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  1. #166
    Senior Member Xenon's Avatar
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    For the record, I'm not saying Slott or anyone else is a lazy writer. Just that Lazy Writing is a term that has easily decipherable meaning.
    When I became a man I put away childish things, including the fear of childishness and the desire to be very grown up.-C.S.Lewis

  2. #167
    Sad Hawkguy in the snow CyberHubbs's Avatar
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    It may.

    But it's become this catch-all phrase for seemingly any time a reader doesn't like a story, or if they figured out the outcome before the end of the issue.
    I know Kevin Nichols through a guy that knows a gal. Small world!

    If nihilism didn't take some delight in destruction one might suspect nihilists were an unnaturally morbid sort.
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  3. #168
    Spider-man/DCU Moderator ShaggyB's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Xenon View Post
    For the record, I'm not saying Slott or anyone else is a lazy writer. Just that Lazy Writing is a term that has easily decipherable meaning.
    I would say its a term that has lost most of its meaning thanks to overuse in incorrect circumstances

  4. #169
    Senior Member Tendrin's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ShaggyB View Post
    I would say its a term that has lost most of its meaning thanks to overuse in incorrect circumstances
    Much like 'slap in the face'.

  5. #170
    Sad Hawkguy in the snow CyberHubbs's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tendrin View Post
    Much like 'slap in the face'.
    Or 'shoved down our throats'.

    Except in the porn industry. There, it thrives.
    I know Kevin Nichols through a guy that knows a gal. Small world!

    If nihilism didn't take some delight in destruction one might suspect nihilists were an unnaturally morbid sort.
    -Theophilus

  6. #171
    Senior Member Tendrin's Avatar
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    Overused comments like this really deserve their own thread in which they can be derided. Perhaps with a drinking game.... though this board could use less incoherent ramblings they might wind up being more entertaining.

  7. #172
    Sad Hawkguy in the snow CyberHubbs's Avatar
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    A thread like that would eventually eat itself as cliche phrases were born to describe one's annoyance with those overused comments.

    And then the Second Seal of the Third Gate of Hell would break and all would be consumed by Lucifer's heartache.
    I know Kevin Nichols through a guy that knows a gal. Small world!

    If nihilism didn't take some delight in destruction one might suspect nihilists were an unnaturally morbid sort.
    -Theophilus

  8. #173
    Senior Member Tendrin's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by CyberHubbs View Post
    A thread like that would eventually eat itself as cliche phrases were born to describe one's annoyance with those overused comments.

    And then the Second Seal of the Third Gate of Hell would break and all would be consumed by Lucifer's heartache.
    It would be GLORIOUS.

  9. #174
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    Default Why its good

    Quote Originally Posted by GenericUsername View Post
    I started truly reading Slott's spiderman when "end of the earth" started, I did read a number of back issues as well as spider island and I am left unimpressed. Compared to other marvel books it feels like a childish tie-in book given away with a happy meal. The only major change and significant factor that I find to be of interest is Peter getting the horizon job apart from that there's no bloody character development, Spidey faces one villain(with an extremely boring and mundane scheme)-wins, sometimes spidey gets angry about it and shouts at people but THAT'S IT. This whole "Superior" thing also doesnt interest me, instead of evolving spidey (like whedon did for cyclops) Slott is just gonna replace him with another character, IT'S JUST SO LAZY. Why do people consider this to be a good take on the character.
    Slott's run is considered good because of the following reasons:
    • Progression: Unlike a lot of comics which are written in arcs, where random things happen, get resolved and then the next thing happens, Slott weaves his narrative like a TV series or a book. A few panels in one issue might set up something later on. His mysteries last a while and when something big happens it is rarely out of nowhere, because he had been planting the seeds for a while.
    • Continuity: Slott has found a balance between old and new continuity. He can reference events from the early days of ASM, but also from the BND run and his own era. Spider-Island is the perfect example of a story that is pleasing for longtime fans, recent (BND onwards) fans and new fans just picking up the story.
    • Character: There may be a case for his writing of some characters, but as this is the why its good thread I'll focus on the positives. He turned Carlie from a rather bland and irritating character into a fully developed individual who is flawed and interesting and actually made me interested in her, which I wasn't until Big Time was into swing. He has also taken Jonah, Otto and Connors to new places and has created some interesting characters in Max Model and the new Hobgoblin.
    • Tone: Slott's work is described as 'fun', and it is. There are lots of jokes and witticisms, but it can also get pretty dark at times. The end of Ends of the Earth and the Marla/Massacre issues stand out in my mind, but I think the Vulture arc was pretty dark too. Slott can find a balance between the light-hearted and the really serious.
    • Slott himself: He's not some inaccessible creator. He's on twitter, facebook, formspring and message boards. He takes time out to interact with the fans and I think that adds to the enjoyment of the run. It does for me anyway.


    The "Superior" thing isn't lazy, either (was Brubaker or Morrison "lazy"? or Knightfall?)

    You can't base it off things you read, you need to read it for yourself and it isn't simply 'replace Peter so I don't have to write him 'cos it's hard,' it is a story that has been building for 52 issues and which was seeded long before that.

  10. #175
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    Another thing good about it that I forgot is how it launched Venom and Scarlet Spider, and how the three series interact with each other. The BT era also had some nice mini-series (though Slott didn't write them).

  11. #176
    Senior Member Chris S.'s Avatar
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    So what I'd say is that for holiday break I re-pulled all of Slott's run. My goal was to read it before 700 came out. I thought it'd be a fun way to spend the break.

    I couldn't do it. It just didn't pull me back in on a second reading. I found myself bored and it felt forced. Even trying to get through 648 just felt like a chore.

    Now that isn't to say I haven't enjoyed Slott's run. It has been fun but there just isn't any depth to the story. My biggest worry is that Slott just won't be able to write an intriguing story where he replaces Peter with some darker character.
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  12. #177
    Senior Member Chris S.'s Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Russell View Post
    Another thing good about it that I forgot is how it launched Venom and Scarlet Spider, and how the three series interact with each other. The BT era also had some nice mini-series (though Slott didn't write them).
    Slott wasn't responsible for either of these events. I believe Flash was in Venom before Slott's run started, and Scarlet Spider came out of Grim Hunt if memory serves me correctly.

    I could be wrong.
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  13. #178
    Senior Member Chris S.'s Avatar
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    I'm going to agree and disagree with some of your points Russell.

    Quote Originally Posted by Russell View Post
    Slott's run is considered good because of the following reasons:
    Progression: Unlike a lot of comics which are written in arcs, where random things happen, get resolved and then the next thing happens, Slott weaves his narrative like a TV series or a book. A few panels in one issue might set up something later on. His mysteries last a while and when something big happens it is rarely out of nowhere, because he had been planting the seeds for a while.
    I'd agree that Slott does a nice job with subplots and this was something that has been missing from the book honestly since Mackie's run. JMS never weaved subplots and BND was all over the place with other writers.

    The big issue is that Slott makes his subplots too predictable. He gives us so much backstory before something happens that we already know what is going on and then he wastes a reveal issue spelling it out. A good example was 699. We all knew how it'd play out and half of the issue was really boring because of it. That isn't the first time that has happened either.

    Quote Originally Posted by Russell View Post
    Character: There may be a case for his writing of some characters, but as this is the why its good thread I'll focus on the positives. He turned Carlie from a rather bland and irritating character into a fully developed individual who is flawed and interesting and actually made me interested in her, which I wasn't until Big Time was into swing. He has also taken Jonah, Otto and Connors to new places and has created some interesting characters in Max Model and the new Hobgoblin.
    Carlie was interesting under Slott? Are you series? I was OK with most of your post until I read that line. Carlie was one of the worst love interests. I'd say that was one of my bigger issues with Slott's run. Carlie felt like a forced afterthought. Their love life didn't go anywhere. She also dropped off a cliff the minute they broke up.

    Carlie was an awful character under every persons run. They tried to give her a backstory with her father, but that just vanished.

    I'd agree on Max and the new Hobgoblin though.

    Quote Originally Posted by Russell View Post
    Tone: Slott's work is described as 'fun', and it is. There are lots of jokes and witticisms, but it can also get pretty dark at times. The end of Ends of the Earth and the Marla/Massacre issues stand out in my mind, but I think the Vulture arc was pretty dark too. Slott can find a balance between the light-hearted and the really serious.
    Slott's run has been fun. Yes he has killed some characters, but it has never been dark. I'm worried about where a dark Spider-Man will go in Superior.

    Quote Originally Posted by Russell View Post
    Slott himself: He's not some inaccessible creator. He's on twitter, facebook, formspring and message boards. He takes time out to interact with the fans and I think that adds to the enjoyment of the run. It does for me anyway.
    Both Slott and Wacker are unprofessional the way they bounce around here and treat the fans. Arguing with people because they don't like your product is immature. I liken it to my job. My students complain about my class because that is what people do. I don't get in an argument with them. Comic book fans complain about things because everyone is a critic. Arguing with them just is immature.
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  14. #179
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    Quote Originally Posted by Xenon View Post
    For the record, I'm not saying Slott or anyone else is a lazy writer. Just that Lazy Writing is a term that has easily decipherable meaning.
    It's not. You described writing you do t like.

    It's meaningless terminology unless you have knowledge if of the writers process.

    For such a smug guy, you miss a lot of points.

    SW

  15. #180
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    Quote Originally Posted by Chris S. View Post
    Slott wasn't responsible for either of these events. I believe Flash was in Venom before Slott's run started, and Scarlet Spider came out of Grim Hunt if memory serves me correctly.

    I could be wrong.
    SS came out of Spider Island and Flash became Venom in 654.1, written by Slott.

    Kaine did have an important part in Grim Hunt though.

    I really didn't like Carlie for a long time. I'd agree with everything you said about BND, and I think she was the weakest part of the era. But when Slott took over, I think he gave her some personality. She's moody and makes rash decisions, struggles with authority etc. Has trouble 'loosening up'.

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