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  1. #16
    Junior Member The Duke's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lorendiac View Post
    Let me clarify something: Cary Bates had an incredibly long run on "Flash," and I've read much of it. I think large chunks of it were pretty enjoyable. The last couple of years' worth, with the focus on a slow-moving and badly handled trial sequence? Not so much.

    (By the same token, I think Marv Wolfman was a great Titans writer on a good day, but not all of his days were good. Same applies to Chris Claremont as an X-Men writer! The longer a writer works on the same characters, the more likely it is that he will have his ups and downs as he tries to find something different to do in his next story arc . . . even if his run had started off very well indeed!)
    Hideously off topic but felt you deserved a reply.
    As I know you're an old school guy (read your reviews on varying websites over the years) so I know your knowledge and passion for comics past is near legendary. This means I know you're able to make a prescient point.

    I agree both writers had ups and downs, in fact most writers do. I've only known three writers who have an extended stay on a comic (over two years) that was as strong at the end as it was at the beginning.

    1. The first Layton/Micheliene run on Iron Man - started with Demon in A Bottle and ended with fighting Doctor Doom in Camelot.

    2. J.M. De Matties run on Captain America - started off with a brutal run in with Baron Heinrich Zemo ended with him killing the Red Skull.

    3. Roger Stern's run on Avengers - Started off by creating Monica Rambeau's version of Captain Marvel and ended with the Avengers Mansion siege by the biggest Masters of Evil team ever, run by Baron Zemo.

    All during Jim Shooters editorial fiefdom. The irony of him giving me my three favorite runs when I believe he was a officious martinet is quite ironic.
    "Mistah Joker, he dead."

  2. #17
    Elder Member marshal99's Avatar
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    In batman 291-294 , when batman was presumed dead , a few villains claimed to have done the deed and they took the stand to find out the truth with Ra AL Ghul being the head judge , two face as the prosecutor and a host of bat villains as the jury and on the stand , catwoman , riddler , lex luthor & joker.

  3. #18
    Junior Member The Duke's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by marshal99 View Post
    In batman 291-294 , when batman was presumed dead , a few villains claimed to have done the deed and they took the stand to find out the truth with Ra AL Ghul being the head judge , two face as the prosecutor and a host of bat villains as the jury and on the stand , catwoman , riddler , lex luthor & joker.
    One of David V. Reed's better stories during his second tenure on Batman in the mid-70s.

    And then Grant Morrison did an inversion of it when Batman was "dead" after Finality Crisis.
    "Mistah Joker, he dead."

  4. #19
    Senior Member Lorendiac's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by marshal99 View Post
    In batman 291-294 , when batman was presumed dead , a few villains claimed to have done the deed and they took the stand to find out the truth with Ra AL Ghul being the head judge , two face as the prosecutor and a host of bat villains as the jury and on the stand , catwoman , riddler , lex luthor & joker.
    I remember that story! Years ago, I happened to buy the "final chapter" of it, cheap, at a sale, and later I filled in the gaps in my collection to let me see how the rest of it had gone. A corny, Silver-Age-style concept, but it was handled pretty well if you didn't take it too seriously.

    It did make sense to me that multiple villains would each want to get the "street cred" for having finally polished off the Dark Knight -- as shown on that cover-scan you provided!

    However, since that case did not have a superhero defendant sitting in the courtroom, and since Ra's al Ghul had no legal authority to preside over a trial on American soil, it won't make it into the list I want to construct.

  5. #20
    Say WHAT?!?!?!? FanboyStranger's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Duke View Post
    3. Roger Stern's run on Avengers - Started off by creating Monica Rambeau's version of Captain Marvel and ended with the Avengers Mansion siege by the biggest Masters of Evil team ever, run by Baron Zemo.

    All during Jim Shooters editorial fiefdom. The irony of him giving me my three favorite runs when I believe he was a officious martinet is quite ironic.
    Actually, Stern's run went on for around another year after Under Siege, including the as-good Assault on Olympus storyline.

  6. #21
    Junior Member The Duke's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by FanboyStranger View Post
    Actually, Stern's run went on for around another year after Under Siege, including the as-good Assault on Olympus storyline.
    Nice catch. Then he was cut short by editorial interference.

    Which brings me to a run I forgot to mention. Steve Englehart's West Coast Avengers run - containing the Time/Lost story where the Wackos are spread throughout five different time zones. I honestly think it's my favorite Marvel comic book arc of all time. With the Mansion siege being a close second.
    "Mistah Joker, he dead."

  7. #22
    Say WHAT?!?!?!? FanboyStranger's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Duke View Post
    Nice catch. Then he was cut short by editorial interference.

    Which brings me to a run I forgot to mention. Steve Englehart's West Coast Avengers run - containing the Time/Lost story where the Wackos are spread throughout five different time zones. I honestly think it's my favorite Marvel comic book arc of all time. With the Mansion siege being a close second.
    That was such a great time to be an Avengers fan. I was just starting to read comics at the time, and I honestly could not wait for the next installments of Avengers and WCA.

  8. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lorendiac View Post
    Yeah, some years ago I finally forced myself to read the last few years' worth of Barry Allen's old "Flash" title, all the way through, to get the full impact of the trial (including all the stuff leading up to when the trial officially began).

    I was profoundly unimpressed. But I will be sure to mention that one when I construct a master list of DC superheroes on trial! Probably saying something like this in the "Notes" category: "Cary Bates deserves special recognition for writing the most long-winded and worst-plotted superhero trial in history!"

    Hahahaha. I did the same thing. I hunted down issues #280 and up and read them. Damn slow for a title that features the fastest man alive.

  9. #24
    SHOW ME YOUR THUMBS!! BohemiaDrinker's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by KevinTBrown View Post
    The Flash had a year long story of being on trial for killing the Reverse Flash right before CoIE.
    Quote Originally Posted by Lorendiac View Post
    Yeah, some years ago I finally forced myself to read the last few years' worth of Barry Allen's old "Flash" title, all the way through, to get the full impact of the trial (including all the stuff leading up to when the trial officially began).

    I was profoundly unimpressed. But I will be sure to mention that one when I construct a master list of DC superheroes on trial! Probably saying something like this in the "Notes" category: "Cary Bates deserves special recognition for writing the most long-winded and worst-plotted superhero trial in history!"


    Other than Barry`s trial, Wally also stood trial twice (if I`m not mistaken). First time he was sued for negligence when a woman lost her legs in an attack in a mall he couldn`t prevent. Written by Mark Waid. Second time, he was the defendant alongside Green Lantern Kyle Rayner and Green Arrow Connor Hawke in a crossover between the 3 monthlies. This was in the Morrison/Millar run.
    Last edited by BohemiaDrinker; 12-03-2012 at 07:10 AM. Reason: Wrong quote

  10. #25
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    How many times has John Stewart been on trial?

  11. #26
    Elder Member dupersuper's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MadDog1981 View Post
    How many times has John Stewart been on trial?
    Just the one time in JLU that I recall...
    Pull List; seems to be too long to fit in my sig...

  12. #27
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    Booster stood trial twice for stealing his tech and travel back to the past. The first time he was sentenced to death (during his first solo series), but escaped back to the "present". The second time was his last story before flashpoint. He was sentenced to 5 years of prison, which he actually served.

  13. #28
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    In Batman Blind Justice Bruce Wayne was framed and put on trail for treason. Of course, he got the guys and was found not guilty.

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