Should the 2nd amendment (Right to Bear Arms) be Abolished?

[dupont2005]

depending on the state you are in, the law tends to err on the side of caution...if you are intruding in someones home and you are shot or otherwise harmed, it does not matter what your "intent" was

Just because it's a legal kill doesn't mean it was self defense. That guy that executed those two teens recently wasn't doing so to save his life. He wanted to kill a burglar for fun.

[verslibre]

Hey cool

PS sure took a shit, though. I don't hear good things. LQ definitely has a leg up on that place.

[Valerie]

Except its not. She shot an intruder. Nowhere does it say that intruder broke in with the intent to harm. That's your assumption. You may be right, but there's nothing in the story to confirm that. You can't use this as an example of an instance where an intruder broke in with deliberate intent to harm.

I think you're missing one important point. The intruder had already done wrong and done harm just by breaking into someone else's house. It's not as if he just walked in on accident, thinking it was his home.

BTW, I did know someone who was murdered by people who broke in for the sole purpose of killing him. Neighbor of mine in fact, and I lived in a fairly nice area in Northridge.

[SUPERECWFAN1]

Except its not. She shot an intruder. Nowhere does it say that intruder broke in with the intent to harm. That's your assumption. You may be right, but there's nothing in the story to confirm that. You can't use this as an example of an instance where an intruder broke in with deliberate intent to harm.

depending on the state you are in, the law tends to err on the side of caution...if you are intruding in someones home and you are shot or otherwise harmed, it does not matter what your "intent" was

Exactly and take in mind...he's had 6 prior charges against him and one was battery. So ...not a nice guy and no way was the lady gonna take a chance and find out if he was gonna turn and leave.

[dupont2005]

I think you're missing one important point. The intruder had already done wrong and done harm just by breaking into someone else's house. It's not as if he just walked in on accident, thinking it was his home.

Doing wrong and being a threat to someone's life are two different things, and burglary is typically a misdemeanor. Can we legally kill everyone who commits a misdemeanor now?

[verslibre]

I think you're missing one important point. The intruder had already done wrong and done harm just by breaking into someone else's house. It's not as if he just walked in on accident, thinking it was his home.

What's sadly amusing is that he seems to be arguing for the ambiguity of this guy's character, as though he could be some nice chap who meant no harm and only meant to help himself to a sandwich, never mind he committed breaking and entering and has an arrest record.

[dupont2005]

What's sadly amusing is that he seems to be arguing for the ambiguity of this guy's character, as though he could've just been some nice chap who meant no harm and only meant to help himself to a sandwich, never mind he committed breaking and entering and had an arrest record.

Did he have a murder record?

[SUPERECWFAN1]

Did he have a murder record?

As posted one of the charges he had on his record was battery. Now ...do I think he could have likely physically assaulted the lady ? Yes...he likely could have. He already broke into the house and she had to protect herself and children.

I get that people have issues with guns and want restrictions . I understand that part. But if someone breaks into your home , you in no way should have to judge if that person is gonna be nice or bad .

[dupont2005]

I've never hurt anybody and I don't break into people's homes, but I have an arrest record. If anyone ever Zimmerman's me I hope my reputation isn't dragged through the mud by Fox News Nazi's trying to glorify my killer so people don't start talking about how ridiculous the gun laws are.

[thehod]

No, it is not my assumption. It is clearly inferred in the story that he found them in the attic and/or in a crawlspace. Why would he do that? Why would he not just leave the house when he found out people were there? Why would he not grab the closest thing and flee? Was he searching for a package of Q-Tips?

No idea. Perhaps he was looking for hidden valuables?

look, we're dancing round each other here in a pointless semantic argument. I'll concede that it's perfectly likely that he was there to cause harm. I know that happens. However, without knowing that, would you be willing to concede the possibility that he stumbled on the family by accident, and can we put this stupid fucking tangent to bed?

My point, in all of this, is that break ins when people are in residence are rare, violence as a result of a disturbed break in are rarer still, and break ins where the intent is harm are even rarer still. Debating the specifics of one under reported instance doesn't alter those facts, and frankly I'm rather ashamed of myself for getting drawn into this particular strand of the thread so deeply and pointlessly. So with that, I'm gonna leave this particular topic die, ok?

[Walsh06]

Not that incident, but since I only received multiple injuries that kept me out of work for far too long and still cause a great deal of pain, I suppose that's completely okay.

However, I do recall the first (and mercifully only) school lockdown of my elementary school career. A woman was speeding around the school and through the parking lot and playground with the intent of running people over.

Meanwhile, I do find it a bit concerning that some people are more concerned about the danger posed by firearms owned by law-abiding citizens (which is negligible) than they are about the world's leading cause of death among young people.

http://www.who.int/mediacentre/facts.../en/index.html

Uh ya it is better than dieing. If you can't see that then there really is no point in talking to you anymore. Also you provided an example where no one got hurt (I assume you didn't say) so how does that help your case??

[verslibre]

Did he have a murder record?

No murder record. Battery and other charges. Who knows what would have happened if he'd gotten ahold of her gun? She might be a statistic like many on here like to cite, as in "having a handgun in the home means higher likelihood of injury or death by a gunshot," etc.

[Valerie]

Just like a revolver. A revolver with 200 round drop free mags, threaded barrel, optics, combat rounds, and can be bump fired at about 800rpm
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0B7tzaYgp5g

Add a bipod and a rooftop and you can do some damage on a playground. Which is why these guns are used in combat and revolvers typically are not.

The threaded barrel makes possible the use of silencers, flash suppression, and barrel shrouds. Do you know what barrel shrouds are? They're these awful scary devices that keep people from burning their hands on the barrels.

Optics are only terrible to people who think shooters who can't aim very well are somehow safer than people who only shoot what they're aiming at.

Really, I think the only thing that someone bent on committing a massacre would find useful is the extended magazine, which is more likely to jam, and oh, maybe the barrel shroud. You know what else is used in combat? 9mm semiautomatic pistols.

[thehod]

What's sadly amusing is that he seems to be arguing for the ambiguity of this guy's character, as though he could be some nice chap who meant no harm and only meant to help himself to a sandwich, never mind he committed breaking and entering and has an arrest record.

That's exactly not what I've been arguing. At all.

[verslibre]

My point, in all of this, is that break ins when people are in residence are rare, violence as a result of a disturbed break in are rarer still, and break ins where the intent is harm are even rarer still. Debating the specifics of one under reported instance doesn't alter those facts, and frankly I'm rather ashamed of myself for getting drawn into this particular strand of the thread so deeply and pointlessly. So with that, I'm gonna leave this particular topic die, ok?

Yes, yes, yes, we get it. We know what you're saying. And thank you.