Another kiss by WW and Superman

[Javier Velasco]

"As far as I know, this is a forum in which both positive and negative opinions can be expressed as long as they are expressed respectfully."

That is correct. Everyone should feel free to comment as they wish.

That said, please do not engage other posters personally on their "refusal to acknowledge", "talent for hyperbole", etc. While you are not using bad language, you are still making a negative statement about the validity of another poster's point of view. And that is looked down upon in the WW board.

Or better put, it is not allowed.

If you feel you have come to an endless loop with a particular poster on a particular discussion, just acknowledge it and move on.

Thank you and enjoy the board.

Javier Velasco

[Sacred Knight]

Seen people elsewhere on the net complaining that their fears of Diana being defined by her relationship with Superman are now being confirmed...because he tried to make her feel better about Barbara's betrayal. Oookay. Like she flew home in tears, put on some sweatpants, curled up in a ball in bed eating potato chips until Superman came to rescue her. She was mad at herself and he tried to make her feel better (it worked). Big whoop. Could it be said that Superman was dangerously close to being defined by his relationship by Wonder Woman when he was laying in a heap, useless as a were-Cheetah with Diana determined to protect him? Of course not. Just kinda seems like a double standard to me.

[Nocturnus]

Seen people elsewhere on the net complaining that their fears of Diana being defined by her relationship with Superman are now being confirmed...because he tried to make her feel better about Barbara's betrayal. Oookay. Like she flew home in tears, put on some sweatpants, curled up in a ball in bed eating potato chips until Superman came to rescue her. She was mad at herself and he tried to make her feel better (it worked). Big whoop. Could it be said that Superman was dangerously close to being defined by his relationship by Wonder Woman when he was laying in a heap, useless as a were-Cheetah with Diana determined to protect him? Of course not. Just kinda seems like a double standard to me.

Lol. It's blatantly obvious they are pulling these out of their butts due to personal bias.

[brettc1]

Seen people elsewhere on the net complaining that their fears of Diana being defined by her relationship with Superman are now being confirmed...because he tried to make her feel better about Barbara's betrayal. Oookay. Like she flew home in tears, put on some sweatpants, curled up in a ball in bed eating potato chips until Superman came to rescue her. She was mad at herself and he tried to make her feel better (it worked). Big whoop. Could it be said that Superman was dangerously close to being defined by his relationship by Wonder Woman when he was laying in a heap, useless as a were-Cheetah with Diana determined to protect him? Of course not. Just kinda seems like a double standard to me.

I agree, that's a pretty weak argument. I haven't seen Wonder Woman in sweatpants and curled up eating comfort food since the last 60 seconds of the failed pilot last year.

[kylesgirl]

Seen people elsewhere on the net complaining that their fears of Diana being defined by her relationship with Superman are now being confirmed...because he tried to make her feel better about Barbara's betrayal. Oookay. Like she flew home in tears, put on some sweatpants, curled up in a ball in bed eating potato chips until Superman came to rescue her. She was mad at herself and he tried to make her feel better (it worked). Big whoop. Could it be said that Superman was dangerously close to being defined by his relationship by Wonder Woman when he was laying in a heap, useless as a were-Cheetah with Diana determined to protect him? Of course not. Just kinda seems like a double standard to me.

Are you surprised? Yeah as a superman fan we should all be screaming Johns let Superman need Diana in the earlier pages. I have seen one particular group who is doing this around the internet. They have a lot of times condemned Azzarello's Wonder Woman ( so I presume many are not reading it) and Justice League and the argument they care for WW is so full of bs...they care for the agenda they have. It's not double standards but butthurt shippers.

[Outside_85]

I agree, that's a pretty weak argument. I haven't seen Wonder Woman in sweatpants and curled up eating comfort food since the last 60 seconds of the failed pilot last year.

Wasnt she wearing sweatpants at the end of Hiketeia?

[brettc1]

Wasnt she wearing sweatpants at the end of Hiketeia?

Cant remember - that was the one where Batman comforted her by letting her step on his head, right?

[misslane38]

Seen people elsewhere on the net complaining that their fears of Diana being defined by her relationship with Superman are now being confirmed...because he tried to make her feel better about Barbara's betrayal. Oookay. Like she flew home in tears, put on some sweatpants, curled up in a ball in bed eating potato chips until Superman came to rescue her. She was mad at herself and he tried to make her feel better (it worked). Big whoop. Could it be said that Superman was dangerously close to being defined by his relationship by Wonder Woman when he was laying in a heap, useless as a were-Cheetah with Diana determined to protect him? Of course not. Just kinda seems like a double standard to me.

Although I am not among those who made statements like the ones you mentioned above, I do have issues with Diana's recent multi-issue arc consisting of a lot of her needing handling, comfort, support, and guidance from her teammates, especially Superman. Some of that stuff would be fine, if it's a give-and-take, but it's become a bit too unbalanced at this point. The double standard I see with Superman needing Diana to save him from Cheetah is that it not only puts him in the damsel-in-distress role, which I was told was one reason why Lois was an unworthy love interest, but it also makes you wonder why Diana didn't react to Superman's victimization at the hands of someone trying to hurt her as a reason to push him away for his own good.

[brettc1]

Although I am not among those who made statements like the ones you mentioned above, I do have issues with Diana's recent multi-issue arc consisting of a lot of her needing handling, comfort, support, and guidance from her teammates, especially Superman. Some of that stuff would be fine, if it's a give-and-take, but it's become a bit too unbalanced at this point. The double standard I see with Superman needing Diana to save him from Cheetah is that it not only puts him in the damsel-in-distress role, which I was told was one reason why Lois was an unworthy love interest, but it also makes you wonder why Diana didn't react to Superman's victimization at the hands of someone trying to hurt her as a reason to push him away for his own good.

Well now hang on.

I think the thing people want to see here are two characters who can basically save each other. Johns was pretty clever to have Clark play the victim first because it immediately takes the sting out of the argument that Wonder Woman is playing second fiddle. He also deflect the charge that Diana is going to overshadow DC's main man by making the person most responsible for the save Aquaman.

In a sense, I cant blame Diana for wanting Steve on the sidelines. She loves him, and cant bear to see him hurt. Its pefectly understanable, and dozens of super-heroes have gone through the same ordeal, Spider-Man being a very good example.

The thing is, I am pretty sure over the years Lois has done her share of saving Clark. Whether in print, tv or on the big screen I can remember times when she has been the one who saved him from the Kryptonite, gave him a reason to keep going, or generally pulled his fat out of the fire. All without being super.

And of course Steve proved in Justice League #12 that fancy powers are sometimes no substitute for sheer guts.

[Addams]

Really happy that none of this stuff is in Azarello's comics.

[misslane38]

I think the thing people want to see here are two characters who can basically save each other. Johns was pretty clever to have Clark play the victim first because it immediately takes the sting out of the argument that Wonder Woman is playing second fiddle. He also deflect the charge that Diana is going to overshadow DC's main man by making the person most responsible for the save Aquaman.

I did not have a problem with Wonder Woman saving Superman. However, since Lois is often unfairly dismissed as a damsel-in-distress, I thought it was curious that Superman filling that role doesn't seem to be an issue.

In a sense, I cant blame Diana for wanting Steve on the sidelines. She loves him, and cant bear to see him hurt. Its pefectly understanable, and dozens of super-heroes have gone through the same ordeal, Spider-Man being a very good example.

It is understandable, which is why I have to wonder why Diana only applies this rule to Steve. Superman is vulnerable to magic; since most of Diana's villains are magical, then he's likely to be endangered by fighting side by side with her. Why, then, is Diana not itching to push Superman away from her to protect him from harm?

The thing is, I am pretty sure over the years Lois has done her share of saving Clark. Whether in print, tv or on the big screen I can remember times when she has been the one who saved him from the Kryptonite, gave him a reason to keep going, or generally pulled his fat out of the fire. All without being super.

And of course Steve proved in Justice League #12 that fancy powers are sometimes no substitute for sheer guts.

I love that Lois and Steve can be heroes and play a vital role in saving the day without powers. I was merely asking questions about what I perceived to be double standards.

[dupersuper]

It is understandable, which is why I have to wonder why Diana only applies this rule to Steve. Superman is vulnerable to magic; since most of Diana's villains are magical, then he's likely to be endangered by fighting side by side with her. Why, then, is Diana not itching to push Superman away from her to protect him from harm?

There's vulnerable and there's vulnerable. The tribe they were talking to flat out said what happened to Supes would kill a normal person.

[brettc1]

There's vulnerable and there's vulnerable. The tribe they were talking to flat out said what happened to Supes would kill a normal person.

It is however a possible source of conflict, which is a good thing.

Yes, a very good thing. If all they do is fall in love and live a happy life thats a great fairy tale ending but an absolutely suck plot. Maybe Diana WILL move to sideline Clark on the grounds he is in danger. Say fighting Captain Marvel, which seems on the cards.

I can see JL stories where Batman is having increasing difficulty getting these two to act 'professionally'.

[kylesgirl]

It is understandable, which is why I have to wonder why Diana only applies this rule to Steve. Superman is vulnerable to magic; since most of Diana's villains are magical, then he's likely to be endangered by fighting side by side with her. Why, then, is Diana not itching to push Superman away from her to protect him from harm?

Why should she push away a man who can go after Darkseid? Since when has magic ever made Superman cower or Diana judge him as incapable? He never avoided her as his best friend and hell even jumped in after her to help her magic or no magic in past canon. You must be not thinking who Clark and Diana are. This is really grasping now. Plus he's a sexy super man and he kisses nicer than Steve. The lasso at her hip attests to it.

[misslane38]

Why should she push away a man who can go after Darkseid? Since when has magic ever made Superman cower or Diana judge him as incapable? He never avoided her as his best friend and hell even jumped in after her to help her magic or no magic in past canon. You must be not thinking who Clark and Diana are. This is really grasping now. Plus he's a sexy super man and he kisses nicer than Steve. The lasso at her hip attests to it.

Once again, you seem to be missing the point. I'm saying exactly what you're saying: Diana shouldn't push people away from her just because getting involved in her world puts them in danger. In both Steve's and Superman's cases, a man in Diana's life was put in harm's way enough for him to get hurt but not enough to kill him. Yet, while Diana is overprotective of Steve, she does not seem at all concerned about Superman. I don't believe Diana should judge any man as incapable, in other words.