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  1. #31
    BUY LOKI: AGENT OF ASGARD Kieran_Frost's Avatar
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    They may not be super famous; but his rogue gallery has some great ones: Vlad the Impaler, Klaw, Doctor Nightshade, Achebe, Killmonger, Man-Ape and Hate-Monger. Seven VERY cool villains is all you need (hell... all you need is 3; seven is a luxury). The writers just need to regularly use them to build up their uber-influence; so it adds to the "squeal" factor when they appear.

    Quote Originally Posted by Genki Sudo View Post
    If he did I missed it as this is news to me
    After the series was cancelled; Liss said the identity of the person who picked up the American Panther mask at the end of the arc was already guessed by most on-line as Kasper Cole (i.e. it wasn't confirmed in the comic, it was confirmed by the writer as who it WAS going to be, had the series continued).
    Last edited by Kieran_Frost; 12-10-2012 at 04:08 PM.
    "I don't know how to please you Lord, but I think the fact I try to please you, pleases you."

  2. #32
    Elder Member XPac's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by marvell2100 View Post
    T'Challa needs a villain that matches him on a mental as well as physical level. Killmonger fits that bill. However they keep him so Wakanda-centric that his true threat level is rarely seen outside of a Black Panther title. Lots of other capable villains have been listed here yet they really haven't elevated some of them beyond being an annoyance. Kiber is a villain that I really like and they really didn't do enough to get more mileage out of him. It would have been cool to see him gain control over his body and become maleable in a sort of Mr Fantastic kind of way. He's already intelligent and to be able to manipulate and contort his own body would present a pretty good challenge to T'Challa. I've mentioned Moses magnum so many times, that I don't need to repeat myself(too late).
    I liked Killmonger, but truthfully I never bought that he was as smart or as skilled a fighter as T'Challa. And that's weird to say because you can make an arguement Killminger never lost to T'Challa until the very end there... but on paper I always saw him as a bit of the underdog. T'Challa was smarter, a better fighter, had superior physical stats, had better equipment and more resources. On paper Killmonger didn't have a chance. He of course more than rose to the equation and as I said arguably beat T'Challa most of the time. But I think he's one of those instances where the villain frankly needed an upgrade.

    But I guess a lot of Priest rogues worked the same way a lot of Batman rogues work. Someone like Joker on paper really isn't Batman's equal on any measurable level to be honest... but always able to be a legitimate threat regardless. He's proving that now.

    And I hope they bring back Kiber the Cruel just cause I really dig his name.

  3. #33
    Elder Member XPac's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Songbird/Diamondback View Post
    Yeah. But again, a black guy dressed like a monkey?

    That won't blow over well at all.
    If they changed his name and had him go costumeless, I think he might be workable.

    I sort of thought Man Ape was kinda dumb too back in the day, but under the right writer I think he actually became a fun character. And no one can deny he didn't play a pretty important role in T'Challas history. Aside from Klaw, he was probably the most infleuential in BP's life.

  4. #34
    Elder Member XPac's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Master Meglomaniac View Post
    Too be fair Dr. Doom has an obsession with Reed Richards, but he can still menace other heroes, Lex Luthor is obsessed with Superman, but he can still menace some other heroes. Just because Killmonger is obsessed with Black Panther, doesn't mean he can't mess with other heroes. In his quest to overthrow Black Panther, he can steal money or technology in America to help his little insurrection.

    Anyway I thought an interesting story line would be an U.L.T.I.M.A.T.U.M cell active in Africa, trying to destroy the Wankadian nation state in order to create a single African super state, because they feel Wakanda is being selfish with their resources and they want to have all the resources of Africa pooled into one super state that distribute them across the continent.
    The key to both Lex and Doom is despite their obsessions, they have a larger agenda which effects the whole planet. So other characters are going to focus on Doom and Lex inevitably even if Lex and Doom aren't particularly interested in focusing on them. It's not JUST the FF who wants to foil Dooms attempts at taking over the world... Avengers don't particularly find that idea all that appealing either. If the FF is busy that day, the Avengers or Spider-Man or whoever will step up and fill that void.

    I think if you want characters to go beyond BP and Wakanda, they need to either operate on a global level or just start operating in New York. Leave Africa and head over to the big apple, and you won't go 10 feet without tripping over a super hero.

  5. #35
    Senior Member rsreed13's Avatar
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    Klaw controls sound. Sound is a mechanical wave that is an oscillation of pressure transmitted through a solid, liquid, or gas, composed of frequencies within the range of hearing.Sound also travels through plasma. How no one has used this to create a damn-near cosmic threat is beyond me.

    Killmonger is a great villain, because he's primarily politically motivated. He believes T'Challa is ill-suited for the throne, and seeks to overthrow him. Because of his genius, he'd make a great Iron Man villain, which would give Tony someone other to combat than people building rival suits or stealing Extremis. He'd also make a nice rival for Doom (I don't think they'd work together after Doomwar. At least not without having plans upon plans to kill each other), which could serve as the background for a Fantastic Four story (since the FF and BP are interwoven anyway) or something like Winter Soldier or Secret Avengers.

    Achebe's nuts, and to me, could be played as a terrorist figure. Obviously, he's more Wakanda-centric, but that's not a bad thing. If you elevate Wakanda to being the world power it's always meant to be, you would in turn, elevate the villains.

    M'Baku is a great villain, but I do believe it's harder to move him out of BP's circle of influence. That being said, good things can be done with him, and he could become BP's Doctor Octopus.

  6. #36

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    [QUOTE=XPac;16283021]I liked Killmonger, but truthfully I never bought that he was as smart or as skilled a fighter as T'Challa. And that's weird to say because you can make an arguement Killminger never lost to T'Challa until the very end there... but on paper I always saw him as a bit of the underdog. T'Challa was smarter, a better fighter, had superior physical stats, had better equipment and more resources. On paper Killmonger didn't have a chance. He of course more than rose to the equation and as I said arguably beat T'Challa most of the time. But I think he's one of those instances where the villain frankly needed an upgrade.

    But I guess a lot of Priest rogues worked the same way a lot of Batman rogues work. Someone like Joker on paper really isn't Batman's equal on any measurable level to be honest... but always able to be a legitimate threat regardless. He's proving that now.



    Except Killmonger is not a Priest rogue, he's a McGregor rogue that Priest brought back...and the character was never bested by T'Challa in his original appearance in the jungle action series, Killmonger always bested him. Even in the end, he was about to kill T'Challa until a boy intervened and threw his body into him so he'd fall over the cliff he was about to throw Panther off of.

    Wish someone could post scans of that...

    Also, Killmonger had plenty of resources in that story: a network of Wakandans working for him, a small army of mutated superhumans, and giant creatures he had trained for various purposes. He had carefully planned his takeover of Wakanda for years, and had dealings in NYC as well (where he could run afoul of other heroes if one chose to portray that)

    So originally Killmonger was never presented as the underdog, but Priest kinda did portray him as that, I think unintentionally, in his run. The character would just need some re-tweaking.

  7. #37
    DD & BP: secret BFF's FriendRoss's Avatar
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    M'baku

    its just fun to say

  8. #38
    Elder Member SilverZeal's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Greg Anderson View Post
    It's called The Blade of Bashenga.
    LOL!

    Ahem...u mean 'Spear' of Bashenga.......ahem.

  9. #39
    Elder Member SilverZeal's Avatar
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    [QUOTE=jabu46;16283332]
    Quote Originally Posted by XPac View Post
    I liked Killmonger, but truthfully I never bought that he was as smart or as skilled a fighter as T'Challa. And that's weird to say because you can make an arguement Killminger never lost to T'Challa until the very end there... but on paper I always saw him as a bit of the underdog. T'Challa was smarter, a better fighter, had superior physical stats, had better equipment and more resources. On paper Killmonger didn't have a chance. He of course more than rose to the equation and as I said arguably beat T'Challa most of the time. But I think he's one of those instances where the villain frankly needed an upgrade.

    But I guess a lot of Priest rogues worked the same way a lot of Batman rogues work. Someone like Joker on paper really isn't Batman's equal on any measurable level to be honest... but always able to be a legitimate threat regardless. He's proving that now.



    Except Killmonger is not a Priest rogue, he's a McGregor rogue that Priest brought back...and the character was never bested by T'Challa in his original appearance in the jungle action series, Killmonger always bested him. Even in the end, he was about to kill T'Challa until a boy intervened and threw his body into him so he'd fall over the cliff he was about to throw Panther off of.

    Wish someone could post scans of that...

    Also, Killmonger had plenty of resources in that story: a network of Wakandans working for him, a small army of mutated superhumans, and giant creatures he had trained for various purposes. He had carefully planned his takeover of Wakanda for years, and had dealings in NYC as well (where he could run afoul of other heroes if one chose to portray that)

    So originally Killmonger was never presented as the underdog, but Priest kinda did portray him as that, I think unintentionally, in his run. The character would just need some re-tweaking.
    Priest created "Reverand Achebe" & we wud luuuuuuuuuuv 2 c dat xcter given much mo attention as a recurring BP villain.

    Of course sum similarities can b md btwn Achebe & Joker but Priest md enuff effort as well 2 mk dem different.

    Achebe is d only BP villain we/SZ know is just completely mentally supa-crazy...along with his dual personality loyal companion....d hand puppet. LOL!

    Easily BP/Tchalla MOST UNPREDICTABLE XCTER who is not rich, aint much of a fighter, doesnt hv easily hv abundant resources on stand-by & not nearly as intelligent as BP/Tchalla but is crazy enuff 2 put BP/Tchalla right thru a 'blender'.

    A perfect unpredictable foe 4 a hero reknown as a 4sight planning strategist.....& of course d whole crazy ga-doodling personality of Achebe is just a brilliant bonus.

  10. #40
    Elder Member SilverZeal's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by rsreed13 View Post
    Klaw controls sound. Sound is a mechanical wave that is an oscillation of pressure transmitted through a solid, liquid, or gas, composed of frequencies within the range of hearing.Sound also travels through plasma. How no one has used this to create a damn-near cosmic threat is beyond me.

    Killmonger is a great villain, because he's primarily politically motivated. He believes T'Challa is ill-suited for the throne, and seeks to overthrow him. Because of his genius, he'd make a great Iron Man villain, which would give Tony someone other to combat than people building rival suits or stealing Extremis. He'd also make a nice rival for Doom (I don't think they'd work together after Doomwar. At least not without having plans upon plans to kill each other), which could serve as the background for a Fantastic Four story (since the FF and BP are interwoven anyway) or something like Winter Soldier or Secret Avengers.

    Achebe's nuts, and to me, could be played as a terrorist figure. Obviously, he's more Wakanda-centric, but that's not a bad thing. If you elevate Wakanda to being the world power it's always meant to be, you would in turn, elevate the villains.


    M'Baku is a great villain, but I do believe it's harder to move him out of BP's circle of influence. That being said, good things can be done with him, and he could become BP's Doctor Octopus.
    Gd post...agreed with all u said with mo emfasis on d bold.

    M'Baku is a great villain, but I do believe it's harder to move him out of BP's circle of influence.
    Well wasnt M'Baku a recurring member of an Avengers supavillain team bak in d day?

  11. #41
    Member Memnoch's Avatar
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    I think the White wolf and the rest of the disbanded dogs of war should be used a lot more, theres so much you can do with them!
    "It would trouble me if you believed you were ever my equal"

  12. #42
    Senior Member Huthaifa's Avatar
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    Character wise , the BP rogues are decent. But they do nothing for the character at all. Hudlin's version of Klaw has potential. Would be great in an arc of Winter Soldier.After the crap that has been done Wakanda. White Wolf should be the greatest terrorist on the planet. Seriously, some writer needs to uses this guy. Secret Avengers would be great. Killmonger could be a great money man backing up White Wolf. If they ever did a Cabal or an adult version of the Hellfire Club, then he could be a great addition. I love Achebe. Have him stop by Thor, and kill all of his "followers" would be an interesting story. Key thing is the current BP rogues are only going to be valuable if they spread their wings to other books.

  13. #43
    The Professional marvell2100's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by XPac View Post
    I liked Killmonger, but truthfully I never bought that he was as smart or as skilled a fighter as T'Challa. And that's weird to say because you can make an arguement Killminger never lost to T'Challa until the very end there... but on paper I always saw him as a bit of the underdog. T'Challa was smarter, a better fighter, had superior physical stats, had better equipment and more resources. On paper Killmonger didn't have a chance. He of course more than rose to the equation and as I said arguably beat T'Challa most of the time. But I think he's one of those instances where the villain frankly needed an upgrade.

    But I guess a lot of Priest rogues worked the same way a lot of Batman rogues work. Someone like Joker on paper really isn't Batman's equal on any measurable level to be honest... but always able to be a legitimate threat regardless. He's proving that now.

    And I hope they bring back Kiber the Cruel just cause I really dig his name.
    Killmonger was on equal footing with T'Challa physically. And while he may not be the genius T'Challa is, he's at least as good a tactician as T'Challa.

    As well as Kiber, I'd also like to see an upgraded Wind Eagle. They could rework it so that he's a genius in his own right.
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  14. #44
    Willy Wonka Swagger! FLEX HECTIC's Avatar
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    Erik Killmonger: "Let's not stand on ceremony here... T'challa!"

    Bane: "Hey! That's my line!"

    Erik Killmonger: "I just wanted to see how it sounds when I speak it!"

    Bane: "You would be so awesome if they ever cared to develop you better!"


    Reverend Achebe: "There's no going back! You've changed things forever!"

    The Joker: "Hey! Get your own schtick!"


    It's all according to what comes out of the mouth of the bad guy that sets everything up.

    The conversation that Black Panther has with each nemesis should be written like intellectual brutes who could just as easily play the violin as they could crush your bones.

    The Black Panther's rogues gallery could be the best of any character if there was a clear commitment to expanding upon the full range of their dastardly dynamics.

    But this becomes ever more difficult if Marvel is all over the deconstructive map with what direction to take Black Panther in.

    His marriage to Storm could have been tampered with and dissolved by Reverend Achebe giving them a more intense rivalry but instead we get The Jerry Springer type ending.
    Kanye West: "Marvel Comics does not like Black Panther!"

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  15. #45
    Member Memnoch's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by FLEX HECTIC View Post
    Erik Killmonger: "Let's not stand on ceremony here... T'challa!"

    Bane: "Hey! That's my line!"

    Erik Killmonger: "I just wanted to see how it sounds when I speak it!"

    Bane: "You would be so awesome if they ever cared to develop you better!"


    Reverend Achebe: "There's no going back! You've changed things forever!"

    The Joker: "Hey! Get your own schtick!"


    It's all according to what comes out of the mouth of the bad guy that sets everything up.

    The conversation that Black Panther has with each nemesis should be written like intellectual brutes who could just as easily play the violin as they could crush your bones.

    The Black Panther's rogues gallery could be the best of any character if there was a clear commitment to expanding upon the full range of their dastardly dynamics.

    But this becomes ever more difficult if Marvel is all over the deconstructive map with what direction to take Black Panther in.

    His marriage to Storm could have been tampered with and dissolved by Reverend Achebe giving them a more intense rivalry but instead we get The Jerry Springer type ending.
    Pretty much!!
    "It would trouble me if you believed you were ever my equal"

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