obviously a game changer as well. I think with his combo of powers and integrity, he might make a real difference in Marvel to unite, to work together, to be more open, to be more accepting. I think Reed and Tony are less likely to plan out things like 42. Aliens races will respect Earth much more. People like the Punisher might not be as numerous. Mutants will accept Superman as a role model of sorts. Marvel will be a lot more Superman centric.

    DC will be more like their normal selves. Batman and Captain America will probably work really well and Batman is likely to me more grounded, with somebody like Cap that's much more like himself. JLA will be more interesting with WW, MM, GL, and Aquaman taking bigger roles, with Captain Shazam (or whatever they are calling him now) probably hero worshiping Cap. WW might take the in-universe role of number 1 meta. I feel WW and Cap are more aligned in viewpoint; 'hope for peace, prepare for war'. Superman is great for all universes, but I think lack of Superman in DC might have them work harder for themselves and for each other as Superman is also used as a really big security blanket that is taking advantage too much sometimes. Anti-JLA government groups will have less ammo to use in a propaganda war.

    This is assuming the characters are written more to their classic/accepted characterizations, not CW Cap or Red Son Superman, etc.

  9. #9
    Elder Member Pendaran's Avatar
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    Marvel got the better end of the trade IMO. Although Superman is a leader and an inspiration, his power levels are obviously a game changer as well. I think with his combo of powers and integrity, he might make a real difference in Marvel to unite, to work together, to be more open, to be more accepting. I think Reed and Tony are less likely to plan out things like 42. Aliens races will respect Earth much more. People like the Punisher might not be as numerous. Mutants will accept Superman as a role model of sorts. Marvel will be a lot more Superman centric.
    Things Superman's combination of "powers and integrity" failed to stop in the DCU off the top of my head as far as his "make the world a better place and people want to be better because Superman":

    President Luthor. A US government being so consistently ridiculously evil across multiple administrations it keeps setting up Suicide Squads, Salvation Runs, OMAC programs, Checkmates, Major Forces, and what have you. Humanity and New Krypton getting into a genocidal war that basically humanity happened to win. His world having a healthy variety of Punisher knockoffs.

    And this is a world without things like systemic anti mutant prejudice so ludicrously ingrained it doesn't matter how many times you get a mutant on camera saving the day, huge chunks of people hates them some mutants.



    People like the Punisher might not be as numerous.
    Wild Dog and the various more lethal Vigilantes have existed just fine despite Superman existing.

    Aliens races will respect Earth much more.
    Alien races know that the man Eternity himself has commended for his actions lives on Earth, along with various sorts who have saved the entire universe, who have straight up lead said Alien races into battle to save said Universe. They aint give a crap.

    his power levels are obviously a game changer as well.
    Marvel Earth has had dwelling on it for various stretches everyone from Hyperion to Thor to the Sentry to the Silver Surfer to Classic Doctor Strange. No, they're really not.

    Mutants will accept Superman as a role model of sorts.
    He's not a mutant, why would they?

    he might make a real difference in Marvel to unite, to work together, to be more open, to be more accepting
    ask a whole pile of dead kryptonians and a celebrating Luthor as a pardoned hero US how accepting Superman made them of each other. Get a Ouija board for that first group though.
    Last edited by Pendaran; 12-28-2012 at 08:40 AM.

  10. #10

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    Captain America finds out uplifting, patriotic speeches don't do jack when fighting Brainiac.

  11. #11
    Elder Member dupersuper's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pendaran View Post
    Things Superman's combination of "powers and integrity" failed to stop in the DCU off the top of my head as far as his "make the world a better place and people want to be better because Superman":
    Seriously? Suicide rates go up when people think Superman's dead. He inspires generations of heroes (his, the Legion, Justice Legion A, future Supermen). The Metropolis in Secret Origin was pretty crappy before he came along. To say nothing of the fact that there'd be no one left to inspire without him...
    Pull List; seems to be too long to fit in my sig...

  12. #12
    Elder Member Pendaran's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by dupersuper View Post
    Seriously? Suicide rates go up when people think Superman's dead. He inspires generations of heroes (his, the Legion, Justice Legion A, future Supermen). The Metropolis in Secret Origin was pretty crappy before he came along. To say nothing of the fact that there'd be no one left to inspire without him...

    None of that actually makes anything I said untrue, nor allows for some really wanky "Superman will take the MU onto the way to Utopia" scenario. It's like some kind of bizarre reverse of all the people who go on about how Captain America would completely fix Gotham by more or less standing there.

    Captain America is so revered and trusted someone impersonating him caused nationwide riots for saying Skrulls were invading and he needed America to be his army or whatever. It doesn't change all the things he doesn't manage to do either. They both have their limits.
    Last edited by Pendaran; 12-28-2012 at 07:56 PM.

  13. #13
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    Can this be Pre-Crisis Superman, Kirika?



    Trust me on this. It's a great idea.

  14. #14
    Challenger of the Unknown Kirika's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pendaran View Post
    None of that actually makes anything I said untrue, nor allows for some really wanky "Superman will take the MU onto the way to Utopia" scenario. It's like some kind of bizarre reverse of all the people who go on about how Captain America would completely fix Gotham by more or less standing there.

    Captain America is so revered and trusted someone impersonating him caused nationwide riots for saying Skrulls were invading and he needed America to be his army or whatever. It does change all the things he doesn't manage to do either.
    As proven by Captain America in the past, at the very most, he'll be willing to kill in situations that warrant it that Batman wouldn't.

    Quote Originally Posted by Falcon Man View Post
    Can this be Pre-Crisis Superman, Kirika?



    Trust me on this. It's a great idea.
    silver age Superman, I'm pretty sure everyone will agree that Pre-Crisis Superman would be overkill.
    Last edited by Kirika; 12-28-2012 at 07:48 PM.

  15. #15
    Elder Member Pendaran's Avatar
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    silver age Superman, I'm pretty sure everyone will agree that Pre-Crisis Superman would be overkill.
    Silver Age Superman /is/ Pre Crisis Superman

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