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  1. #286
    You are #2. jsg2295's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by David Walton View Post
    Technically, Peter didn't pull a victory 'at great cost.' He had already lost at this point, and it was a last ditch effort to make something of his defeat. But it wasn't like he voluntarily relinquished his life.

    I'm not opposed to the idea that Peter would transform Ock by virtue of who he is, but I wasn't thrilled with the execution.

    For one thing, I tend to read comics to see the hero pull off a big victory, so the idea of Pete losing his life to Ock doesn't feel right, even though I felt prepared for that possibility going in.

    It especially felt off for a fifty year celebration.

    I'm not saying I won't ever come around. But right now, I really don't feel like reading about Ock's greatest triumph while he poses as Peter Parker for two years. Especially since I can't even read about Peter in USM.
    I dont think he is going to have triumph.....Maybe wishful thinking on my part...I think he is going to fail.....Underneath he is still Doc Ock....if he had wanted to redefine himself in the past he could have done it. One thing comes to mind.....wear armor on your face....or a force field around it....would have saved him a few punches to the visage.

  2. #287
    Splendiferous Spider Hero ImmortalIronFist's Avatar
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    I think my main problems with it are not only that Marvel's best character is gone and it happened in a really inglorious way, but also now that the new series is entirely based on a premise I find really dumb even when it's done for only an arc...body switching. Those stories are the worst.
    Hey, that tiger is flying a spaceship.

  3. #288
    You are #2. jsg2295's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ImmortalIronFist View Post
    I think my main problems with it are not only that Marvel's best character is gone and it happened in a really inglorious way, but also now that the new series is entirely based on a premise I find really dumb even when it's done for only an arc...body switching. Those stories are the worst.
    I liked it when DD and Doctor Doom switched so ...nyaaaaggghhhh.....you are wrong.

  4. #289
    Marked for Redemption David Walton's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jim Thompson View Post
    A pretty important distinction, I agree -- and part of the reason I didn't enjoy the story overall, though it had moments I thought hit the mark.
    I think it would have changed the tone significantly if Peter had suddenly realized why Ock was who he is, and said, "Look, I had my shot, and I don't regret it, and now I'm giving you a chance to make good on your mistakes."

    Of course, you'd still have the problem of Pete handing over his life to a guy when he's not sure how it will turn out, and I don't see any way around that.

    I think I'd have been more impressed with the story if Pete had realized he needed to kill Ock and stuck with it, as that seems like the moral choice when so many innocents are involved.

    I mean, it's almost like handing over the nuclear football to Putin as a gesture of goodwill.
    "I came to the conclusion that the optimist thought everything good except the pessimist, and the pessimist thought everything bad, except himself." -- G.K. Chesterton

  5. #290
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    Quote Originally Posted by David Walton View Post
    I think it would have changed the tone significantly if Peter had suddenly realized why Ock was who he is, and said, "Look, I had my shot, and I don't regret it, and now I'm giving you a chance to make good on your mistakes."

    Of course, you'd still have the problem of Pete handing over his life to a guy when he's not sure how it will turn out, and I don't see any way around that.

    I think I'd have been more impressed with the story if Pete had realized he needed to kill Ock and stuck with it, as that seems like the moral choice when so many innocents are involved.

    I mean, it's almost like handing over the nuclear football to Putin as a gesture of goodwill.
    Did you like the issue? I thought the delivery and execution was terrible. Seems Slott really is determined to write Ock-Slott stories all the time with Ock triumphing over every major Marvel hero. Reeks of fan fic.

  6. #291
    You are #2. jsg2295's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by One More Day View Post
    Did you like the issue? I thought the delivery and execution was terrible. Seems Slott really is determined to write Ock-Slott stories all the time with Ock triumphing over every major Marvel hero. Reeks of fan fic.
    The key being is that you wrote "seems".....We dont know what is going to really happen for a year......I just dont see Spock triumphing.....Especially someone as abrasive as Spock seems to be.

  7. #292
    Sad Hawkguy in the snow CyberHubbs's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Xenon View Post
    When you start dealing with death and mind swaps and not even mind swaps but mind copy/pastes that don't really even make much sense, you've reached the territory of stupid plot twists. But then, I liked my Amazing Spider-Man better when characters who were dead at the end of a story stayed that way instead of pretending to be the prelude to Blackest Night so meh.
    Oh, is that all? 'Cause we're talking about mad scientists who wear metal octopus arms and genius man-childs dressed up like spiders. That kind of stuff simply comes with the territory.



    I really don't see any reason to trust the writer in this case though. I mean, this specific thing people are worried about is an area they've had trouble with within the last 100 issues. They did it before, why should I believe they won't do it again? Especially when they have said and shown what they have about it (the scene in 700, the cover of Superior 2, the comments Mr. Slott made about Spider-Man and Mary Jane getting back together). Yeah, sure, it could all be lies and deceit and hype. But prior experience suggests that they don't actually have a problem with the thing people all have a problem with. I mean, after you touch the stove and it burns you, you expect to be burnt the next time you touch it, don't you?
    I have no idea what you're talking about there. But Slott has also had MJ play a big role in Spider-Island, one of -- if not the -- best stories in his current run. And their moment at the end of that arc with the ESB was pretty damn beautiful. So I think he appreciates MJ as a character, even if he's not giving you everything you want on a silver platter. Does he like to tease like with the roommates thing? Sure. But I think it's just teasing and in no way supposed to be from some place of animosity. We're talking about a writer who is pretty fan-friendly, and has had long, patient talks with readers who sought him out at conventions just to yell at him for a story he didn't even do.

    I don't think he's your enemy.
    I know Kevin Nichols through a guy that knows a gal. Small world!

    If nihilism didn't take some delight in destruction one might suspect nihilists were an unnaturally morbid sort.
    -Theophilus

  8. #293
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    Quote Originally Posted by jsg2295 View Post
    The key being is that you wrote "seems".....We dont know what is going to really happen for a year......I just dont see Spock triumphing.....Especially someone as abrasive as Spock seems to be.
    I meant even in the past, when Ock made Stark grovel and outwitted Hank Pym.

  9. #294
    You are #2. jsg2295's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by One More Day View Post
    I meant even in the past, when Ock made Stark grovel and outwitted Hank Pym.
    God help Spock if the heroes do find out because I believe PP's body will be taking a serious beating....and you just know they will.

  10. #295
    Marked for Redemption David Walton's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by One More Day View Post
    Did you like the issue? I thought the delivery and execution was terrible. Seems Slott really is determined to write Ock-Slott stories all the time with Ock triumphing over every major Marvel hero. Reeks of fan fic.
    I didn't enjoy the story's climax, and I did feel the execution was off. There's the added complication that ASM's sendoff issue seems more concerned with setting up Superior Spider-Man than celebrating Pete.

    I don't think it 'reeks of fan-fic.' Slott swung for the fences here, and it fell flat for me personally. But a lot of people feel like it's the best thing that's happened in years, so there you have it.
    "I came to the conclusion that the optimist thought everything good except the pessimist, and the pessimist thought everything bad, except himself." -- G.K. Chesterton

  11. #296
    Sad Hawkguy in the snow CyberHubbs's Avatar
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    I don't know if it's the best thing ever, but I liked it. Would have preferred for Peter to somehow still be alive in Otto's body, BUT to be fair he's also still there in his own. Kinda.
    I know Kevin Nichols through a guy that knows a gal. Small world!

    If nihilism didn't take some delight in destruction one might suspect nihilists were an unnaturally morbid sort.
    -Theophilus

  12. #297
    Marked for Redemption David Walton's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by CyberHubbs View Post
    I don't know if it's the best thing ever, but I liked it. Would have preferred for Peter to somehow still be alive in Otto's body, BUT to be fair he's also still there in his own. Kinda.
    Richard Parker: What have you done with my son's katra? I thought you were his friend, Carlie. It must be put to rest at a sacred ceremony in Queens!
    "I came to the conclusion that the optimist thought everything good except the pessimist, and the pessimist thought everything bad, except himself." -- G.K. Chesterton

  13. #298

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    Quote Originally Posted by David Walton View Post
    Richard Parker: What have you done with my son's katra? I thought you were his friend, Carlie. It must be put to rest at a sacred ceremony in Queens!
    Superior Spider-Man: The Search For Peter Parker.
    Be careful when speaking. You create the world around you with your words.

  14. #299
    Sad Hawkguy in the snow CyberHubbs's Avatar
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    Ugh. A Star Trek reference.

    I take it back. Comic book fans aren't the worst.
    I know Kevin Nichols through a guy that knows a gal. Small world!

    If nihilism didn't take some delight in destruction one might suspect nihilists were an unnaturally morbid sort.
    -Theophilus

  15. #300
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    Quote Originally Posted by CyberHubbs View Post
    I don't know if it's the best thing ever, but I liked it. Would have preferred for Peter to somehow still be alive in Otto's body, BUT to be fair he's also still there in his own. Kinda.
    You don't find it weird the way Peter unceremoniously went out with a whimper on the 50th anniversary of Spider-Man? And the back up stories/content were awful.

    Also who is saying putz in your avatar?

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