Nearly twenty dead at school shooting

[Blade X]

So self deference is forbidden, and I shoot pistols at a range my Rifles I shoot on private property.Buy unless fired from onerously big guns rubber bullets are useless and if fired at ranges common in self defense they are lethal, ask the Israeli and that Palestinians about that

Where in my post did I say or imply that self defense should be forbidden?? I'm all for people using guns to defend themselves,their family,and their homes. All I'm saying is that those civilians shouldn't be allowed to buy fully or semi automatic guns and lethal ammo to do so. And yes, I know that rubber bullets can kill in certain instances. I could care less about criminals who break into someones home being killed by law abiding citizens with guns firing rubber or bean bag bullets. I'm not some bleeding heart liberal. Again, I'm talking about making the guns and ammo LESS lethal in the unfortunate event that they fall into the hands of a psycho @$$hole. I'm pretty sure (but I could be wrong) that if that psycho in Connecticut was using rubber bullets, the number of dead victims might not have been as high.

And unless you are a license hunter in a rural wooded area, I don't think that anyone should be firing their guns on their private property.

The current market price for my target rifle would be about 5000$, and that is not nearly the high end. I don;t think that you have any idea how much money you are taling about. My grandfathers .45 since it was made before WWI would be worth even more. My wifes bumb in the night gun was made in 1897 and is as dealy as anything you can buy today and is a colectors item also but I have no idea what a 1897 Winchester Trench Broom would sell for today. My situation is not unualusal for much of the US, especial rural areas guns are a part of the culture and have been longer that there has been a US

Again, the government should either pay people the full price for the value of their guns or give them a huge tax break (or let them skip paying property and/or state taxes to cover the value of their guns) if they want to reduce the number of guns available to civilians who legally acquired their guns. If they don't want to pay, then those people should be allowed to keep the guns and ammo that they bought before this type law was passed.

Before you proposes changers to peoples legal rights you might want to learn something about the subject you are talking about

Well considering the fact that I'm not a politician or have any influence over any political leaders, I don't have to learn anything in order to talk about he subject on a message board.

[Vibranium]

the Assault Weapons Ban is being bought up before Congress in 2013

but considering that the Democratic Party took a serious beating after the last one was passed in '94, we'll see how much support it REALLY gets

[dupont2005]

http://news.yahoo.com/ind-man-47-gun...164928349.html
But he needed all 47 guns. To hunt, and protect his home!

[Nick Soapdish]

the Assault Weapons Ban is being bought up before Congress in 2013

but considering that the Democratic Party took a serious beating after the last one was passed in '94, we'll see how much support it REALLY gets

The Democratic Party took a beating for several reasons. Likewise, Gore proposed a gun ban, but that doesn't mean it's why he lost. I think that it's more likely that he lost due to his weak environmental record (yes, even him). He sat on the fence about an airport expansion into the Everglades, trying to cultivate the Hispanic vote since it would've benefited a Cuban community near the Everglades, but it also made environmentalists suspicious of him and may have cost him a few thousand votes to Nader.

However, with his loss the Democrats basically gave up on gun control as a national issue. Local politicians (by which I am including those on a national stage, but only have to answer to a single district of voters) still pursue it, but most senators had bailed and so did Kerry and Obama. Although that looks to be changing now.

[dupont2005]

http://news.yahoo.com/blogs/lookout/...182416799.html
They're coming out of the woodwork now.

[Vibranium]

http://news.yahoo.com/blogs/lookout/...182416799.html
They're coming out of the woodwork now.

Police cleared the area after about an hour, but the night services have been cancelled, and it looks like the vigil may be cancelled as well

not to mention that there are rumors swirling that the WBC will be in town next weekend, so folks are trying to organize a counter protest to that....our roller derby league is involved

[Vibranium]

Lt. Paul Vance - spokesmen for the CT State Police - is giving a presser now, updating information, President Obama will be in Newtown, CT this evening

advised that anyone making threats, harassing victims families, or interfering with funerals/vigils and so on will be arrested and prosecuted to the fullest extent of the law and that comes with the backing of our AG

[dupont2005]

Police cleared the area after about an hour, but the night services have been cancelled, and it looks like the vigil may be cancelled as well

not to mention that there are rumors swirling that the WBC will be in town next weekend, so folks are trying to organize a counter protest to that....our roller derby league is involved

Any word on the guy in camo gear that was arrested in the woods outside the school right after the shooting?

[Vibranium]

Any word on the guy in camo gear that was arrested in the woods outside the school right after the shooting?

he was a local man, he was not arrested, he was questioned and it turned out he lived nearby and was chopping wood

but it was in the immediate area so anyone in that area would be stopped/detained

[Vibranium]

Unleash the hounds!!!

http://gizmodo.com/5968886/anonymous...uneral-protest

"Since your one-dimensional thought protocol will conform not to any modern logic, we will not debate, argue, or attempt to reason with you. Instead, we have unanimously deemed your organization to be harmful to the population of The United States of America, and have therefore decided to execute an agenda of action which will progressively dismantle your institution of deceitful pretext and extreme bias, and cease when your zealotry runs dry. We recognize you as serious opponents, and do not expect our campaign to terminate in a short period of time. Attrition is our weapon, and we will waste no time, money, effort, and enjoyment, in tearing your resolve into pieces, as with exposing the incongruity of your distorted faith."

[bipolar danger girl]

Oh damn. I guess it's because you're not in Canada. I'll just write out for you.

1 1/2 oz. fruit flavoured liquor
2oz. vodka
2oz. white cranberry juice
big bunch of cotton candy

Mix the liquids in a cocktail shaker. (With ice?)
Place lots of cotton candy in a martini glass.
Pour drink over cotton candy.

This sounds de-fucking-lish, but actual cotton candy has been banned from my body... however, cotton candy alcohol is perfectly acceptable! Thank you. *twirl*

...Are people seriously talking about arming teachers?

Does anyone else think that's a seriously bad idea?

Oh! Pick me! Pick me! I do! I do!

Look, obviously the tragedy itself is disenheartening. The fallout between pro-gun advocates, and gun-control advocates in its wake sure isn't anything that unites us together, either. But you know what can bring us together?

Our ability to all agree that the followers of Rev. Fred Phelps are ***holes.

Westboro Baptist Church are planning to protest at the Sandy Hook Funerals. Anyone in the area willing to form the counter-protest "angel walls" that have become the norm, with extreme patience against these monstrous bigots, please do so, and know you will have my own deepest personal affection for preventing them from getting at the grieving families.

The Westoboro Baptist Church are known for being fucktards...
What's even crazier to me are the people Fox News pundits like Mike Huckabee who are blaming the schools for this. (paraphrasing)Well, if you keep God out of schools, don't be surprised when Satan shows up...

FUCK YOU. These people are just as bad, if not worse, because at least EVERYONE accepts that the WBC is batshit crazy. This asshole was a presidential candidate.

Speaking of fuck yous...

http://www.dailykos.com/story/2012/1...m-therf-ckers#

They better not put prayers back in schools, because I do not want to home-school my children. They're going to be fucked up enough, thank you very much.

And it's not like enacting new legislation when people are pissed and emotional in the wake of a tragedy could result in *bad* law.

I mean, that's exactly what Congress did after 9/11, and we got the PATRIOT Act. And everybody agrees that that worked out great.

Yes, that was a load of bullshit. Watching from Canada, I can tell you Canadians were horrified by the Bush administrations actions after 9/11. Canadians went from posting American flags on their front lawns in a declaration of love and support, to protesting the war and wanting to burn those same flags. What a fucking waste.

I still think the time for action is now, even if that action is just communicating and brain storming. You have a giant beautiful brain, you should totally fix our mental health and gun problem.

Gun ownership in Canada is about 30% compared to between 45 and 50% in the U.S. However Americans own about 88 guns per hundred citizens compared to around 31 per hundred for Canada.

Given the difference in population you come close to an order of magnitude difference.

I lived in Canada for 30 years, and never knew anyone who owned a handgun. Can't hunt moose with a handgun!

[Iangould]

Gun ownership in Canada is about 30% compared to between 45 and 50% in the U.S. However Americans own about 88 guns per hundred citizens compared to around 31 per hundred for Canada.

Given the difference in population you come close to an order of magnitude difference.

Canada also prohibits most high-capacity magazines; severely restricts handguns and has much tougher licensing requirements.

[dupont2005]

I don't know why gun legislation is thought to be such an impossible thing, or why the assault weapons ban is the only piece of legislation people point to when discussing it. Most of us here are old enough to remember a time when machine guns were legal. My dad owned machine guns. They were banned during Reagan's second term. Now we just live our lives knowing machine guns are for the most part banned (FFL licenses, tax stamps, trusts, and pre-'86 weapon loopholes in some states, still very uncommon and essentially banned for the most part). Nobody seriously trying to repeal it, nobody acting like the second amendment was destroyed by it. Pass new legislation, give it two years, and it will be an accepted part of life. Except for within the GOP ranks, but I have a feeling if their party doesn't reform in a major way their opinion isn't going to matter at all in the near future. One of my earlier memories is watching the news with my dad right after the machine gun ban. Civilians turning in their machine guns. Maybe it was a California thing, since those weapons would have been grandfathered in. Maybe they were just good citizens. I don't know. Just funny how I don't remember that happening in '97 with the assault weapon ban.

[Charles RB]

I just lost a Facebook friend over THIS. I mean, I'm totally okay with that, but I'm still just wondering... why would anyone follow Huckabee's lead on this?

Because then they don't have to think about why the shooting might really have taken place. Better yet, they don't have to realise there was absolutely no narrative reason for the deaths, there is no 'moral' reason why this school was shot up and not another place the killer's mum might've gone, and this could just as easily happen to them or someone they know.

As for the specific tragedy, since the gun regime is so liberal in this country, I do believe that people should have a handgun for self-defence (again, with proper control and regular training) and that if that had been the case in Newtown the attacker would have been stopped before killing 20 kids and half a dozen adults.

More likely the killer would've gunned down the adults with handguns. To stop him, they have to be able to shoot him first, badly enough to take him down fast, and in the right place (IIRC he had some body armour on), and all that when panicked, and all that when they're not mentally prepared to kill someone. The shooter, on the other hand, wants to kill, has a more powerful gun, and wasn't bothered about dying.

[Spike-X]

Concerning Switzerland keep in mind that if there is a lot of weapons around it's mostly because of their defense system. Not sure they have an actual army but instead a system of quick mobilization. That's why people have weapons at home.

So it's a kind of well-regulated militia, basically?