Should the 2nd amendment (Right to Bear Arms) be Abolished?

**Michael P** · 01-04-2013, 02:43 PM

Meanwhile, a burning of "violent" video games, movies and CDs is still on schedule for the 12th.

**thwhtGuardian** · 01-04-2013, 08:09 PM

Originally Posted by fly on the wall

Huh? Declaring that car-driving is not a right is some kind of debate point? People use cars and guns to kill people; these are comparable. Now you could say that people kill people with cars accidentally, while people use guns to kill people on purpose, if intent is what you are interested in. But don't forget that cars kill many more people than guns do; forget intent let's just go for body count. Drunk Driving kills more people than guns do so alcohol kills more people than guns. Since alcohol kills more people than guns lets outlaw alcohol as well as guns. What's that you say? We outlawed alcohol before and it didn't work? Well lets try it again anyway. Maybe we'll get it right this time.

On the other hand outlawing alcohol lead to a rise in death by guns. It's all interwoven in a tapestry of death; heavy.

In 2012 there were 31,236 gun related deaths in the US, and 32,885 automobile related deaths(10,228 attributed to drunk driving).

When you look at those numbers alone you'd say they were just as deadly, but you have to take into consideration the fact that many, many more people own cars than they do fire arms which makes that 32K in automobile deaths a smaller percentage than gun related deaths are.

Just so we're clear, 92% homes in the US have a car while only 32% have a gun. So that 32% is killing almost as much as that 92%...which is why the comparison doesn't work despite the similar numbers of fatalities.

**The Angry Comic Book Critic** · 01-04-2013, 08:30 PM

Originally Posted by Michael P

Meanwhile, a burning of "violent" video games, movies and CDs is still on schedule for the 12th.

That is fucking insane I play violent video games all the time ever since I was about 6 or 7 and it never made me want to go out and kill people there blaming stuff that has nothing to do with the shooting

**thwhtGuardian** · 01-04-2013, 08:49 PM

Originally Posted by Michael P

Meanwhile, a burning of "violent" video games, movies and CDs is still on schedule for the 12th.

Are they giving better rates then Gamestop?

I mean, the purge is dumb...but I have some old games I wouldn't mind unloading if the price was right.

**Iangould** · 01-04-2013, 09:02 PM

Originally Posted by The Angry Comic Book Critic

That is fucking insane I play violent video games all the time ever since I was about 6 or 7 and it never made me want to go out and kill people there blaming stuff that has nothing to do with the shooting

Whereas I never play violent games and regularly feel the urge to kill.

**verslibre** · 01-04-2013, 09:52 PM

All those long hours selling comics do that to you?

**verslibre** · 01-04-2013, 09:56 PM

A woman hiding in her attic with her kids blew away an intruder. This "burglar" must have had more on his mind than just making off with some valuables, or else he would never have been on the receiving end of a .38!

http://www.wsbtv.com/news/news/local...ntruder/nTm7s/

LOGANVILLE, Ga. — A woman hiding in her attic with children shot an intruder multiple times before fleeing to safety Friday.

The incident happened at a home on Henderson Ridge Lane in Loganville around 1 p.m. The woman was working in an upstairs office when she spotted a strange man outside a window, according to Walton County Sheriff Joe Chapman. He said she took her 9-year-old twins to a crawlspace before the man broke in using a crowbar.

But the man eventually found the family.

"The perpetrator opens that door. Of course, at that time he's staring at her, her two children and a .38 revolver..."

**Jeff Brady** · 01-04-2013, 10:00 PM

Originally Posted by verslibre

A woman hiding in her attic with her kids blew away an intruder. This "burglar" must have had more on his mind than just making off with some valuables, or else he would never have been on the receiving end of a .38!

http://www.wsbtv.com/news/news/local...ntruder/nTm7s/

Is a .38 revolver a semi-automatic weapon with the capability of firing 30 bullets in a minute?

**verslibre** · 01-04-2013, 10:17 PM

Originally Posted by Jeff Brady

Is a .38 revolver a semi-automatic weapon with the capability of firing 30 bullets in a minute?

Is that a serious question?

**kmeyers** · 01-04-2013, 10:24 PM

Originally Posted by verslibre

A woman hiding in her attic with her kids blew away an intruder. This "burglar" must have had more on his mind than just making off with some valuables, or else he would never have been on the receiving end of a .38!

http://www.wsbtv.com/news/news/local...ntruder/nTm7s/

This just sounds like such bullshit. What is the percentage of home intruders who are there to stalk you instead of just rob you. Like .000001 come into your house to search your entire house to eventually find your hiding place wall panel. You've seen too many action movies.

**finfangfool** · 01-04-2013, 10:32 PM

That's one case of a gun being used for self-defense. And while I'm happy for the woman and the children in this case, I'm sure you'd agree that people can and have provided many more examples of guns either being used carelessly or maliciously that would be just as anecdotal but on the opposite side of the coin.

As for the car death vs gun death debate, as I said (much earlier in the thread) we should (and really have) be treating gun ownership like car ownership in the training, licensing, and responsibiliities that entails. Society has already moved away from the orginal intent of the 2nd amendment on gun ownership. Originally they didn't want a standing army but rather loose militias that could assemble at a moments notice by grabbing their rifles at the front door and assembling at a pre-arranged spot. Like the terrorist organizations our military is fighting in the Middle East, they wanted our fighters to be out of uniform so they couldn't be singled out. Almost two and a half centuries later understandably a lot has changed. Aircraft, missiles, submarines, satellites, nuclear/biological/chemical weaponry, etc. "Arms" aren't what they were in the late 18th century. Obviously nobody in their right mind wants a blanket right to bear "arms" in the 21st century.

The primary reason for the 2nd amendment is obsolete. The weaponry that exists today is too powerful to be entrusted to the average citizen (some might argue to the government and military as well). Sane, rational citizens have to accept the fact that if the government turns tyrannical (and not "I have to pay for health care instead of waiting to use the emergency room" tyrannical but truly bad) then we're not going to change that with rifles and handguns. We (as a society) have slowly evolved our stance on gun ownership to include registration, safety courses, laws on where and when they can be used, and how powerful they can be in ways that show the 2nd amendment isn't as simple as it's stated (or if it is we're ignoring it as a country). But that outdated amendment is still there, and now we have a powerful gun lobby to protect it. You have truly insane, paranoid people who believe if they give in an inch towards sanity then the next step is loading us into concentration camps and selling our country to the UN (which shows how little they know about the power and competency of the UN).

So we have to live with gun ownership in this country (attempting to round all weapons up would lead to too much death and add to the distrust of government, which would in turn lead to more domestic terrorism). Given that, those of us who aren't afraid of a government tyranny we wouldn't be able to fight off with the weapons at hand if it popped into existence anyway would like to mitigate the inevitable death and hardship that's going to come from that fact. If that means more laws, fine. Better enforcement of existing laws, good. Hopefully they develop non-lethal weapons that can incapacitate an attacker more effectively than the tasers, bean bag guns, etc. we have now and give people a real choice. Something like the Star Trek phaser stun-mode. Then we can put these things away for good and look back on them as a sad part of our early history.

**verslibre** · 01-04-2013, 11:10 PM

Originally Posted by kmeyers

This just sounds like such bullshit. What is the percentage of home intruders who are there to stalk you instead of just rob you. Like .000001 come into your house to search your entire house to eventually find your hiding place wall panel. You've seen too many action movies.

I guess you're right. That story is bullshit. So stick that pipe in your mouth, Sherlock, and get your chair-hugging ass over there and find out what the REAL story is. I'm sure what was reported and what actually happened are as night and day.

**thehod** · 01-04-2013, 11:58 PM

Originally Posted by verslibre

I guess you're right. That story is bullshit. So stick that pipe in your mouth, Sherlock, and get your chair-hugging ass over there and find out what the REAL story is. I'm sure what was reported and what actually happened are as night and day.

Nobody has said these things don't happen. They are saying that it is an extremely rare occurrence. Even if you could dredge up 1000 examples of this, in a country of 300 million, it is still an extremely rare occurrence.