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  1. #91

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    Quote Originally Posted by SteveGus View Post
    You won't make friends here saying this, but you're right. There is a Vertigo house style of storytelling, and it isn't a good fit for superheroes. I always avoided the imprint, generally. My impression was that most Vertigo books tended to be dark and bleak in theme; and slow-moving in pace, written for the trade rather than as monthly serials, because the label was encouraging the writers to aim for Art rather than serial storytelling.
    You clearly never read Sandman, one of the best things Vertigo put out which was heavily episodic.

    Quote Originally Posted by SteveGus View Post
    The imprint seemed to have a general disdain for superheroes.
    Prove it. Garth Ennis isn't what every Vertigo writer was like.

    Quote Originally Posted by SteveGus View Post
    Karen Berger wanted the label to be "different, smarter, edgier": for 'smarter' read 'pretentious', for 'edgier' read 'dark and weird'.
    What a load of garbage. Though since any comic that makes you think is qualified as "pretentious" to you, I'm not surprised.

    No, let's just keep writing stuff that even an eight year old would get bored off. Big villain comes along, hero beats up the villain, perfectly black & white world and it's done with in another issue to be rinsed and repeated for years.

    Quote Originally Posted by SteveGus View Post
    Writers coming from that background are not discouraged from having disdain for traditional superheroes,
    Why should they be? It's no one's business other than their own.

    And again, Garth Ennis is not the rule. And he even he likes Superman.

    Hey, let's look at the current DC writers who are also doing Vertigo projects. Jeff Lemire, Scott Snyder, Paul Cornell? Uh, gee, none of them look like guys who hate superheroes.

    Quote Originally Posted by SteveGus View Post
    and don't learn what works and doesn't work in the genre.
    Really? Cos it seems to me that it's more often the fanboy writers are the ones who drag the genre down by just rehashing stuff rather than taking anything new from what they've learned from writing in other areas.

    Quote Originally Posted by SteveGus View Post
    With the 'cuffs' business, Azzarello invalidated each of the few fight scenes he had written before that issue. You don't have your hero have her fundament handed to her over and over, and then reveal that she knew all along that she had powers that could have won those fights for her. A real superhero writer would have seen a problem there.
    Because the idea of a superhero writer bringing out new or secret abilities at the last minute is completely unheard of.

    Quote Originally Posted by SteveGus View Post
    His run has sought to degrade and darken the contributions of every previous writer of Wonder Woman, and continues to impress me as an elaborate gesture of contempt for everything that she and her world have ever been. I call it vandalism.
    What was that about Vertigo being pretentious? Look at how you're acting about how important the former history of WW is. Pretentious in a nutshell.

    Quote Originally Posted by SteveGus View Post
    And besides that, it is, as you note, underwritten and boring, and if you just ignore the wordplay, you can get the gist of every issue in thirty seconds of browsing.
    WOW. YOU MEAN TO TELL ME, YOU CAN GET THE GIST OF A TWENTY PAGE COMIC'S STORY JUST BY FLICKING THROUGH IT? HOW COMPLETELY UNHEARD OF. IT DOESN'T SOUND LIKE SOMETHING PEOPLE HAVE BEEN DOING AT COMIC BOOK STORES FOR YEARS.

    Quote Originally Posted by SteveGus View Post
    You see the world he's failed to build, and I remember the world he's tried to destroy.
    I remember it too, in my nightmares.

  2. #92
    Marquis de carabas's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by LoneNecromancer View Post
    Because the idea of a superhero writer bringing out new or secret abilities at the last minute is completely unheard of.
    Or just simply decides he's not going to play nice anymore...

    'The marquis. Well, you know, to be honest, he seems a little bit dodgy to me.'
    'Mm,' she agreed. 'He's a little bit dodgy in the same way that rats are a little bit covered in fur."

  3. #93
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    Grant Morrison hates superheroes guys. Did you see how he pissed all over them in Animal Man.

  4. #94
    The curious one.
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    As someone who's never read a Vertigo title I have to say I don't mind this pace for Wonder Woman. I don't think that it would work with Superman, but I like it here.

  5. #95

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    Quote Originally Posted by LoneNecromancer View Post
    *wall of text responding to and refuting Steve's unfounded claims about Vertigo*
    You might as well be banging your head against a brick wall.

    Quote Originally Posted by Mr. Holmes View Post
    Grant Morrison hates superheroes guys. Did you see how he pissed all over them in Animal Man.
    Man did you see how Garth Ennis pissed all over Superman in his Hitman run?



    Last edited by The Man From Room X; 11-29-2012 at 06:11 PM.
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  6. #96

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    Quote Originally Posted by Mark_S View Post
    As someone who's never read a Vertigo title I have to say I don't mind this pace for Wonder Woman. I don't think that it would work with Superman, but I like it here.
    Azzarello stated from the very beginning the story is intended to feel like an odyssey. Odysseys are long and drawn-out. He also said he'll be on the title for a while. There will always be some fans, usually the same ones, who will go out of their way to find a bone to pick for whatever reason.
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  7. #97
    Senior Member Superdog's Avatar
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    Until someone can prove to me that every DC character isn't a serial rapist, I'm dropping all my DC books.
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  8. #98
    Completely sauced... klinton's Avatar
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    If we didn't have her fighting Cheetah over in Justice League and popping up in other corners of the DCU, I might agree with the OP.

    As it stands, I'm enjoying the current run for what it is: just another take on Diana in a long history of divergent concepts. I'm more than happy to let him spin his story.

    And, really, if it's not for you...just wait and she'll be completely reinvented by the next writer. Such is Wonder Woman. It always has been.
    Freedom is merely the ability to live without fear of persecution.

  9. #99

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    Quote Originally Posted by Superdog View Post
    Until someone can prove to me that every DC character isn't a serial rapist, I'm dropping all my DC books.
    Sounds like something a serial rapist would say.
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    What if a child dreamed of becoming something other than what society had intended? What if a child aspired to something greater? Man of Steel

  10. #100
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    Quote Originally Posted by carabas View Post
    Or just simply decides he's not going to play nice anymore...

    Funny you should mention him, didn't Daken just push to that point in that last issue of UXF?

  11. #101
    U dont need my user title brettc1's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by carabas View Post
    Or just simply decides he's not going to play nice anymore...

    I bought this issue when it came out.

    Just sayin'
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  12. #102
    CBR Mod/WW Section Mom Gaelforce's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by brettc1 View Post
    I bought this issue when it came out.

    Just sayin'
    I go back to issue 2 of the original series, so there :p

  13. #103
    U dont need my user title brettc1's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gaelforce View Post
    I go back to issue 2 of the original series, so there :p
    Not issue 1?

    Fail.
    Irene Adler: “I would have you right here on this desk until you begged for mercy twice.”
    Sherlock: “I’ve never begged for mercy in my life.”
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  14. #104
    CBR Mod/WW Section Mom Gaelforce's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by brettc1 View Post
    Not issue 1?

    Fail.
    Believe me, I feel the pain of that fail every day ;)

    Not as much as missin' Avengers 4, tho' :(

  15. #105

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    Quote Originally Posted by fanboiii View Post
    Azzarello stated from the very beginning the story is intended to feel like an odyssey. Odysseys are long and drawn-out. He also said he'll be on the title for a while. There will always be some fans, usually the same ones, who will go out of their way to find a bone to pick for whatever reason.
    No, the reason's clear; they don't like this style of storytelling. That's fine, but a lot of folks do like this style of storytelling. It's a valid approach.

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