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  1. #16
    An idea in a moment a13506's Avatar
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    Winners:
    -Steve Trevor, he simply wasn't pre-52
    -Aquaman & Mera, finaly a classical character getting a much deserved spotlight
    -Animal man, a character who's not afraid of having a family
    -Swamp Thing, the return of a great
    -Wonder Woman, a clear and consistent direction
    -Flash, a coesive take on a classical character
    -Supergirl, finally some sense in her story
    -Andrew Bennet(I Vampire), a vampire that doesn't have to be a Twilightesque
    -Etrigan(Demon Knights), showing that tales in the past are as cool as any other
    -DC for introducing a new focus on their product

    Losers:
    -Green Arrow, a Tony Stark/Clint Barton wannabe
    -Hawkman, everything that was unique striped away
    -Firestorm, a mess of redundance and banality
    -Starfire, orange sexy kitten/weapon
    -Amanda Waller & Etta Candy, reduced to token status
    -Constantine, same name & abilities but nothing else
    -Catwoman, poorly written softcore erotica
    -Wally West, Donna Troy, Cass Cain, Steph Brown, all the others that are M.I.A.
    -Booster and the JLI crew, no humor or characterization
    -Barbara Gordon, for obvious reasons
    Last edited by a13506; 11-16-2012 at 02:47 PM.
    Best DC: Animal Man, Wonder Woman, Dial H.
    Best Marvel: Daredevil, X-Men Legacy.
    Best Independent: Walking Dead, Saga, Mind a Gap, Sixth Gun, Supurbia.

  2. #17
    Junior Member JSA's Avatar
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    Steve Trevor
    Aquaman & Mera
    Animal man
    Swamp Thing
    Wonder Woman
    Earth 2

    Losers:
    Oracle
    Amanda Waller
    Power Girl (from sublime -leader of JSA- to ridiculous .World Finest.
    Birds of Prey
    Wally West
    JLI (specially after the wonderful Generation Lost)
    Helena Bertinelli
    The JSA

  3. #18
    Senior Member Phantom Roxas's Avatar
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    Winner:
    John Constantine - As someone new to comics, I wouldn't have wanted to read about this character until then. I don't know what he lost beyond Hellblazer.

    Losers:
    Madame Xanadu - Maybe I'm being unfair because I didn't know what she was like before the reboot, but neither Demon Knights or Justice League Dark have made me like the character.
    Any Teen Titan or Batgirl not named Dick Grayson, Victor Stone, or Barbara Gordon.

  4. #19
    always correct Lotech's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bonemachine View Post
    Uh ... what? I know you said it's just your opinion but you didn't really define what criteria you're basing this on and this really throws me off.
    To answer your question, again this is my opinion you may have your own. I evaluated Wonder Woman in all her appearances thus far (not just in B.A.'s book). My preferred Wonder Woman is a smarter more virtuous character than is being presented. I like her to solve some problems with her mind too but I only saw that when she manipulated Poseidon. Horror isn't my thing and Brian is trying to tell this story in a horror framework. I will give Chaing a plus on his work, I think its better than what Lee is doing. My only complaints about her outfit is that the choker creates functional issues with range of motion and a possible cut risk. If they want her wearing armbands then put them on both arms instead of one, because symmetry just looks better. Johns, I believe, does the bulk of the damage in the reboot. She seems nearly one-dimenional in JL, I don't see WW as someone eager for violence, but she can take care of a fight if one breaks out. She went on and on in JL about "What a great day it is for a fight" that at any point I expected her to say "It's clobbering time". The Supes-Wondy couple thing is a non-issue to me, I think its only is a negative for Lois Lane (but that another discussion). The fate of Earth-2 WW also figures in to my stance on how she has been handled. As for her origin change, I find it less unique than the clay-doll origin, but I'm wanting to see how it effects her dealings with Circe (if they ever meet). As for the Amazons, I would have hoped their society would have been more ethically diverse rather about killing and hate. I ask this question: If the Amazons killed all the men then how does Steve Trevor get off the island alive? Also, the Amazons have conventional lifespans in the reboot. Hippolyta, however, should be an immortal Amazon because she is also around in ancient times in actual greek mythology. As for their fate at the hands of Hera, it seems like Brian didn't know what to do with them he pushed them out of the story as soon as possible. That's my 2 cents on DC's handling of Wonder Woman and the Amazons.

  5. #20
    Junior Member aaronghunter's Avatar
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    Winners: Wonder Woman, Mera, Steve Trevor, Kid Eternity, The Penguin, Aquaman, Animal Man, Entrigan, Vandal Savage, Poison Ivy
    Losers: Barbara Gordon, Amanda Waller, Superman, Hawkman, Deathstroke, Stephanie Brown, Cassandra Cain, Oliver Queen, Bane, Harley Quinn

    There are also a number of characters who were doing poorly beforehand which haven't seen a rise in their fortunes so far, including; Roy Harper & Huntress

  6. #21

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    John Constantine lost the most.
    /thread
    BB

  7. #22
    always correct Lotech's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MajorHoy View Post
    I think many Vertigo loyalists will argue with you about Constantine. (Did you ever read any issues of Hellblazer?)
    Oliver Queen so far has been the poster boy of "Loser" in many readers' opinions considering how much personality he lost by being de-aged and how badly they feel his character has been fumbled and neutered among various writers who have mis-handled his own title.
    I think two issues is a little too soon to pass judgement on Talon, and Hal Jordan is currently dead, isn't he? (Granted, that's the best he's been for a while, but . . . )
    Bringing John Constantine into the main DCnU is a huge plus for the character that I put him on my Winners list. Oliver Queen's new look combined with the extra exposure he's getting with JLA and Arrow is a plus enough that he makes my Winners list. Owlman and Talon are on my Winners list for much of the same reason as Constantine. As for Zatanna, I think her makeover was the best of the New 52. Hal made the list regardless of recent events, because he was pretty much the lead character on John's JL book for at least the first story arch. I liked Aquaman's makeover as well. Flash seems to play a larger role since flashpoint. As for Strife, how much page time did she ever get as Eris? Cyborg got promoted to the Justice League, plus for him. Steve Trevor seems to be getting positioned as a Nick Fury-type expanding his role in the reboot. And then there's Bat-Cow... the only truly awesome new character in the DCnU.

  8. #23
    The Dominoed Daredoll batGRRRl4ever's Avatar
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    Well this seems yet another in the long line of, "Oh woah is me I want to go back to Pre-Flashpoint" b****-fest threads. I recommend an immediate merging to the New 52 b****-fest MEGA-thread: http://forums.comicbookresources.com...mplaint-Thread so we can try to contain the cancer that is these types of threads.
    Pull list:
    Batgirl, Earth 2, Inhuman, Justice League Beyond 2.0, Letter 44, She-Hulk, Swamp Thing, Ultimate FF

  9. #24
    always correct Lotech's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by batGRRRl4ever View Post
    Well this seems yet another in the long line of, "Oh woah is me I want to go back to Pre-Flashpoint" b****-fest threads. I recommend an immediate merging to the New 52 b****-fest MEGA-thread: http://forums.comicbookresources.com...mplaint-Thread so we can try to contain the cancer that is these types of threads.
    If you are referring to me, I'm simply answering posters questions about my reasoning for how I ranked my Winners/Losers list. If you think I'm doing a b-fest, I'm not, trust me on that.

  10. #25
    Blue Boba ABH-1979's Avatar
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    Winners
    Batman (of Batman, Batman Inc. and Batman & Robin)
    Damian Wayne
    Wonder Woman
    Superman
    Cyborg
    Joker
    Penguin

    Losers
    Batman (of Detective and Dark Knight)
    The Teen Titans
    Steve Trevor
    Green Arrow
    Lois Lane
    Suicide Squad
    Deathstroke
    Rob Liefeld

    The rest fit in the middle somewhere.
    DC: Action Comics - Detective Comics - Batman and... - Batman - Justice League
    Marvel: All-New X-Factor

  11. #26
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    I don't think just getting Exposure is enough to call characters winners.

    Poochie had exposure.

    OK, that's not really fair. Poochie was never good, where as many of these characters have been written well in the past, just not now.

  12. #27
    always correct Lotech's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ves View Post
    I don't think just getting Exposure is enough to call characters winners.

    Poochie had exposure.

    OK, that's not really fair. Poochie was never good, where as many of these characters have been written well in the past, just not now.
    Poochie? lol

  13. #28

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    Quote Originally Posted by Phantom Roxas View Post
    Losers:
    Any Teen Titan or Batgirl not named Dick Grayson, Victor Stone, or Barbara Gordon.
    Although I like the current Nightwing title I think Dick and Babs are two of the biggest losers in the New 52. Dick has lost all his friends and any of his Titans history (where most of his biggest changes occurred). I am not horribly upset that Babs is Batgirl (personally I prefer Oracle) but I am not happy at what many (myself included) view as a severe regression in her personality and abilities.

  14. #29
    Senior Member ascended's Avatar
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    I know this is all just opinion and all, but I cannot see for the life of me how anyone can prefer what had been going on with Superman to the New52 treatment, even despite how poor the "Superman" title has been. By anyhoo.

    Winners

    Aquaman & Mera. I still miss the beard, but this title is DC's most solidly consistent title, and the best thing Johns has done since....Sinestro War?

    Steve Trevor. Finally, this is a guy I can actually see Diana being into. Trevor's hardcore, well defined, and has been a beacon of enjoyment in the midst of the terrible Justice League title.

    Wonder Woman. Simply the best her comic has been, for me, since Rucka. I love what Azzarello and Chiang have done for the most part, and what I dislike is outweighed by the positives.

    Vibe. Back from limbo/death **and** an ongoing solo? Hard to do better than that.

    Superman. As I said, the Superman title has been mediocre, but Action is just beautiful, and I love how DC is trying to raise Clark's position in the DCU back to being the king of his pantheon. Love the foundation being built.

    And just so this doesnt run overly long.....other winners

    Flash, the ENTIRE Dark line; Animal Man, Dial H and Swamp Thing in particular. Earth-2 and the whole JSA cast we've seen thus far. Cyborg. DC in general for bringing in different genre titles, and trying again when they fail (Men of War, GI Combat) and basically just having the balls to acknowledge that they and the industry were/are in serious trouble, and making real attempts to fix it.

    Losers?

    Green Arrow. Everything unique and interesting about Ollie was stripped away. Here's hoping Lemire can save him.

    Booster Gold. From Time Master back to idiot. Not cool, DC. Might be the greatest failure of the entire reboot. Im surprised Johns let that slide, given he's the one who built Booster up in the first place.

    Harley Quinn. I like her in Suicide Squad for the most part, but I feel like this isnt really Harley. I just cant embrace her like I used to. Maybe its just because she's not with Mr. J, since I have loved the scenes with/involving him.

    Others.....Mr. Terrific, the Milestone properties, J'onn J'onzz (I am curious about his new shtick tho), any character that Rob Liefield has touched, Amanda Waller, creators who arent Johns, Morrison, Snyder, or the few other elite.

  15. #30
    They LAUGHED at my theory SteveGus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lotech View Post
    Also, the Amazons have conventional lifespans in the reboot.
    Unless something happened in the book since I dropped it, this is not true. Amazons have comic-book immortality, alive and young until they're killed.

    Of course, Wonder Woman has been stripped of her home and her supporting cast. By having her world uglified and vandalized, she's lost just about everything that made the character unique or different. So yes, she's still the biggest loser in nuDC as far as I can see.
    Superhero comic books only become art to the extent that their banal, unrealistic fantasy and garish styles go too far and become interesting. Attempts to ground them in reality can only ruin them.

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