Jesus > Superman

[dshipp17]

None of this makes Jesus God, y'know. And a lot of this is borrowed myth, anyway. Jesus' story wouldn't be the first of a metahuman performing fancy feats and rising from the dead and he certainly wouldn't be the last.
Regardless, Jesus never said he was God, and nowhere in the original gospel (that of Mark) was Jesus described as being God. Equating Christ with God is dogma the Catholic Church concocted.

That's all mostly bologna and I think you know it; actually, Christianity is a fulfillment of Jewish prophecy and a more plausible ridicule of Christianity by Jewish critics would be that the crucifixion was an allegory of parts of the Book of Psalms; the early Christians, like the fundamental Jews were completely antithetical to anything pagan related and the supposed borrowed myth that you appear to be eluding to is from paganism; this is a common recycled assertion that's been rebutted, where proponents such as yourself continue to recycle it, while leaving out the sound, crisp rebuttals. The Gospel of John clearly establishes my point of Jesus being God, although still separate. Jesus' case is the only one that actually demonstrated a resurrection and it will be the last, until Jesus raises His loyal servants from the grave. The Catholic Church did not write the Gospel of John, so, please, do yourself a favor and stop recycling garbage to spew it as if it's something new and hasn't been considered. If you can't tell it's garbage, I'd advise debating with Everett Ferguson; he's the theologian, while I'm more the scientist, see http://www.discovery.org/a/2640

[dshipp17]

Those few were uneducated fisherman who couldn't read or write. How do you know they didn't inflate Jesus' story to mythical proportions?
We're not even sure the writers of the gospels had any contact with Jesus. Actually, we're quite sure Mark, Luke, and John didn't personally know Jesus.



That's a poor analogy. I can go online and find papers printed in London and Ireland that covered the assassination of JFK. There are people living today who were there. The whole world took note of it, even if they didn't know who JFK was. An American President had been assassinated. Who would face martyrdom over that?



Jesus never said he was God. So, why would they say he was God?
The son of God, yes, but God himself, no. No devout Jew would say that, and they were all still Jews through and through.

Is it always necessary for a biographer to have had contact with someone they're writing about? Additionally, this was a period of persecution for the Christians, so it's not surprising the the evidence has to take a certain form, etc Septimius Severus; additionally, if there were so many available myths and magicians at the uneducated disposal at the time, why single out Jesus? What you're proposing doesn't have firm legs.

The JFK analogy would also be a poor one for establishing the existence of Tiberius too; that time period lacked certain technology, obviously. Additionally, the things establishing JFK's existence is lacking to prove that I exist too, but clearly I will have existed 2000 years from now.

Jesus establishes His divinity throughout the Book of John. They made the distinction because Jesus is the Son of God rather than God the Father; The Holy Ghost is different in a sense also.

[dshipp17]

There were no such people, but whatever, I'll humor you.
All of this is his fault anyway. If he's omnipotent and omniscient why didn't he see any of this coming? Why didn't he take not of the outcome and say, "It ain't worth the headache"?
Is all this just some game to him because he's suffering from cosmic boredom? If he didn't see any of this coming (and Genesis indicates that he didn't given his regrets) than you can't refer to God as "omniscient". If he did see all this coming then he's horribly abusive and criminally negligent.



That's not free will.



Which malevolent force would that be, and why did God create it?



"Yes, let them live. I'll take my frustrations out on some other people's poor kid."



Not according to All-Star Superman #11.



Satan didn't do anything God didn't allow.
And mind you, before the story of Job was concocted, Satan wasn't blamed for things going bad in a person's life. It was the individual who sinned that bore God's wrath on his head. Satan never came into the equation.

As I said, God is omnipresent so He did see it coming; I established that God chooses to ask questions that He clearly already knows the answer; that’s established throughout the other Books of the Old Testament and also in the other parts of the Book of Genesis. All of this is the fault of the specified examples who exercised their free will. So, in other words, the people responsible for putting Ted Bundy and all those similar to death are murderers to you, right? They’d be abusive and criminally negligent, right? You can’t be a robot subject to complete control and have a free will at the same time.

What you say is somewhat true, but only because Satan's role was left ambiguous until the Book of Job was written. Job is not made up or it would not be canonized in the Bible; there are other books, however, for you to choose from that have not been canonized.

[dshipp17]

Prove it. Prove that it happened. You're arguing Jesus as God like it's a fact. It isn't. Neither is it a fact he rose for the dead. Or died for our sins. Or that he wasn't in it soley for the fame.



If Superman evolved into becoming God then he would not have preexisted himself. He would have evolved into God and then have existed always since he's now God and can be a paradox. Like it's a paradox that you believe Jesus is human yet also God.

At this point I think you're either a troll or you only believe the dogma that was force fed to you and you aren't capable or simply don't want to do a little critical thinking.

The establishment of Christianity, based the subsequent blood of thousands a few years after Jesus’s resurrection, is the proof that Jesus was God and no profit hungry charlatan. His resurrection, along with His many miracles, establishes Jesus was God; Jesus said if you do not believe my words, believe my works, as establishing His divinity.

Your Superman argument breaks down, because there is only One God, but many Superman like comic book characters; why Superman and not say DC’s Captain Marvel or Marvel’s Gladiator? They both have very similar characteristics as Superman; they just simply need the same story written about them, similar to the referred to Superman story.

[christinereed]

I like Superman, but I agree, there's no comparison between Jesus and Superman. Superman may have some messianic qualities, but he's not the Savior. And, he's not really like Moses. I don't understand why people say he's like Moses. Moses led his people out of slavery and died before they reached the promised land. Where's the Superman story in that? Has Kal-el found a group of Kryptonian survivors who are being enslaved and is leading them to a new home? Has Superman brought his people the Law?

Anyway, I say we enjoy the story and stop trying to make Superman something he isn't.

[Mr. Holmes]

I like Superman, but I agree, there's no comparison between Jesus and Superman. Superman may have some messianic qualities, but he's not the Savior.

Yeah well neither is Jesus, who has been kind of a no-show for quite a while anyway.

[LoneNecromancer]

Has Kal-el found a group of Kryptonian survivors who are being enslaved and is leading them to a new home?

Bottle city of Kandor anyone?

And well, in All-Star Superman he led them to Mars.

[Flash Gordon]

Superman is already fading and he's not even lasted a century, various mythologies have endured longer than that. This thread is more than ridiculous, and whilst it's fun to bash the bible thumpers there's not any real debate on the impact both characters have had on their societies. This thread is very weak :(

$225 million dollars disagrees with you.

Back to your bridge troll, you might still have time to snatch a few merchant's purses.

[Conan The Barbarian]

Even Vibe is better then Jesus

[Gabe De Los Muertos]

Goku can take them both.

[Castel]

Superman is already fading

True that's this franchise is really far from what it was once. Maybe the movie, if it's any good, will bring some new fans to the franchise but i doubt it will really change things on the long term.

Goku can take them both

No question here.

[R0NIN]

The establishment of Christianity, based the subsequent blood of thousands a few years after Jesus’s resurrection, is the proof that Jesus was God and no profit hungry charlatan. His resurrection, along with His many miracles, establishes Jesus was God; Jesus said if you do not believe my words, believe my works, as establishing His divinity.

That's all based on a belief. Not proof. You and countless others BELIEVE he resurrected and BELIEVE he did many miracles.

Your Superman argument breaks down, because there is only One God, but many Superman like comic book characters; why Superman and not say DC’s Captain Marvel or Marvel’s Gladiator? They both have very similar characteristics as Superman; they just simply need the same story written about them, similar to the referred to Superman story.

You're argument is even worse then? How many Gods were there before yours? Thousands. Yours is the newest version. At least Superman was the first of his "kind". Why your God and not Islam's or the Jew's or the countless others. They all have similiar characteristics, similiar to your bible. Many in fact share entire sections of your bible. Oops you defeated yourself with your own argument. Bye Bye now.

[Conan The Barbarian]

You know why Superman will always be better than Jesus or any God out there? Unlike these so called “Gods” Superman would never tell us to worship him or obey him, he would never torture and kill us or ask for us to kill in his name, and most of all he respects and cherishes human life.

[Auguste Dupin]

True that's this franchise is really far from what it was once. Maybe the movie, if it's any good, will bring some new fans to the franchise but i doubt it will really change things on the long term.



No question here.

- On the other hand, if we had to say Hercules or Robin Hood was fading everytime something they were starring didn't make enough money, they would have been considered extinct by now. Everyone knows who Superman is, just like everyone knows who Mickey Mouse or Mario is. Superman Returns made more money than Batman Begins (and was only considered a deception due to his huge budget, due to the fact they put all the budgets of all their previous attempts at making a new film on it), Smallville lasted 10 seasons, and Earth One sold very well. So.....define "fading"?
Every "franchise" has its up and down. Hercules wasn't exactly a popular character during the Middle Age.


- As a big follower of DBZ, it really depends how you look at it. The Silver Age Superman would kick Goku's ass without much of a sweat.

[Surtur]

Why does this need to be out there? Did someone start up a cult worshipping Superman or something?

Though strictly speaking, Superman would be "better" then Jesus. He's done far more for the world, saved it more times..even helped save galaxies/the entire universe. Sorry Jesus you just don't operate on that scale.

You know why Superman will always be better than Jesus or any God out there? Unlike these so called “Gods” Superman would never tell us to worship him or obey him, he would never torture and kill us or ask for us to kill in his name, and most of all he respects and cherishes human life.

I'd also point out he actively tries to help people instead of just letting crap happen.