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  1. #31
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    Are we also forgetting that we have been in the midst of a financial crises since 2008? It's one thing to keep loyal readers through these times, because they are familiar with the stories, but if you'd like to start a new hobby (reading comics), then you'd have to make an investment. Figuring out which comics you like, maybe reading some back issues. Even if the costs of these things are not incredibly high, the percieved costs of starting a new hobby can seem high for somebody who would like to go into comics, but has no idea how to industry works.

    I think all in all, holding on to this many customers is great.

  2. #32
    1906 Xistel's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Spekstar View Post
    Are we also forgetting that we have been in the midst of a financial crises since 2008? It's one thing to keep loyal readers through these times, because they are familiar with the stories, but if you'd like to start a new hobby (reading comics), then you'd have to make an investment. Figuring out which comics you like, maybe reading some back issues. Even if the costs of these things are not incredibly high, the perceived costs of starting a new hobby can seem high for somebody who would like to go into comics, but has no idea how to industry works.

    I think all in all, holding on to this many customers is great.
    Sure, but Marvel hasn't been doing much in the way of attracting new readers, with these high prices. And although it's true what you say about the crisis, some books are up, other are down, so it's all relative
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  3. #33
    Senior Member Chris S.'s Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by CaptainMarvell View Post
    They need to do another shake up.
    I couldn't disagree with you more on this. The Ultimates line needs to calm down and tell some solid stories. All the shakes up and crossovers are making it so there is no consistency in the book. Maybe I'd like Miles more if he had some more time to develop without an event.

    Personally- I'm so sick of events. It isn't even funny anymore.

    Quote Originally Posted by Plawsky View Post
    Titles that Ultimate Spider-man is outselling:

    Daredevil
    Batwoman
    Hawkeye
    Animal Man
    Wolverine
    Secret Avengers
    Supergirl
    Venom
    X-Men
    It is incredible that Daredevil isn't selling well. If you enjoy solid books what Waid is doing is incredible. Do yourself a favor and pick it up.

    Quote Originally Posted by Plawsky View Post
    Sales aren't great, no one's going to say they are. But they're fine. And more importantly, they're steady. People keep talking about the huge drop since the book launched, but it also launched with a lot of hype. It's since started to plateau, and has been hovering around 40k for months.
    But the numbers say otherwise on the plateau issue. USM has dropped about a 1000 readers for three months. That isn't a lot, but when you are only selling a 40k it looks bad. If it had plateu'd I'd agree, but it is still slowly dropping.


    In response to Marvel dropping sales:
    Quote Originally Posted by Plawsky View Post
    Saying this in several different threads doesn't make it true.
    Not to mention it has been on its rise. DC took a huge bump after the New 52 launched, but all those things have changed drastically.
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  4. #34
    Senior Member Chris S.'s Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Xistel View Post
    Sure, but Marvel hasn't been doing much in the way of attracting new readers, with these high prices. And although it's true what you say about the crisis, some books are up, other are down, so it's all relative
    Why does this notion that Marvel isn't doing things to attract new readers keep coming up? What do people expect them to do?

    The way you attract new readers is with solid movies that interest people enough to pick up books. Then you attempt to put solid creative teams on books and tell solid stories. Then you shake it up to get the existing readers to pick up your book. Then you put out a bunch of ridiculous variant covers to interest people.

    What on this list is Marvel not doing? I'd say they are doing all of these very well. We could argue that they aren't putting solid teams on books, but otherwise they are doing everything.

    Oh and did I mention giving away free merchandise to attract new readers?
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  5. #35
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    Quote Originally Posted by Plawsky View Post
    Saying this in several different threads doesn't make it true.
    Oh you, fine: Marvel sells alot less comics thesedays, but they keep the price higher and double ship titles in return, because they can't afford so many variety of comics or mini-series anymore.

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  6. #36
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    Quote Originally Posted by Chris S. View Post
    Why does this notion that Marvel isn't doing things to attract new readers keep coming up? What do people expect them to do?

    The way you attract new readers is with solid movies that interest people enough to pick up books. Then you attempt to put solid creative teams on books and tell solid stories. Then you shake it up to get the existing readers to pick up your book. Then you put out a bunch of ridiculous variant covers to interest people.

    What on this list is Marvel not doing? I'd say they are doing all of these very well. We could argue that they aren't putting solid teams on books, but otherwise they are doing everything.

    Oh and did I mention giving away free merchandise to attract new readers?
    I think they could be having lower price points on digital copies. They do save up some cash from not printing and shipping. It's my opinion that a 3.99 price point is fairly steep, especially when you consider most of us read more than one comic book series. Maybe some bundles? Like the more you buy, the less you pay for a single issue?
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  7. #37
    Senior Member Chris S.'s Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Xistel View Post
    I think they could be having lower price points on digital copies. They do save up some cash from not printing and shipping. It's my opinion that a 3.99 price point is fairly steep, especially when you consider most of us read more than one comic book series. Maybe some bundles? Like the more you buy, the less you pay for a single issue?
    I'm not sure I understand how the bundle would work or how that would affect comic stores...?

    I'd agree the price is a bit steep, and I can tell you that I dropped a ton of $3.99 books. I've even had people suggest books to me, and the minute I see the price tag I loose interest.

    Comics should go back to newspaper stock paper.

    Not sure that would bring in new readers though.
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  8. #38
    Senior Member Chris S.'s Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Drz View Post
    Oh you, fine: Marvel sells alot less comics thesedays, but they keep the price higher and double ship titles in return, because they can't afford so many variety of comics or mini-series anymore.

    :3
    That isn't true. Look at sales rankings.

    November number one book: 1 All New X-Men 1 $3.99 Marvel 181,693
    November 2011 Marvels highest selling book: 5 Point One 1 $5.99 Marvel 113,352

    October this year: 1 Uncanny Avengers 1 $3.99 Marvel 303,722
    2 Avengers Vs X-Men 12 $4.99 Marvel 171,452
    (I only gave you two because of how HIGH in sales Uncanny Avengers was.
    October 2011 Marvels Highest selling book: 7 Incredible Hulk 1 $3.99 Marvel 106,472

    September this year: 1 Avengers Vs X-Men 11 $3.99 Marvel 167,327
    Last year: 8 Fear Itself 6 $3.99 Marvel 93,032

    That IS HUGE jumps in sales for their highest books.

    SO YOU ARE WRONG. Those numbers have nothing to do with price points but actual books sold.
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  9. #39
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    Quote Originally Posted by Chris S. View Post
    I'm not sure I understand how the bundle would work or how that would affect comic stores...?

    I'd agree the price is a bit steep, and I can tell you that I dropped a ton of $3.99 books. I've even had people suggest books to me, and the minute I see the price tag I loose interest.

    Comics should go back to newspaper stock paper.

    Not sure that would bring in new readers though.
    If not new readers (though it would certainly be easier for a new reader to pick up a cheaper book, than an expensive one) at least there would be a higher chance of us picking up more issues.

    I didn't make it clear, but I was referring to the digital market (I'm a digital guy). So what I'm recommending is all for the digital market.

    But in very simple terms the bundles would work as follows: Suppose you get 5 monthly comics all priced at 3.99. That's about 20 bucks. Since you are getting 5 comics, you are "rewarded" by paying 17 bucks instead of the total full price. Or maybe you win points (or starts or whatever currency) for every purchase you make, and then you can trade them in for comics or lower pricing, etc.

    Lower the price significantly after the comic has been out for like 4 months...

    have special weeks. (Ex. Spidey Week! All spier-man comics have a 50% off if you buy 3 or more!)


    I just remembered a post I did a while back about this subject (digital comics).
    I would drop the price down by at least one dollar (I'd have to check how much cost there was for printing and distributing per copie and subtract that)

    I would create digital comic bundles (like jumping on points to whatever series - these could be single issues where you could choose up to 3 titles at an overall price tag of 99 cents, or like the jumping on point arc). They should also create "Event Sections" where you can easily keep up the an event chronology.

    I like how Marvel Infinite was done in terms of layout. I'd just add the possibility of hiding text, saving art as wallpapers, and include extras (without the hassle of going to Marvel AR, getting your iphone/ipad and watching it there).

    Extras could include, first 3 pages of the next issue, behind the scenes, interview with the creative force behind said comic, coloring images for the young ones, quizzes, a monthly vlog by the editors, or the creatives.

    P.S - Of course, with all the extras, the price could go back to being the same as print, or create different versions of the comic, one with extras, one without.
    Last edited by Xistel; 12-12-2012 at 04:29 PM.
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  10. #40
    Senior Member Chris S.'s Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Xistel View Post
    If not new readers (though it would certainly be easier for a new reader to pick up a cheaper book, than an expensive one) at least there would be a higher chance of us picking up more issues.

    I didn't make it clear, but I was referring to the digital market (I'm a digital guy). So what I'm recommending is all for the digital market.

    But in very simple terms the bundles would work as follows: Suppose you get 5 monthly comics all priced at 3.99. That's about 20 bucks. Since you are getting 5 comics, you are "rewarded" by paying 17 bucks instead of the total full price. Or maybe you win points (or starts or whatever currency) for every purchase you make, and then you can trade them in for comics or lower pricing, etc.

    Lower the price significantly after the comic has been out for like 4 months...

    have special weeks. (Ex. Spidey Week! All spier-man comics have a 50% off if you buy 3 or more!)


    I just remembered a post I did a while back about this subject (digital comics).
    I would drop the price down by at least one dollar (I'd have to check how much cost there was for printing and distributing per copie and subtract that)

    I would create digital comic bundles (like jumping on points to whatever series - these could be single issues where you could choose up to 3 titles at an overall price tag of 99 cents, or like the jumping on point arc). They should also create "Event Sections" where you can easily keep up the an event chronology.

    I like how Marvel Infinite was done in terms of layout. I'd just add the possibility of hiding text, saving art as wallpapers, and include extras (without the hassle of going to Marvel AR, getting your iphone/ipad and watching it there).

    Extras could include, first 3 pages of the next issue, behind the scenes, interview with the creative force behind said comic, coloring images for the young ones, quizzes, a monthly vlog by the editors, or the creatives.

    P.S - Of course, with all the extras, the price could go back to being the same as print, or create different versions of the comic, one with extras, one without.
    Doesn't Comixology offer a list of free books each week? From what I've heard/seen it seems like those books are usually pretty big name books.

    I also think the advantage you will get on digital is eventually getting books a day ahead. Stores would freak if they dropped the price and I think comics would have a ton of angry consumers.
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  11. #41
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    Quote Originally Posted by Chris S. View Post
    Doesn't Comixology offer a list of free books each week? From what I've heard/seen it seems like those books are usually pretty big name books.

    I also think the advantage you will get on digital is eventually getting books a day ahead. Stores would freak if they dropped the price and I think comics would have a ton of angry consumers.
    Yeah, I get that some people would be angry, but paper comics are "better" than digital, so it's like you're paying a premium. If you don't want the paper, or the collectability, go digital and pay less.

    I'm sure comixcology does some things like the free books, but these actions should come from the Publishers as well. I just think digital has so many possibilities that aren't being looked at. Publicity is next to free, yuo can do campaigns and all sorts of incentives with the press of a button. The idea of having a currency you store in your account to later trade for benefits is untapped. All these, and more, are not being thought about. Infinity is a step in the right direction, but it's only about presentation, not marketing or market.
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  12. #42
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    It's a shame that the sales for Ultimate Spider-man and X-men are so low. These two books are much better than a lot of other high selling superhero books.

  13. #43

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    I think Marvel needs to up their game on marketing the Ultimate line. They've been REALLY slacking at that lately, especially in the wake of Marvel NOW. (Can I say how much I hate that Editorial name?). They used to market the crap out of it and make it seem like a big deal, especially with The Death Of Spider-Man, but now they don't. I think another problem is that most of the major characters people cared about got killed off and not exactly meaningfully replaced. Miles Morales aside, the X-Men got replaced haphazardly even if people do like where it's going at this point (I've been meaning to pick up UXM but I partly dropped it early because of a lack of hype and the first few issues weren't that great), it's hard to keep up with what happened with the Fantastic Four, and The Ultimates are either dead or suddenly no longer flawed like they used to be (The Ultimates have been REALLY skitzophrenic in creative direction since Ultimates 3). I'd blame Loeb for that, Ultimatum AND Ultimate X screwed things hard. With all the majors killed off or suddenly with different personalities, it's hard for readers to really latch onto them. While USM has probably done that better than most, Marvel really screwed the pooch on making people care after the new USM was introduced.

    In the case of USM though, I'd not sure whether to blame the Editor or Bendis here. I look forward to each issue and Bendis is a good writer, but even I'm starting to get sick of USM as much as I like the book. Mainly, it's because of four things.

    1) Miles pretty much ends battles with a touch. It's just not that exciting after the first few times, and I'm not just talking about when he uses his powers. Sometimes he just hits them once and they get KOed which seems kinda unrealistic when fighting supervillains (ie. With the Ringer and freaking Omega Red). Also, the whole Spider-Sting/Venom-Blast ability is really weird. I'm not even sure how the ability works (Is it an electric shock? How? Is it a temporary paralyzer? A pain inducer? A poison/toxin?). Not to mention, he pretty much uses it and the battles end immediately with a touch. I was looking forward to a brawl with the Scorpion that lasted. Instead there was a short brawl and then a sting, ending the battle. I liked that issue, though it left a bad taste in my mouth. Some issues have battles that take place over several issues or at least were prolonged (Remember the epic drag out fight in USM between Peter and Doc Ock in the Hollywood arc? That was exciting to read!). Making it end like that really ruins some tension or drama. I hope it becomes limited, at least in a small way, or his uncle's death makes him more hesitant to use it (He did show hesitance at one point but just did it anyway, maybe expand on that).

    2) He sort of gets things handed to him. I don't like making this point, but he kinda does. He was handed the suit for helping beat ONE supervillain. His battles have been sort of handed to him easily, as I explained. He was even handed the Web Shooters for being Spider-Man, though I'll say he kind of earned those at that point considering Spider-Men and we'd gone a bunch of issues by that point.

    3) The Ultimates & Divided We Fall/United We Stand. The Ultimates really have no place in USM besides making it what Miles should aspire to be. They and SHIELD have been introduced early with Miles and they just did nothing. I mean, Peter Parker was killed partly because they gave him no training, you'd think they'd be eager to train Miles ASAP (They really missed out on a chance to make him slowly learn about his powers). Instead, they just gave him a costume and said, "Ho ho! Run along, you little scamp." Not to mention the whole thing with Miles trying to join the Ultimates just gets stupid (I couldn't be the only one groaning at them recreating the end of the first episode of the horrible Ultimate Spider-Man show with the Helicarrier). I mean, he does ONE thing not knowing what the crap he's doing and suddenly he's on the team? He's being granted too much to early (I'm guessing the next few issues will explore this from the looks of it). Using it to shoehorn him into Divided We Fall/United We Stand only complicates things because the character should've taken a while to grow before he's thrown into something like this. Editorial might be at fault here for making the event, but really USM has no real place in it, especially in the United We Stand half. USM Peter was pretty removed from the Ultimates and yet they and Nick Fury appeared when they needed to and when the story demanded it, which served USM quite well. I like my USM the hell away from my Ultimates thank you very much.

    4) Publishing Schedule. I know Ultimate Titles have pretty much been a once a month thing and that served it well but only because partly we knew these characters, even if they were in an alternate Universe. In USM's case especially (and this is kinda-sorta the case in UXM) we have all new characters and we, as readers, don't know them, which is further complicated when this was a world we thought we knew. It's not like the Walking Dead, where everything was new and needed to be introduced. Now it's like we've been in a world for so long and suddenly the New World Order hits and you don't know what to do. I feel like if we want to better learn about these new characters, Miles especially, we need to have an updated shipping schedule, perhaps bi-weekly, just so that we can better learn and sympathize with these characters, get to know their personal lives & problems, and allow them to simply do more stuff. They were doing that before the DWF/UWS tie-in and now they've really stopped and ruined that; the closest we've gotten since is the .1 issue and even disregarding the tie-in, the publishing schedule made the development VERY slow, especially with Bendis' tendancy to develop characters slowly (Not knocking that approach, I like that, but a bad publishing schedule kinda makes it TOO slow). I like Miles' character so far, but I feel like he needs to show himself more as a character and be shown doing more things. That's not exactly going to happen on a monthly schedule.

    I like the Ultimate Universe and I hope it doesn't go anywhere, but Marvel's been really mismanaging it lately... =/
    Last edited by SuperSparkplug; 12-13-2012 at 01:01 AM.
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  14. #44
    Sentinel of Liberty Drz's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Chris S. View Post
    That IS HUGE jumps in sales for their highest books.

    SO YOU ARE WRONG. Those numbers have nothing to do with price points but actual books sold.
    I'm not wrong, it's just that you're ignoring the fact alot of those extra numbers came off free with the gazillion different variants Marvel published, gimmick after gimmick man. ;)
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  15. #45
    Senior Member Chris S.'s Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Drz View Post
    I'm not wrong, it's just that you're ignoring the fact alot of those extra numbers came off free with the gazillion different variants Marvel published, gimmick after gimmick man. ;)

    That is true of the entire industry though.

    And you clearly stated that Marvel was selling less books. Doesn't matter if it is a gimmick or not- they ARE selling more books than this time last year. A lot more even.
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