How big would you prefer the Bat-family to be? Why?

[Whip Whirlwind]

I still have no clue why they used Shiva and not Deathstroke. They had the perfect opportunity to reintroduce Deathstroke/Nightwing, but instead they go with a weird Lady Shiva. Uhg...

But that would link Dick Grayson to an enemy who is most commonly associated with *GASP* THE TITANS!

HOW DARE YOU SUGGEST SUCH A THING!

/in all seriousness I never thought of that but it would have worked SO much better.

They actually might just go away. I know I am after Morrison is done with Inc.

This. Right now my bat pull list consists of Batman, Inc. , and Nightwing. Batman is losing me fast, Inc. is ending, and Nightwing seems like its going to continue treading the same waters as Dixon / McDaniel, just set in gotham this time.

EDIT: 'Tec is decent though, picking that up since Layman came aboard.

[LostinFandom]

I still think there are at least 2 too many Robins around, and the whole Inc concept has gotta go.

I haven't gotten around to reading Inc yet (I'm years behind), but after TDKR I realized that the whole Inc concept is antithetical to resolution of that story, and I liked that resolution.

That said I want to echo the statement that I would like more one shot stories and shorter arcs. The adding of characters to show time moving on doesn't exactly work when the most famous originals don't age (much). Also while I disagree with batGRRRl4eva's assessment about Helena Bertenelli/Huntress and Kate Kane/Batwoman having too much in common, I would use both character as examples of characters I wish were less tied to the Batman Universe, because they can stand on their own.

[Fate's Faith]

I think that DC will bring back Steph and Cassandra eventually. Right now, DC has gone all in on Barbara, but Cass and Steph fans just aren't going away. I think DC will cave in and bring them back. Maybe not in a Batman Family comic (Spoiler in Teen Titans and Black Bat in Outsiders?), but they'll bring them back.

Obviously there needs to be the title The Batman Family back in print.

[Bluebow]

I don't really see any similarities between the Robins, but there has always been too much confusion about the various Batgirls like their skill sets, intelligence, history etc and there was always confusion about who is the one true Batgirl. So we need only one Batgirl who would be the foremost female in the Batman and that is Barbara Gordon. Since Barbara has always been in various TV shows, movies and games it makes sense to make her the one true Batgirl. Sometime later Barbara Gordon will graduate to becoming Batwoman.

It might be wiser if she picked another name though, I can see Barbara Gordon being called Batwoman causing an outcry similar to the one when it was announced that she was to stop being Oracle and become Batgirl again.

[Fate's Faith]

For whatever reason there is, I don't think there's so much pressure for women as they get older to not be referred to as girl.

[Whip Whirlwind]

My ideal bat family would have a walking oracle (or batgirl) leading BoP. Now I'm just bummed she lost her computer skills.

Overall though I don't think there's any harm in having an extended batfam. They could keep Tim (sorta), Jason, Cass, and Steph on the fringe.

I do wish Dick was treated like a DCU character as opposed to a bat character though.

[The Lucky One]

I do wish Dick was treated like a DCU character as opposed to a bat character though.

Does he actually have any ties to the rest of the DCU anymore, though? My DCnU readership is limited to Earth 2, I, Vampire, Frankenstein, Demon Knights, and All-Star Western, but if I'm correct, there were no previous Teen Titans, right? Cyborg was always with the JLA, Wally West possibly never existed, Starfire doesn't remember him, Raven just debuted, Beast Boy seems entirely different. He was Robin for a much shorter time, only two or three years at the outside. Likely never served with the JLA. One of Dick's biggest strengths pre-reboot was that while everyone respected Batman, they actually liked Nightwing. People would rally behind him, he could connect people.

That's not me pining for past days, mind you, just realistically speaking- does anyone outside the Bat-family really know Dick as much other than "that guy who used to be Robin and is Nightwing now"? I'm genuinely asking -- as I said, I don't follow the nu52 much. But as many have observed, while Batman himself may have stayed relatively unchanged by the reboot, the same definitely can't be said for his supporting cast.

-D

[Mr. Holmes]

They weren't necessarily Teen Titans per say, but Dick had adventures with at least Roy and Starfire (and in my mind others).

[BrotherUnitNo_4]

I like a big Bat family. There are a lot of characters I would like to see used who have been benched.

That said, I think there should be Gotham heroes, who just refuse to work with Batman but are good enough at what they do for Bruce not to bother them.

[Whip Whirlwind]

Does he actually have any ties to the rest of the DCU anymore, though? My DCnU readership is limited to Earth 2, I, Vampire, Frankenstein, Demon Knights, and All-Star Western, but if I'm correct, there were no previous Teen Titans, right? Cyborg was always with the JLA, Wally West possibly never existed, Starfire doesn't remember him, Raven just debuted, Beast Boy seems entirely different. He was Robin for a much shorter time, only two or three years at the outside. Likely never served with the JLA. One of Dick's biggest strengths pre-reboot was that while everyone respected Batman, they actually liked Nightwing. People would rally behind him, he could connect people.

That's not me pining for past days, mind you, just realistically speaking- does anyone outside the Bat-family really know Dick as much other than "that guy who used to be Robin and is Nightwing now"? I'm genuinely asking -- as I said, I don't follow the nu52 much. But as many have observed, while Batman himself may have stayed relatively unchanged by the reboot, the same definitely can't be said for his supporting cast.

-D

Pretty much just what Holmes said. Nightwing supposedly had some adventures with Roy and Starfire (at least).

But I think they would have to rebuild him as that guy who is on everyone's speed dial. New Outsiders book wouldn't be a bad idea.

[ceroxide]

Batman (Bruce Wayne) - the father type figure to all the other Gotham vigilanties, he mostly works with Robin but helps out when others need help
Robin (Damian) - takes care of Gotham and deal just about all cases but only helps either Batman or Blackbat
Blackbat (Cassandra) - goes after the crime families and assassins in Gotham
Batgirl (Barbara Gordon) - handles the more personal affairs of the family (works as an informant) and birds of prey
Nightwing (Dick) - the big brother of the family, when Batman can't do something or needs help Nightwing comes in, when others need help and Batman isn't available Nightwing comes in, and when Batman isn't there Dick takes the cowl of the bat
Red Hood (Jason) - the black ops of the family doing what needs to be done without being found
Batwoman (Kate) - deals with the super natural stuff

that's it I have no need for Flamebird, Spoiler, Catwoman, Red Robin, Batwing, etc.

[hunter_peterson]

Hmm. Is is a tricky question. There's so much history that it feels wrong to make any real declaration, but if you come at it from a reboot perspective, there's a lot of streamlining that could be done, especially with Batman Inc as a concept in play. So, for me:

Batman/Bruce Wayne: in Gotham, looking after the legacy of his parents as its champion. Gordon is Commisioner, Alfred is there. He deals with the classic rogues and whatever else comes up, is on the Justice League, all that. The classic BtAS style Batman.

Robin/Damian Wayne: with his father in Gotham as the sidekick, but more autonomous and with the character growth from Morrison's run intact. He specializes in breaking crazy neon-noir mercenary rings, mostly. He's been around hired killers since birth and he knows them too well for everyone's comfort, including his. Plus... mommy issues.

Batgirl/Stephanie Brown: in Gotham, being the bubbly Bat that goes out during the day and laughs a lot. Being the wisecracking hero she was best as. She specializes in more weird crimes than the others, owing to her father's predilection with clues and trivia. (I know a lot of people disagree, but I'd combine the Cluemaster and Riddler into one character to make her more prominent in the mythos and streamline things.) It'd be more superpower-related locked room mysteries and silly robberies, less triple homicide. And she leads the Teen Titans.

Nightwing/Dick Grayson: head of Batman Inc, out in the world doing what Bruce currently does in that title. It fits with his being the Bat that is the most social and his being the best leader in the DCU. He's also the one the others all have to measure up to, the one who WAS Batman but moved past it. Jason Todd is his personal arch-nemesis as the Red Hood and uses his connections to make life difficult for Batman Inc. And Dick wears blue.

Oracle/Barbara Gordon: still technically paralyzed, but has robotic leg braces that allow her nearly complete function. Walking, something close to running, but not jumping around rooftops. While this is useful, she knows Oracle is much more important a role than Batgirl ever was and continues to operate as such. She's more like The Girl With the Dragon Tattoo in how she operates, with the hacking, perfect memory and occasional surprisingly efficient ass-kicking. She leads the Birds of Prey.

Redbird/Tim Drake: I changed the name because it was lame and I think it's better that he was never technically Robin, as it makes Batman seem disrespectful of Jason's death before his return to have allowed that. That, and the fast food jingle annoys me. He leads the Outsiders and is also primarily global, though much more shadowy about it than Dick.

Birds of Prey: starring Oracle, Black Canary, Starling and Helena Bertinelli/Raptor (maybe Harrier instead?). An elite Batman Inc sub-team focusing on information crime, white collar crime and the social effects of that, such as slavery, sweatshops, human trafficking, all that kind of stuff. Basically, if it's too big to punch, Oracle sends the Birds to tear it apart. They deal with the most difficult problems, really. Problems like the Calculator.

Outsiders: starring Redbird, Black Bat/Cassandra Cain, Metamorpho, Looker, Halo and Katana. They're the black-ops Batman Inc squad, that handles the morally ambiguous aspects of brining justice global. Redbird's planning skills are shown off, like in The Hit List. He's taking it to an almost Cable-like level of domino effect strategizing here. Unlike Batman Inc or the Birds of Prey, or really any super-team, the Outsiders don't aim to SAVE the world, they aim to ENGINEER it. Knock down the first domino and the rest will fall...

Teen Titans: Batgirl, Supergirl, Wondergirl, Impulse, Aqualad, Toyman III/Roboteer and Bunker. They're the Teen Titans, pretty straightforward. Probably more like Young Justice, though, as the line-up focuses on fun. Lighthearted and focusing on friendships with a side of butt-kicking.

Other than that, Batwoman and Catwoman still operate in Gotham but aren't really "in" the family. They're friends of the family, though. And Jason Todd is a villain now, which I mentioned. The rest of the Batman Inc characters appear in the Batman Inc title, of course. They're soldiers in service of the family, but not necessarily privy to its biggest secrets.

Whew. That was fun!

[hunter_peterson]

I may have gotten slightly carried away...

[OberonOsiris]

The one major thing I would have done different in this reboot is dump Jason Todd. He should have stayed dead.

Agree with that.

[sunofdarkchild]

Batman, as the original BTAS version.

Damian as Robin.

Tim as a semi-sidekick who mostly operates on his own and as the leader of a teenage superhero team.

Steph as Spoiler, operating without Batman and Robin's approval but with the approval of everyone else, frequently teaming up with Tim's group and being the primary daytime hero. Also the primary bridge with the Huntress and Tim's girlfriend.

Dick as Nightwing in his own city and a respected member of the Justice League.

Babs as a healed Oracle who only goes on the front lines when things get really serious. Leader of the Birds of Prey and a respected member of the Justice League. Possibly a politician.

Cass as Black Bat, the best agent of Batman INC who gets all the 'tough' assignments.

H. Bertinnelli as the Huntress. The one without a problem killing.

Jason as the dead Robin who never came back.