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  1. #46
    Spider-man/DCU Moderator ShaggyB's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DarkWarriorBlake View Post
    You can't criticize people who complain that Roderick Kingsley is dead and then over a year later you retcon it so he isn't.
    Thats not a retcon. Thats called a reveal. Was Roger Stern doing a retcon to Ned Leeds being Hobby or was he revealing how it wasnt Leeds (Ned did seem to be a left field reveal anyway)?

  2. #47

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    Quote Originally Posted by Dan_Slott View Post
    So a lot of the more angry and critical types are upset that a room that should have had an unconscious Norman Osborn AND armed guards is found to be completely empty.

    I'm stunned.

    Feels like the same kind of posters who'd read a scene where a person IN A MASK got their head cut off-- who'd then get HORRIBLY upset that "Roderick Kingsley" was beheaded.
    :-P

    Swear to God, it's like some of you have NEVER read a comic book before. :-)

    Take a second.
    Unclench.
    Think about it.

    Then carry on. :-)
    I wasn't that upset when kingsley supposedly died did I think it was a bit lame to have him killed so easily after all his history with Spider-man as a premier Super villain ? Yes. Did I still like the new hobgoblin? Yes. I found him to be more of a psycho than the original ever was and think he's a fun character but that's not the issue here. The issue here is the huge leap in logic to have Norman Osborn in a regular hospital with no guard and after giving the panel another once over not so much as a pair of hand cuffs to keep him locked to the bed. I like the current stories you've been doing they've been fun and entertaining but that doesn't mean if I see something bad I'm not going to point it out.

  3. #48

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    Quote Originally Posted by DarkWarriorBlake View Post
    You can't criticize people who complain that Roderick Kingsley is dead and then over a year later you retcon it so he isn't. Unless you have bits in the earlier stories that imply otherwise why would anyone think it isn't a retcon? Someone with more knowledge can correct me but has he ever had a brother referred to before? Then "oh, my long lost brother was killed and I've been chilling down here not thinking to ask how he's doing for months, time to go get revenge"
    It was mentioned he had a brother many times before, his brother has appeared many times before, I think he's even wore the Hobgoblin costume before.

    The thing that made the Bobgoblin popular and not just a Green Goblin knock off was that he constantly made people think someone else was the Hobgoblin. And if you look back at the thread that was started when that happened a lot of people theorized that it was his brother straight away.
    "Dan Slott was also unbelievably helpful during this period as he helped me formulate some of the ideas that eventually be used in "OMIT." Dan is a champ and an idea machine" - Joey Q

  4. #49

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    Quote Originally Posted by The Angry Comic Book Critic View Post
    I wasn't that upset when kingsley supposedly died did I think it was a bit lame to have him killed so easily after all his history with Spider-man as a premier Super villain ? Yes. Did I still like the new hobgoblin? Yes. I found him to be more of a psycho than the original ever was and think he's a fun character but that's not the issue here. The issue here is the huge leap in logic to have Norman Osborn in a regular hospital with no guard and after giving the panel another once over not so much as a pair of hand cuffs to keep him locked to the bed. I like the current stories you've been doing they've been fun and entertaining but that doesn't mean if I see something bad I'm not going to point it out.

    My problem with the complaints is that it is just one panel. We're so quick to analyse everything we don't wait for the actual story to come. Ypu're calling something stupid based on two panels.
    "Dan Slott was also unbelievably helpful during this period as he helped me formulate some of the ideas that eventually be used in "OMIT." Dan is a champ and an idea machine" - Joey Q

  5. #50
    Marked for Redemption David Walton's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Michael Deery View Post
    My problem with the complaints is that it is just one panel. We're so quick to analyse everything we don't wait for the actual story to come. Ypu're calling something stupid based on two panels.
    I was cool with Norman escaping, but I don't really have a problem with someone posting their objections to that scene.

    It's a valid complaint that didn't take me out of the story, but I can see where others would feel differently.
    "I came to the conclusion that the optimist thought everything good except the pessimist, and the pessimist thought everything bad, except himself." -- G.K. Chesterton

  6. #51
    Moderator Mister Mets's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DarkWarriorBlake View Post
    You can't criticize people who complain that Roderick Kingsley is dead and then over a year later you retcon it so he isn't. Unless you have bits in the earlier stories that imply otherwise why would anyone think it isn't a retcon? Someone with more knowledge can correct me but has he ever had a brother referred to before? Then "oh, my long lost brother was killed and I've been chilling down here not thinking to ask how he's doing for months, time to go get revenge"

    As for the hospital scene the only explanation is that the the guards were part of Osborn's Goblin-cult and he's still in a coma. But the cult hasn't been referenced in a long time either so can't blame people for not jumping to that conclusion. Course that still doesn't explain why he is in a regular hospital and not the Raft or something, unless it wasn't Norman Osborn.
    Roderick Kingsley's brother first appeared decades ago. He had a prominent role in The Hobgoblin Lives mini-series, as well as Goblins at the Gate, the follow-up in Spectacular Spider-Man.

    With the Norman Osborn scene, we're speculating about three panels. So there might be a lot of stuff going on off-panel.
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  7. #52
    Marked for Redemption David Walton's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mister Mets View Post
    Roderick Kingsley's brother first appeared decades ago. He had a prominent role in The Hobgoblin Lives mini-series, as well as Goblins at the Gate, the follow-up in Spectacular Spider-Man.

    With the Norman Osborn scene, we're speculating about three panels. So there might be a lot of stuff going on off-panel.
    Sure. But until those details are revealed, what's the harm in fans saying whether the scene did or didn't work for them?

    The same way people can still argue about whether the SNAP! sound effect in ASM 121 was or wasn't detrimental to the story.
    "I came to the conclusion that the optimist thought everything good except the pessimist, and the pessimist thought everything bad, except himself." -- G.K. Chesterton

  8. #53
    Viva la Cyclops Red Lotus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DarkWarriorBlake View Post
    You can't criticize people who complain that Roderick Kingsley is dead and then over a year later you retcon it so he isn't. Unless you have bits in the earlier stories that imply otherwise why would anyone think it isn't a retcon? Someone with more knowledge can correct me but has he ever had a brother referred to before? Then "oh, my long lost brother was killed and I've been chilling down here not thinking to ask how he's doing for months, time to go get revenge"

    As for the hospital scene the only explanation is that the the guards were part of Osborn's Goblin-cult and he's still in a coma. But the cult hasn't been referenced in a long time either so can't blame people for not jumping to that conclusion. Course that still doesn't explain why he is in a regular hospital and not the Raft or something, unless it wasn't Norman Osborn.
    Wasn't that the cult who Phil attacked at the start of the arc? There are times it seems readers want their hands to be held and have the writer walk them through point by point of a story. Some time things are explained in a year and some time its the very next issue. I remember one issue ending with a scene that made everyone b&*^@ about something only for the next issue to start with showing how the ending of the last issue was really one character tricking another.
    McKenstry those with the most opinions often have the fewest facts.

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  9. #54
    Junior Member tv horror's Avatar
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    I worked out it was Roderick's brother at the time but what put me off was the Phil Hobgoblin held the head up by its hair yet Daniel was bald, superglue anyone. A case of back tracking yet again.

  10. #55
    Moderator Mister Mets's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by David Walton View Post
    Sure. But until those details are revealed, what's the harm in fans saying whether the scene did or didn't work for them?

    The same way people can still argue about whether the SNAP! sound effect in ASM 121 was or wasn't detrimental to the story.
    Side question. Is there anyone who thinks the SNAP! sound effect was detrimental to ASM 121?
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  11. #56
    Spider-man/DCU Moderator ShaggyB's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mister Mets View Post
    Side question. Is there anyone who thinks the SNAP! sound effect was detrimental to ASM 121?
    yes and no... on the one hand its good to have ambiguity.... but on the other hand, id prefer a clear answer and not have to speculate for years.

  12. #57
    Spider-man/DCU Moderator ShaggyB's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by tv horror View Post
    I worked out it was Roderick's brother at the time but what put me off was the Phil Hobgoblin held the head up by its hair yet Daniel was bald, superglue anyone. A case of back tracking yet again.
    You are remembering it wrong:

    Just looked at 649 and he is holding his head by the cowl.

  13. #58

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    I've never been a fan of the Snap! because its frustrating! Within the story, its not really followed up on. Peter blames himself, but its not clear that he thought he killed Gwen directly, in the story. It doesn't help things that Gwen was depicted as lifeless before being tossed off the bridge, so it could just as easily be said that Norman killed her before he threw her off the bridge.

    (In subsequent retellings, there have been all sorts of modifications, including showing her clearly alive seconds before the fall. But in the original story, its pretty unclear who exactly killed her.)

    As the pirate with the steering wheel in his pants once said..."it drives me nuts!"
    Perfect humility dispenses with modesty.

  14. #59
    Marked for Redemption David Walton's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mister Mets View Post
    Side question. Is there anyone who thinks the SNAP! sound effect was detrimental to ASM 121?
    I'm not a big fan of the idea Spider-Man is deliberately responsible for Gwen Stacy's death.
    "I came to the conclusion that the optimist thought everything good except the pessimist, and the pessimist thought everything bad, except himself." -- G.K. Chesterton

  15. #60
    Junior Member tv horror's Avatar
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    Hello shaggyB yes I know about the cowl but the weight of a severed head would just fall out unless it had hair to hold as well, also before you say it I know it is only a comic lol. I also forgot about paste pot Pete he could do the job as a side line, hurry hurry hurry get your toupee glue here!

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