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  1. #571
    Elder Member BrotherUnitNo_4's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Majin Gojira View Post
    Because Silence is Acceptance. If one does not complain about something they dislike, then no change will occur. We have a book that speaks to some of the worst aspects of the mainstream comic medium in the last 20 years. I do not wish to see those thing perpetuated, so to remain silent on it would be counterproductive. Further, if the arguments against such things are not refined and honed, they will not be very effective.
    Silence does not mean acceptance.

    By extending the life of this thread you're only giving the book more (free) publicity. I would have expected it to die about 2 days ago. You're actively getting people more interested in this book that's causing so much commotion. You're letting your issues with the premise get in the way of basic logic. You don't hurt Marvel with angry words. You hurt them with sales. Ignoring the book actually is the best course of action. If there's no interest, no one will buy the book. The book will get cancelled.

    You need to lighten up and let it go. This isn't some great social crusade. This isn't some crime against humanity. It's ONE BOOK in a sea of hundreds (Diamond) in a sea of thousands of comics (global) that are released every week. There are more than enough other books that do positive things for the medium to offset one Avengers Arena on shelves. If the issue is really that important to you, rather than spending days trying to tear down this book, you should be pointing people towards the books you think advance the medium. I could be wrong but I don't think you've made a single post giving an alternative to this book. Until you do, your posts will mean nothing in the long-term.
    Currently reading She-Hulk, Deadpool, Swamp Thing, Ms. Marvel

    Probation: Ghost Rider, Loki: LoA, Secret Avengers

    Looking forward to All-New Ultimates, Flash Gordon and Doctor Mirage.

  2. #572
    Completely sauced... klinton's Avatar
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    Everyone's pretty much agreed on the obvious situation here (in that this is a VR program). Can we move off from the 'woe is me for people are dying' BS now?

    Step back and appreciate the character moments that are being offered here. Nothing brings out interesting development than absolute crisis and tradgedy. These characters will all be enriched as this series progresses. I, for one, already have a soft spot for Mettel that I never had before.

    It's not about the death and killing. It's about the people who trancend it.
    Freedom is merely the ability to live without fear of persecution.

  3. #573
    Curiosity Seaker Majin Gojira's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by BrotherUnitNo_4 View Post
    Silence does not mean acceptance.
    Yes, it does by the oldest measures of tallying votes: Athenian Democracy. It has held true since then.

    By extending the life of this thread you're only giving the book more (free) publicity. I would have expected it to die about 2 days ago. You're actively getting people more interested in this book that's causing so much commotion. You're letting your issues with the premise get in the way of basic logic. You don't hurt Marvel with angry words. You hurt them with sales. Ignoring the book actually is the best course of action. If there's no interest, no one will buy the book. The book will get cancelled.
    Battlefield Earth got hellacious reviews and is continually mocked online. Did that benefit from the "free publicity"? How about the campaign against "the Last Airbender"? Did that give it a boost? (admittedly, it had more to complain about and more legitimately so)

    Birdademic did, however, but that was the plan there. It planned to be panned.

    You need to lighten up and let it go. This isn't some great social crusade. This isn't some crime against humanity. It's ONE BOOK in a sea of hundreds (Diamond) in a sea of thousands of comics (global) that are released every week. There are more than enough other books that do positive things for the medium to offset one Avengers Arena on shelves. If the issue is really that important to you, rather than spending days trying to tear down this book, you should be pointing people towards the books you think advance the medium. I could be wrong but I don't think you've made a single post giving an alternative to this book. Until you do, your posts will mean nothing in the long-term.
    I understand that in the great scheme off things, it is meaningless. Talking about good comics and giving them praise is something I actually try and avoid unless I can say something substantive. Just saying "it's good!" is meaningless. If someone else expressed the point well, there's not much I can add beyond 'Me too!" and I dislike that.

    And I have made points to alternatives in other posts elsewhere, but if you want to be assured - from Marvel there's DeConnick's Avengers Assemble, Hawkeye, X-Factor & Scarlet Spider (though Minimum carnage was lackluster). Young Avengers and Fearless Defenders look very fun too. I know I'm forgeting some just from Marvel alone . . .

    Everyone's pretty much agreed on the obvious situation here (in that this is a VR program). Can we move off from the 'woe is me for people are dying' BS now?
    It's sort of moved towards an anlysis of the pros and cons o ff the issue itself as the death was rather bland, IMO.

    Step back and appreciate the character moments that are being offered here.
    I did like the small amount of time they spent at Academy. That was actually well done. Then Arcade showed up and everything went down hill.

    Nothing brings out interesting development than absolute crisis and tradgedy.
    Unfortunately, we've seen that development before and this situtaiton added nothing. It just re-told what happened before in a poorer manner.

    These characters will all be enriched as this series progresses. I, for one, already have a soft spot for Mettel that I never had before.
    You should read the "Fear Itself" run of Academy. Same beats, better overall tale.

    It's not about the death and killing. It's about the people who trancend it.
    I saw it TRY to do that, but then undermine and stumble over itself and its love of Arcade.
    Last edited by Majin Gojira; 12-16-2012 at 09:16 AM.
    "Curse you, Occam's Razor! You have betrayed me!"

    Reviewing is a lot like paleontology: the evidence is there, but no one seems to agree on it.

  4. #574
    Pure Hellcatnip Lady_Alternate's Avatar
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    We get it. You don't like the book. The majority of the people posting in the thread do. We don't need to keep going over that again and again.

    From Matt's Avengers Forum Rules & Directory:

    • Repetitive arguments are unnecessary. If you have to repeat the same argument more than once YOU ARE DONE. Move on. You're not going to convince the other person that they're wrong.
    Women are beautiful. But we're not here for your goddamn titillation.- junesdisco

  5. #575
    Veteran Member JaggedFel's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SayOcean View Post
    I liked Mettle more than I like Martian Manhunter, or whatever homosexual innuendo he goes by......


    and I don't like Mettle much,

    but killing the brown guy first is hilarious.....not sure if they were doing a commentary of horror genres in general or just killing him off to show how "noble" he is, but the "black" guy dying first has got to either make you laugh or scratch your head....or keep reading on, cause it is the norm for you
    Makes me laugh and think the writer is a Hack personally. Especially when the only one dies first.
    Black History Month & 29 Days in February

  6. #576
    Curiosity Seaker Majin Gojira's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lady_Alternate View Post
    We get it. You don't like the book. The majority of the people posting in the thread do. We don't need to keep going over that again and again.

    From Matt's Avengers Forum Rules & Directory:
    I understand that (rather recently) and have been doing my best to avoid that over the last two days and am only repeating points now because I was directly asked, trying to limit the comments to only new information or adding to/discussing speculation on the whole VR thing.

    But I will back off further as requested.

    I'll add this -- Arena's announcement got me to realize just how much I liked the Academy kids in the first place. I always realize these things when it's too late.
    "Curse you, Occam's Razor! You have betrayed me!"

    Reviewing is a lot like paleontology: the evidence is there, but no one seems to agree on it.

  7. #577
    Veteran Member infernohara's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Venom Melendez View Post
    But Arcade is a killer and his motivation right now is for his Murderwolrd to finally kill some heroes. So i don't think it's a trick or a test. He has no reason to keep them alive.



    The first issue focused on Hazmat and Mettle and the next issue will focus on Ryker. But the others kids didn't just stand around, they just stopped attacking when they noticed they weren't doing much damage.

    As for Tracking Juston's Sentinel, so far Arcade has taken every necessary precaution, you don't think he would have dealt with that too?
    Arcade's motivation is always to kill someone. Killing all these characters is to high profile for a guy like him. To actually have all Superheroes come after him for what hes doing makes no sense to me. If it was mere revenge for his earlier failure with the AA students, I'd understand, but its like he doesn't even remember that he did anything with them just a few short months ago. Thats a red flag in itself.

    Only a hand full of students did anything. I can see a few of them surveying the situation, but not most of them. He couldn't get any students from JGS, his precautions aren't all that high. If Sentinel is missing Pym and crew would know.

  8. #578
    Veteran Member Venom Melendez's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by klinton View Post
    Everyone's pretty much agreed on the obvious situation here (in that this is a VR program).
    But it isn't obvious at all and not everyone is agreed, that is just a fan theory. It doesn't fit with Arcade's current MO, so i don't see why he'd go with a VR.

    Quote Originally Posted by infernohara View Post
    Arcade's motivation is always to kill someone. Killing all these characters is to high profile for a guy like him. To actually have all Superheroes come after him for what hes doing makes no sense to me. If it was mere revenge for his earlier failure with the AA students, I'd understand, but its like he doesn't even remember that he did anything with them just a few short months ago. Thats a red flag in itself.
    Arcade has gone after the X-Men, the Fantastic Four,Hercules and the Ghost Rider. Nothing is too high profile for him. And who says he doesn't remember the previous encounter with the Academy kid? He brought other heroes, so it wouldn't be just revenge. But i'm sure it's a nice bonus for him.

    Quote Originally Posted by infernohara View Post

    Only a hand full of students did anything. I can see a few of them surveying the situation, but not most of them. He couldn't get any students from JGS, his precautions aren't all that high. If Sentinel is missing Pym and crew would know.
    They did say that the other heroes on the outside would be looking for the kids. Doesn't mean Pym will find them and they won't know until after Christmas.
    Quote Originally Posted by Lonewolf36 View Post
    His last appearance, though not much of one, was in Secret Avengers #29 where he is the Bartender of a super villain bar in the nation of Bagalia.
    He owns the bar too. Makes me wonder if he is letting the villains place bets on this.
    Last edited by Venom Melendez; 12-17-2012 at 02:47 PM.

  9. #579
    Ghostly Roboto Ebon Phantom's Avatar
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    Alright read. Art was very nice and I'm starting to enjoy the powered up Arcade. But the premise is still boring, and a little predictable if the ending really comes down to those two.

  10. #580
    Senior Member protege's Avatar
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    So, i got issue #1 in the mail today, and read it, against my better judgement. And wouldn't you know it, I found a couple of characters I'd be interested in knowing more about; Cullen Bloodstone, andd Kid britian. But, no point in getting interested in them, because chances are, they'll both be dead before this thing is over. So glad i won't be buying this again.

  11. #581
    Veteran Member infernohara's Avatar
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    Arcade hasn't said anything in reference to his last arc with the Academy students. At the very least he could've said something to Reptil.
    I'm also sure the other heroes will come soon, but it seemed that they were just "out" for now, not gone for days. Finesse has no concrete family so why'd he miss her? How did he trick Jocasta? Unless this Murderworld is affecting time and space then it leaves a lot of questions.

  12. #582
    Veteran Member Venom Melendez's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by infernohara View Post
    Arcade hasn't said anything in reference to his last arc with the Academy students. At the very least he could've said something to Reptil.
    I'm also sure the other heroes will come soon, but it seemed that they were just "out" for now, not gone for days. Finesse has no concrete family so why'd he miss her? How did he trick Jocasta? Unless this Murderworld is affecting time and space then it leaves a lot of questions.
    Finesse does have a family, which is why she wasn't at the Academy, she probably went home for the holidays or she's spending it with Quicksilver, either way, Finesse wasn't there. The only ones at the Academy were the ones that pretty much live there. Probably why Arcade went after them during the Holiday break, as Mettle pointed out, the others students went home and the teachers were at a Christmas party.

  13. #583
    THE SUPERIOR MEMBER! USERNAME TAKEN's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by BrotherUnitNo_4 View Post
    Silence does not mean acceptance.

    By extending the life of this thread you're only giving the book more (free) publicity. I would have expected it to die about 2 days ago. You're actively getting people more interested in this book that's causing so much commotion. You're letting your issues with the premise get in the way of basic logic. You don't hurt Marvel with angry words. You hurt them with sales. Ignoring the book actually is the best course of action. If there's no interest, no one will buy the book. The book will get cancelled.

    You need to lighten up and let it go. This isn't some great social crusade. This isn't some crime against humanity. It's ONE BOOK in a sea of hundreds (Diamond) in a sea of thousands of comics (global) that are released every week. There are more than enough other books that do positive things for the medium to offset one Avengers Arena on shelves. If the issue is really that important to you, rather than spending days trying to tear down this book, you should be pointing people towards the books you think advance the medium. I could be wrong but I don't think you've made a single post giving an alternative to this book. Until you do, your posts will mean nothing in the long-term.
    Very well said.
    Adults struggle desperately with fiction, demanding constantly that it conform to the rules of everyday life when the answer is obvious to the smallest child: because it's not real. - Grant Morrison

  14. #584
    Junior Member Huskie's Avatar
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    My suggestion to everyone who is reallllllllllly against this book based on concept alone (Me included), is to buy Young Avengers. I think if the sales of that book rapidly outpace this one it sends a pretty clear message to Marvel about what kind of book readers want to see young heroes in.

    I'm still hoping this whole thing is VR, the Beyonder, or some kind of Contest of Champions, where "death" = being pulled out of the game.

  15. #585
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    Quote Originally Posted by BrotherUnitNo_4 View Post
    Silence does not mean acceptance.

    By extending the life of this thread you're only giving the book more (free) publicity. I would have expected it to die about 2 days ago. You're actively getting people more interested in this book that's causing so much commotion. You're letting your issues with the premise get in the way of basic logic. You don't hurt Marvel with angry words. You hurt them with sales. Ignoring the book actually is the best course of action. If there's no interest, no one will buy the book. The book will get cancelled.

    You need to lighten up and let it go. This isn't some great social crusade. This isn't some crime against humanity. It's ONE BOOK in a sea of hundreds (Diamond) in a sea of thousands of comics (global) that are released every week. There are more than enough other books that do positive things for the medium to offset one Avengers Arena on shelves. If the issue is really that important to you, rather than spending days trying to tear down this book, you should be pointing people towards the books you think advance the medium. I could be wrong but I don't think you've made a single post giving an alternative to this book. Until you do, your posts will mean nothing in the long-term.
    Well said.

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