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  1. #421
    Senior Member Lars C's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ben Smith View Post
    hell no I don't work for the Army.

    Air Force
    All right. Cool!

  2. #422
    The curious one.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mikey Brown View Post
    Way to hold on to the CW hatred.
    The curse of a fully functional memory :)

  3. #423
    The curious one.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ben Smith View Post
    so.....possession by demons is better than faustian pact?
    Possession doesn't require permission.

  4. #424
    100% alive since 1978 Ben Smith's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mark_S View Post
    Possession doesn't require permission.
    I have a feeling you'd still complain.

    I've seen hundreds of "they should have done..." ideas, and they're all just as lame, if not more so, and the same people would still complain just as much if it was done differently.

    bottom line is, most people that hate OMD, hate it because it erased the marriage, and it ultimately doesn't really matter how. anything else is just empty statements

    all of which has nothing to do with the topic at hand.
    "I'm sending him a bouquet of cans."

    SW

  5. #425
    Senior Member Lars C's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ben Smith View Post
    I have a feeling you'd still complain.

    I've seen hundreds of "they should have done..." ideas, and they're all just as lame, if not more so, and the same people would still complain just as much if it was done differently.

    bottom line is, most people that hate OMD, hate it because it erased the marriage, and it ultimately doesn't really matter how. anything else is just empty statements

    all of which has nothing to do with the topic at hand.
    Well, look at that! We actually agree on something? I don't care so much about OMD, I care about that Peter got a supporting cast again, became single and had a secret identity again.

  6. #426
    The curious one.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ben Smith View Post
    I have a feeling you'd still complain.

    I've seen hundreds of "they should have done..." ideas, and they're all just as lame, if not more so, and the same people would still complain just as much if it was done differently.

    bottom line is, most people that hate OMD, hate it because it erased the marriage, and it ultimately doesn't really matter how. anything else is just empty statements

    all of which has nothing to do with the topic at hand.
    If they wanted to end the marriage I wouldn't have minded, but they made sure to end the marriage in a way that I and many others would mind. It may not have been deliberate but there it is.

  7. #427
    Spiderfried Von's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by stephen wacker View Post
    It also depends on a human understanding at all what you just wrote.

    SW
    Why is it that comic book editors posts in fan forums are always pointless.

  8. #428
    Spiderfried Von's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by stephen wacker View Post
    It's amazing and impressive how much better you would apparently be at writing comics than anyone ever. How has no comic company swooped you up?

    SW
    In all seriousness, I think this thread is getting at the core of what people - at least, people that enjoy a well crafted story in any medium - are looking for:

    People that appreciate a well crafted story line are looking for consistency. We want some kind of internal logic that makes sense.

    This is how we come away feeling satisfied that - even if we might not have personally *liked* the result? ie if the effect on the characters world and the resolution was not something that we personally would have preferred - the more important thing is that it all made *sense* and was plausible within the confines of that universe

    It matters less - or maybe not at all - that the story / world is completely implausible or even impossible in our 'real' world. This is after all one of the primary reasons why we read / watch sci-fi, fantasy and comics in the first place.

    What we want is that the author / scriptwriter / director sets up a world, a set of characters, and a scenario that is internally consistent. And then - as the story develops over time - it stays true to those rules and doesn't break them.

    This is key to the temporary suspension of disbelief. It makes the story immersive and fascinating. It makes people keep coming back to your comics, your films, and spending money because the audience has an emotional connection to the characters and is invested in the world in some way that makes them praise you.

    It keeps them spending money. And turning other people on so they spend their money.

    Not every comic or film has to be perfect in this way. Some are meant to be silly, or primarily for young kids (where the lesson is more important than the internal consistency). Or are avant-garde works that try to break the boundaries of internal story logic.

    But fans of a character like Spider-Man want you to follow established rules (rules established by previous authors) of story logic.

    Otherwise they are going to be pissed. They are going to call you out on it. They will accuse you of sloppy storytelling, because they can see it, even if they can't write a decent internally consistent, compelling and exciting story to save their life*

    Its not like I'm not telling you something you don't already know lol.

    I just wanted to be the guy that has told you that for the 948,092,127th time.

    (*maybe that's why they are spending their money expecting you to do it)
    Last edited by Von; 12-17-2012 at 11:21 AM.

  9. #429
    I wanna hear you scream Kevinroc's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ben Smith View Post
    I have a feeling you'd still complain.

    I've seen hundreds of "they should have done..." ideas, and they're all just as lame, if not more so, and the same people would still complain just as much if it was done differently.

    bottom line is, most people that hate OMD, hate it because it erased the marriage, and it ultimately doesn't really matter how. anything else is just empty statements

    all of which has nothing to do with the topic at hand.
    I read the works of Mohiro Kitoh, a Japanese creator who seems to have a penchant for some rather sadistic stories (including but not limited to child rape). Very uncomfortable stuff. But I greatly enjoy his works as he tells his stories very well.

    So I could give a crap about the undoing of the Spider-Marriage.

    I hate OMD because it's bad.

    (And I hate OMIT even more. But that's because it is pure continuity clean-up and oh my god I do not care.)
    The monster saved them all. And in their fear, they betrayed him. As they always have. As they always will.

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  10. #430
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    I wasn't a big fan of the marriage between Peter and MJ but OMD was a horribly written cop out. When you dont have enough guts or talent to tell a real story or to hire people who can you do this???? No..Marvel has lost complete touch with its readership.

  11. #431
    Lawn-mowing Enthusiast EuphemismForSex's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ben Smith View Post

    bottom line is, most people that hate OMD, hate it because it erased the marriage, and it ultimately doesn't really matter how. anything else is just empty statements
    Then you're out of it, because it certainly does matter.

    It's the difference between Emperor Palpatine slipping on a banana peel and falling into the Death Star reactor; and Darth Vader rejoining the light side after seeing the torture of his son, and throwing Palpatine into the reactor knowing it would cost him his life.

    One is stupid, the other is an iconic, legendary moment in cinema. Both lead to the Emperor's death.

    Likewise with all this #700 stuff, it will matter how Peter Parker's story ends.
    Last edited by EuphemismForSex; 12-17-2012 at 03:39 PM.
    Bad news everyone...

  12. #432
    The curious one.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Charmed1 View Post
    I wasn't a big fan of the marriage between Peter and MJ but OMD was a horribly written cop out. When you dont have enough guts or talent to tell a real story or to hire people who can you do this???? No..Marvel has lost complete touch with its readership.
    From what I understand it was a creator conflict between Strazinski and marvel and somehow and for some reason marvel decided to let it stand because other issues had already been written. I'm not completely sure but I think if you do a google search you'll find some explanation.

  13. #433
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    Quote Originally Posted by EuphemismForSex View Post
    Then you're out of it, because it certainly does matter.

    It's the difference between Emperor Palpatine slipping on a banana peel and falling into the Death Star reactor; and Darth Vader rejoining the light side after seeing the torture of his son, and throwing Palpatine into the reactor knowing it would cost him his life.
    I think that would have been nice if the 3 Stooges had been jedi knights :)

  14. #434

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    I always thought there should have been a Jedi Gungan in there somewhere, which is really the same thing.
    Perfect humility dispenses with modesty.

  15. #435
    Senior Member Tendrin's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Scott Taylor View Post
    I always thought there should have been a Jedi Gungan in there somewhere, which is really the same thing.
    Oops! Nevermind.

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