http://superman-wonderwoman.deviantart.com/ (featuring some of the best superman/wonder woman art )
In 1987, hot of the heels of the success of Watchmen (and the success at DC of Crisis on Infinite Earths), Alan Moore was takes by DC Comics to come up with an idea for a big crossover. Moore’s idea was called Twilight of the Superheroes.
The basic gist of the story is thus:
It is around the year 2000, and superheroes more or less rule the world. There are eight “Houses” which are made up of related superheroes.
The two strongest ones are:
House of Steel – Superman and his brood (including Superman’s wife, Wonder Woman)
House of Thunder – Captain Marvel and his Marvel Family
These two houses are about to join with the marriage of Superboy (the son of Superman and Wonder Woman) and Mary Marvel, Jr. (the daughter of Captain Marvel and Mary Marvel – yes, I know, that is a creepy pairing – Moore does not shy from the creepiness of it).
The other six are:
House of Titans – Made up of, yep, you guessed it.
House of Mystery – Various magic characters.
House of Secrets – The remaining super-villains who have not been captured/killed.
House of Justice – The remaining unaffiliated superheroes
House of Tomorrow – Due to a flux in time, all time travelers have been stuck at this point in time, so they all gather here.
House of Lanterns – Abandoned, because awhile back, Earth has turned on aliens and driven them all out (Superman being the notable exception, of course). They currently have a base on the moon, waiting to get back to Earth, planning an invasion along with New Mars, Rann and Thanagar.
Okay, so the whole story takes place in a flashback at the beginning of a framing sequence with John Constantine at a bar in late 1987, reading a letter. A woman asks him for a lgiht, and he flashs back to earlier in 1987, and that begins the story.
It appears that the John Constantine from the future somehow helps Rip Hunter (one of the time travelers stuck at that point in time) escape to the present (1987), where Hunter teams up with 1987 John Constantine to warn all the heroes about the future. Future Constantine has told 87 Constantine (through Hunter) that the world of the future is awful, and he needs to help change it.
So anyhow, Constantine and Rip Hunter go to various heroes and warn them – presumably, these would take place in the various titles of the DC line of comics.
Meanwhile, in the Twilight of Superheroes series, proper, the Constantine of that time is the readers’ guide to the world of the future. Constantine is his normal self, just older, but actually in a happy relationship with a woman he’s been with for some time now – which is a nice change of pace for Constantine. So Constantine makes his way through the grimy world of the remaining human characters, the ones who don’t belong to the various Houses. He meets Green Arrow, etc. One notable absence, of course, is Batman. However, Constantine seems to be making various plans and contacts with people here and there. He is obviously planning SOMEthing. He keeps having mysterious meetings with people we don’t learn the importance of until later.
In the end, there would be a whole series of twists and turns.
That’s what happens in the long finale (I’d imagine the finale would be so big it would take up at least two issues, maybe three) – first, all the remaining Earth houses attack the wedding of Superboy and Mary Marvel, Jr., because they want to prevent that union. Massive bloodshed, but the House of Steel and Marvel manage to survive more or less intact (while mostly wiping out the other heroes).
When the dust settles from that fight, though, we get the big revelation that that Martian Manhunter has been impersonating Captain Marvel Sr. for the whole series, as part of an alien invasion. The Green Lanterns, the Rannians and the Thanagarians all invade at once.
Big fight with the remaining characters, and in the end, the aliens simply have too much manpower (including the Daxamite Green Lantern).
However, this is when Constantine’s plan comes into play – Batman and a small group of human heroes attack using armor created by the Metal Man Gold (who disappeared earlier in the series) and fight the aliens to a stand-still, but when it looks like a stalemate, Constantine reveals his final trump card. He has contacted the New God Metron (seen earlier in the series, although not made clear what he was doing), and used his chair to travel to Qward, where Constantine has sold the secret of Boom Tube technology to the Qwardians, so while the aliens are on Earth, their home worlds are currently being invaded by Qwardians. So the aliens all leave, and Earth is left with mostly humans and non-powered superheroes, so the world is ultimately (in Constantine’s view, at least) a happier place.
We cut back to the opening, and realize that the letter Constantine is reading in 1987 is from his future self. He is learning via a letter from his future self (that Hunter gives to Constantine after they warn all the heroes) that the whole thing has been a con, and he was meant to warn the heroes of 1987 specifically so that this future WOULD happen. Older Constantine apologizes, but says, on the bright side, A. I conned you for a good cause and B. at least you’ll end up with the woman of your dreams. In fact, I’ll even tell you when you meet her. She comes up to you and asks you for a light at a bar at the end of 1987.
So yeah, you guessed it. The young Constantine is so angry at his future self that he tries to think of a way to hurt him, and all he can think of is, when the woman asks for a light, he replies:
“No. I’m sorry. I don’t smoke.”
She leaves, and the books ends with Constantine drinking himself into a stupor as he weeps uncontrollably.
I find this whole idea interesting, especially since Alan Moore himself wrote in Superman Annual #11 (1985) that Sup and WW thinking of them a couple would be too predictable BEFORE he came up with the idea for Twilight of the Superheroes.
Last edited by Frank Fournier; 01-05-2013 at 01:47 PM.
~ One thousand apologies if I'm using broken English. ~
It just means things change. Ideas change. Ideas evolve. Like Steve was written out as love interest to big brother. Many writers are on record to say Lois and Clark while an important part of the mythos do not need to be married. But did not stop DC from do it officially in canon. Now they saw the need to change it again. I think changes reflect the current culture in literature/entertainment etc. Power couples are bigger today than ever.
Plus we have books looking at Superman as a widower in the Beyond books. Life goes on. Nothing is set in stone and there is no one ending. Nor should it be. Else we'd never have stories.
Last edited by thepenguin; 01-05-2013 at 02:26 PM.
For tomorrow was, in a litterary quality -meaning, a monumental failure on his part. There's no two ways about it. ( yes sales were quite good, but the fact was that he had Jim Lee on art-duties, and his art have sold many a badly written book)
Azzarrello is a fine writer and a gentleman in most other aspects however, and he did help to save the house of one of Superman's creators.
But his shot at Superman was a grave mis-fire... Please accept that, AND that the majority of us online fans feel the same way.
It was a failure in a litterary quality, but a success in a literary sense.
Superhero comic books only become art to the extent that their banal, unrealistic fantasy and garish styles go too far and become interesting. Attempts to ground them in reality can only ruin them.
Things haven't changed that much, but then it's still too early to tell what the real changes will be or if they'll be long lasting. Lois and Clark may not "need" to be married yet they don't need to not be married either, and there's a big difference between not married and not crushing on, dating, in love, etc. The triangle-for-two, which relies on attraction between Lois, Clark, and Superman, is something many of those writers favored in lieu of marriage because it facilitates a prolonged and dynamic chase storyline. The change DC made from the married canon of the Post-Crisis to the un-married canon now is more the result of wanting to tell the story from the beginning. Whether that means long-term, drastic changes are on the horizon remains to be seen. What interests me is Steve Trevor will be featured as a love interest in Amazon and Grant Morrison's Wonder Woman: Earth One and Lois and Superman have sparks in Man of Steel. Both suggest that those relationships haven't lost steam yet.It just means things change. Ideas change. Ideas evolve. Like Steve was written out as love interest to big brother. Many writers are on record to say Lois and Clark while an important part of the mythos do not need to be married. But did not stop DC from do it officially in canon. Now they saw the need to change it again.
They are? Of the pairings in Marvel movies I've seen, such as Iron Man, Thor, and Captain America couples like Pepper Potts and Tony Stark, Thor and Jane, Captain America and Peggy weren't "power couples."I think changes reflect the current culture in literature/entertainment etc. Power couples are bigger today than ever.
Superman as a widower isn't anti-Lois/Clark. Even though Lois isn't alive in the Superman: Beyond, she still has a role in it because Superman's longing and grief for Lois is a part of the story.Plus we have books looking at Superman as a widower in the Beyond books. Life goes on. Nothing is set in stone and there is no one ending. Nor should it be. Else we'd never have stories.
Last edited by misslane38; 01-05-2013 at 03:03 PM.
And as for Superman needing to grieve for Lois as part of the story. I sincerely doubt he is going to let it stop him from living. Hopefully he will not let it become something morbid and emotionally stunt him. If he did then I would say that relationship taught him nothing.
And arguing we will see Steve again has zero to do with superman and wonder woman. Steve blew his chance for now in this book. Diana is choosing to be with Clark. What happens in Morrison's book has nothing to do with the topic. It is just an illustration that stories can be different and have diffferent endings and nothing has to be set in stone. So while Smallville can have Clark and Lois, the new 52 can have him and Diana.
I fact ...it does. It is the current status quo and that is what we are talking about. Not about Lois. You don;t have to see everytime Lois' name mentioned as some desire to jump up and try to argue as if it is some anti clois statement. It is said in the context of superman/wonder woman.
Batman and Catwoman were a power couple and they far more interesting that those couples you mentioned imo. Plus other franchises are about power couples like X-men.
Last edited by thepenguin; 01-05-2013 at 03:21 PM.
I in no way implied that Superman had to be in a perpetual state of grief that involves abandoning life or stunting him. I would like for Superman to move on as well. However, my point was that Beyond isn't a story that dismisses the Superman and Lois relationship or their marriage. It suggests that loving Lois and marrying her is still a part of Superman's story, and that she was his soul mate. In my view, Superman Beyond would have to be set in a more typical continuity setting (e.g. Superman in his 20's) and would have to not utilize the Lois and Clark romance for narrative and emotional substance in order for it to work as convincing proof that the mood has shifted away from Superman and Lois.And as for Superman needing to grieve for Lois as part of the story. I sincerely doubt he is going to let it stop him from living. Hopefully he will not let it become something morbid and emotionally stunt him. If he did then I would say that relationship taught him nothing.
What? You were talking about popular culture so I brought up examples of how both Steve and Lois are still thriving in popular culture as Diana's and Clark's love interests respectively. If popular culture has created a trend where power couples are mainstays, one would think that would be evident in upcoming stories featuring Superman and Wonder Woman. Consequently, the New 52 may be playing with Superman and Wonder Woman now, but there's no guarantee that they'll endure as a couple on the basis of pop culture trends alone which I believe was the gist of your original argument was it not?And arguing we will see Steve again has zero to do with superman and wonder woman. Steve blew his chance for now in this book. Diana is choosing to be with Clark. What happens in Morrison's book has nothing to do with the topic. It is just an illustration that stories can be different and have diffferent endings and nothing has to be set in stone. So while Smallville can have Clark and Lois, the new 52 can have him and Diana.
"Interesting" doesn't matter when we're talking about trends. You argued that power couples were trendy, yet I was able to provide examples of non-power couples in pop culture. Seems to me there's a good mix of both forms of couples, which is why I don't think it's a constructive line of argument. Besides, I could just as easily point to Batman and Catwoman's coupling in Dark Knight Rises as proof that traditional canon couples remain valuable to storytellers like Nolan whose produced Man of Steel tellingly features Lois and Superman romantically.Batman and Catwoman were a power couple and they far more interesting that those couples you mentioned imo. Plus other franchises are about power couples like X-men.
Ultimately any partner for Superman is going to bring companionship for him.
One of the reasons I dont like it...but no, that's actually not the point of the thread.
Irene Adler: “I would have you right here on this desk until you begged for mercy twice.”
Sherlock: “I’ve never begged for mercy in my life.”
If they did get together and had a child in a similar plotline to the creation of Helena Wayne in another universe, just imagine the potential powers of Hippolyta Kent.
It isn't vandalism.Vandalism is destroying a property. Azzarello is improving the property and selling it making it more valuable and giving it acclaim due to great writing, dialogue and the perfect depiction of Wonder Woman with fantastic artwork. If Azzarello hated Wonder Woman he wouldn't write her.It is an act of vandalism, an expression of spite and scorn against the character, an attempt to destroy her and her world.
I hate to get into this boring discussion but there's a clear difference between BatCat and SMWW. BatCat is interesting because it's a dedicated Superhero like Batman getting involved with a criminal whih is interesting and they play off each other as Batman is very serious and Cat Woman is playful and fun. SMWW is two happy supeheroes with similar personalities getting involved win no chemistry at all.Batman and Catwoman were a power couple and they far more interesting that those couples you mentioned imo. Plus other franchises are about power couples like X-men.