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  1. #31
    Hey, Larry! Darrell D.'s Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by fishbonex View Post
    Of course it should have, they own it and he doesn't.
    And it really lowered the tone in regards to how DC feels about creators.
    Sure, they own it, and they can publish whatever they want with the property, but it made whatever they say about respecting creators merely lip service.

  2. #32
    Veteran Member glennsim's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by fishbonex View Post
    Of course it should have, they own it and he doesn't.
    Not that I care much either way, but technically owning it means they can, but doesn't actually reflect on whether they should.
    The DC relaunch was successful and was executed in what was most likely the best way it could given restrictions we wouldn't know about. No, your idea wouldn't have worked. Now move on.

  3. #33

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    Quote Originally Posted by glennsim View Post
    Not that I care much either way, but technically owning it means they can, but doesn't actually reflect on whether they should.
    This. I'm not as passionate about it as others. I chose not to read the BW stuff. I wasn't super mad at it or anything. But I don't really think they should have done it.

  4. #34
    Senior Member new_onslaught's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Darrell D. View Post
    And it really lowered the tone in regards to how DC feels about creators.
    Sure, they own it, and they can publish whatever they want with the property, but it made whatever they say about respecting creators merely lip service.
    Respect is a 2-way street. Moore has no respect for DC, why DC should? On the other hand DC really respects Gaiman and haven't touched his work, and on the one or 2 cases that happened, he was asked for permission, even if it wasn't necessary. It's not like DC said "Screw Moore. We own the stuff". They were trying for years to make him come back and do something with Watchmen. He didn't want to come.
    IMO DC indeed respects creators and that is proven in the way they give them royalties for their creations, while Marvel I hear really sucks in this department.

  5. #35

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    They kind of screwed Moore to begin with on Watchmen.

    Marvel has been strictly work for hire since becoming Marvel in the early 60s.

  6. #36

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    Respect is a 2-way street. Moore has no respect for DC, why DC should? On the other hand DC really respects Gaiman and haven't touched his work, and on the one or 2 cases that happened, he was asked for permission, even if it wasn't necessary. It's not like DC said "Screw Moore. We own the stuff". They were trying for years to make him come back and do something with Watchmen.
    Technically, that is what they did.

    You can't compare Sandman to Watchmen and the respective creators. Gaiman left Sandman open ended so that he could come back and add to it at a later date if he decided to. Moore wrote a complete story and adding to it would be against his artistic vision for the Watchmen. So Moore saying no makes sense in that context. He's saying no because he wrote the entire story already. His feelings towards DC don't really matter in this regard. If he feels he finished his story then that's how the man feels. It's easy to be respectful of a creator when they're giving you what you want, true respect comes from a situation like this. Had Gaiman said no, I'm sure they would've just slapped some other writer on a Sandman book anyways.

  7. #37
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    Quote Originally Posted by MadDog1981 View Post
    They kind of screwed Moore to begin with on Watchmen.

    Marvel has been strictly work for hire since becoming Marvel in the early 60s.
    Not true. Many creators were required to sign over the rights to their characters in order to continue working for the company. That's the whole basis for Gary Freidrich's lawsuit regarding Ghost Rider.

  8. #38
    Elder Member BrotherUnitNo_4's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kizmet View Post
    Except for the shared universe concept. To get the impact of the titles co-existing in the same reality it sort of helps to follow a number of titles from a single universe. There's only so much money a person can spend on comics which means limiting what you buy. The easiest way to put on budget controls while still following the larger universe that exists in comics is to decide to favor either Marvel or DC.
    Nah. I just read what I like. Occasionally other characters pop up and that's enough for me. If a book crosses over for something I'm not really invested in, I just skip the crossover and come back when it's done. I only buy what I enjoy, and I never pick up more comics than I mean to. If it's merely serviceable it gets cut. It's why I'm not picking up any DC books currently. Why hold myself to mediocre output or premises I have zero interest in just to get the full immersive experience?
    Currently reading She-Hulk, Deadpool, Swamp Thing, Ms. Marvel

    Probation: Ghost Rider, Loki: LoA, Secret Avengers

    Looking forward to All-New Ultimates, Flash Gordon and Doctor Mirage.

  9. #39

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    He gave away his rights to Ghost Rider when he cashed the check for it.

  10. #40
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    Quote Originally Posted by Darrell D. View Post
    And it really lowered the tone in regards to how DC feels about creators.
    Sure, they own it, and they can publish whatever they want with the property, but it made whatever they say about respecting creators merely lip service.
    Thats why they have Vertigo, creators are being respected over there. Meanwhile in DC, its work for hire.

  11. #41
    Power Corrupts Jabare's Avatar
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    I'm not loyal to DC I just gravitate to the quality titles. And at the moment DC puts out better books


  12. #42
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    Quote Originally Posted by MadDog1981 View Post
    He gave away his rights to Ghost Rider when he cashed the check for it.
    Your statement was that all Marvel work done for hire. This is clearly not the case. Courts have ruled that Freidrich signed his rights away but that doesn't change the fact that he was coerced into doing so.

  13. #43
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kizmet View Post
    Except for the shared universe concept. To get the impact of the titles co-existing in the same reality it sort of helps to follow a number of titles from a single universe. There's only so much money a person can spend on comics which means limiting what you buy. The easiest way to put on budget controls while still following the larger universe that exists in comics is to decide to favor either Marvel or DC.
    There are other publishers...

  14. #44

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    How was he coerced? It said point blank on the check that he was signing away the rights to the character and his work if he accepted the money. What would lead anyone at Marvel in the early 70s to believe they were going to retain control or rights of their characters?

  15. #45
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    Quote Originally Posted by new_onslaught View Post
    Respect is a 2-way street. Moore has no respect for DC, why DC should? On the other hand DC really respects Gaiman and haven't touched his work, and on the one or 2 cases that happened, he was asked for permission, even if it wasn't necessary. It's not like DC said "Screw Moore. We own the stuff". They were trying for years to make him come back and do something with Watchmen. He didn't want to come.
    IMO DC indeed respects creators and that is proven in the way they give them royalties for their creations, while Marvel I hear really sucks in this department.
    Why should Moore have any respect for a company that's been screwing him over for the last 25 years? All this bad blood started back in the eighties, and it wasn't just about the rights to Watchmen not reverting, either: they screwed Moore and Gibbons out of money owed on Watchmen merchandise by claiming it was "promotional material", for one thing. DC have never played fair with him, why should he have any respect for them whatsoever?

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