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  1. #31
    True Superior Spider-Man Kurolegacy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Plawsky View Post
    So why didn't you drop the book already? We've already seen Quicksilver and Sinister back to life under Spencer, which is a run you now praise highly.
    And we've even seen Madrox, having been a big part of Quicksilver's production of the telepathy blocking helmets.
    Holding out for a Peter/Miles team up.

  2. #32
    Ultimate Mod! Plawsky's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kurolegacy View Post
    And we've even seen Madrox, having been a big part of Quicksilver's production of the telepathy blocking helmets.
    Oops, that's what I actually meant to type instead of Quicksilver. He was already back in Ultimatum. Guess it's getting late.
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  3. #33
    Aspiring Spider-Man StepsOntheMoon's Avatar
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    I just think maybe the Marvel editorial team should check the Marvel wikia every now and then to avoid accidentally bringing people back to life.... thousands of dedicated fans tend to keep track of these things better than the editorial teams.

  4. #34
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    Quote Originally Posted by Plawsky View Post
    So why didn't you drop the book already? We've already seen Quicksilver and Sinister back to life under Spencer, which is a run you now praise highly.
    Sinister never died (can't die in a timeline that never existed (Kirkman retconned it, not Nick)) and neither did Quicksilver.

  5. #35
    Ultimate Mod! Plawsky's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by wyokid View Post
    Sinister never died (can't die in a timeline that never existed (Kirkman retconned it, not Nick)) and neither did Quicksilver.
    So you're making up an explanation that was never on page for Nick Spencer's mistake (or Bendis's, but I'd say UXM was his real return, not Mystery). Why not just do that for this mistake? Because it's never said anywhere that Sinister didn't die. It would make a lot more sense that Jean remade the world without him, really, so he couldn't do it all again. But whatever the case, it's not made clear exactly how he came back; he just did.

    As for Quicksilver, I already corrected myself - I meant to say Madrox. There were definitely Madrox dupes in UXM #7, and it definitely took place after Ultimatum. Yet Madrox is listed on the very same memoriam page as Psylocke. So what's different this time?

    Besides, Psylocke's death is one of the easiest to work around of anyone; she already "died" once before. Despite plenty of other continuity errors throughout the years, it seems odd that this would be the one to cause you to drop the book.
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  6. #36
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    You and I read Kirkman's run very differently.
    I still say that was pre-Ultimatum.
    You underestimate how much I hate this stuff happening. It shouldn't be this hard.
    Last edited by wyokid; 11-05-2012 at 11:42 PM.

  7. #37
    Senior Member Chaos_Alfa's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Plawsky View Post
    So you're making up an explanation that was never on page for Nick Spencer's mistake (or Bendis's, but I'd say UXM was his real return, not Mystery). Why not just do that for this mistake? Because it's never said anywhere that Sinister didn't die. It would make a lot more sense that Jean remade the world without him, really, so he couldn't do it all again. But whatever the case, it's not made clear exactly how he came back; he just did.

    As for Quicksilver, I already corrected myself - I meant to say Madrox. There were definitely Madrox dupes in UXM #7, and it definitely took place after Ultimatum. Yet Madrox is listed on the very same memoriam page as Psylocke. So what's different this time?

    Besides, Psylocke's death is one of the easiest to work around of anyone; she already "died" once before. Despite plenty of other continuity errors throughout the years, it seems odd that this would be the one to cause you to drop the book.
    Sinister could be more or less a concept which can manifest in people and that's why the current Sinister isn't the same as the first one.

    In this way Sinister first body is still dead.

  8. #38
    Ultimate Mod! Plawsky's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by wyokid View Post
    You and I read Kirkman's run very differently.
    If you can show me something that shows explicitly that his death was erased, then by all means. But a skim through #93 last night showed me nothing. And considering he was seen again in Ultimate Mystery as a teenager, that's definitely a rebirth. It might have been a mistake at the time by Bendis, but it happened nonetheless.

    I still say that was pre-Ultimatum.
    Only by a major jump in logic can that be possible. "We're making them right here in Wundagore"; "We'll have them for you in a week." The brotherhood wasn't active in Wundagore until the end of Ultimatum, and Ultimate X-Men takes place at least 8 months afterward (if you go by the time change in New Ultimates). I only read that one scene last night, so there may be even more to point out.

    For that scene to be before Ultimatum, Pietro would not only have to be operating his Brotherhood - or at least part of it - while Magneto was also trying to take down the world, because it would have had to be after Ultimates 3. He also would have had to get a large number of Madrox dupes to switch loyalty to him from Magneto; that's certainly possible, but it wouldn't likely be simple, considering there were hundreds - maybe thousands - of dupes willing to suicide bomb for Magneto, with only one rogue dupe shown. Plus, he was meeting with a business man, so he's obviously not entirely in the shadows. Not only would he have had to do all this while Magneto was planning Ultimatum, he would have had to do it without being noticed.

    Now, if you want it to be before Ultimatum in your own personal canon, that's fine. But that's completely bending the reality of what's happening in the book to fit your vision. And sometimes that's necessary. We've had to do that plenty of times in the Ultimate books - Dr. Doom, for instance. But it seems odd that you can just casually say "oh, that's pre-Ultimatum," but you can't just as easily say "oh, that's just Psylocke."

    You underestimate how much I hate this stuff happening. It shouldn't be this hard.
    I don't disagree. But it's also the nature of comic books. You've mentioned how you don't care about inaccuracies in the Hulk's speech, you've ignored continuity errors in Ultimate Spider-man, you've been fine with glaring character changes and retcons in Loeb's Ultimates. All of those things shouldn't be this hard.

    I agree that this stuff can be frustrating - but it's also Psylocke; this is kind of her thing.

    Quote Originally Posted by Chaos_Alfa View Post
    Sinister could be more or less a concept which can manifest in people and that's why the current Sinister isn't the same as the first one.

    In this way Sinister first body is still dead.
    Yeah, that's certainly possible; and I'd have no problem with it. But it doesn't change that it's all just fan theories to justify in our heads why things are out of sync. That's just a necessity in comic books sometimes.
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  9. #39
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    Give it a rest. The 'Dead Means Dead' rule is very important to a lot of Ultimate fans. Is it really that hard to understand that Wyokid might have a problem with Psylock coming back?

    There has been a lot of discussion on this board about whether certain characters should be allowed to be brought back or not. So if a character does return when previously thought to be dead, it's easy to understand why so many fans aren't going to like it.

    If Wyo wants to drop the book, that's fine. I've never actually known him to drop an Ultimate book actually. I don't necessarily agree with him, I'm happy to see Psylock again. But such an argument is so subjective, it can only come down to a difference in opinion.

    I understand how you may disagree with Wyokid's views on this topic, but you should also be able to see things from his perspective too. They said 'Dead Means Dead!' So if a character comes back seemingly from death, people are going to get a bit annoyed about it, regardless of how much you disagree.

    I'm happy for a couple dead characters coming back to life. But other fans not wanting that is perfectly understandable. I don't know what's with all the questions. This is easy for everyone to understand and so there's no need to get competitive, simply because a poster is unhappy with a character coming back.

    Plawsky, what is it you don't understand about Wyokid's comments?

  10. #40
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    I understand why people are mad but Wood said that it was an editorial mistake so whatever he has written about this new Psylocke would have automatically retcon the previous psylocke stories unless he changes a few things or completely renames the character which I think he will. But why drop a book over it? Wood said it wasn't his fault.

  11. #41
    Commander Dark Guard CaptainMarvell's Avatar
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    Cyclops, Magneto, Prof X and Scarlet Witch have all reappeared as well without any explanation too. Maybe her reappearance is for the same reason as them reappearing. Maybe she didn't really die. Maybe she's from another timeline. Its finally nice to see one X-character I care about show up in this book.

  12. #42
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    Also Wyokid why didn't you drop the book when Professor X or Magneto was shown? At that time we had no way of knowing it was Apocalypse so everyone would have thought it was a resurrection. And it could still be. Everyone is assuming they are illusions but there were Egyptian people hearing Magneto. Unless they are illusions too.

  13. #43
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    Quote Originally Posted by sage6paths View Post
    Also Wyokid why didn't you drop the book when Professor X or Magneto was shown? At that time we had no way of knowing it was Apocalypse so everyone would have thought it was a resurrection. And it could still be. Everyone is assuming they are illusions but there were Egyptian people hearing Magneto. Unless they are illusions too.
    Yeah, Mags, Scarlet Witch and Prof. X were just illusions. I think the Egyption people saw Magneto because they can be seen by anyone. I can't wait to see Apocalypse, but I'm also really happy that it's being drawn out so long. I think first we need to see more of Tian, see Quicksilver's new Brotherhood again (with Avalanche added to the team) and then go into the Apocalypse stuff. I can't thank both Brain Wood and Nick Spencer enough for how epic this series is. I love long, drawn out stories.

  14. #44
    Ultimate Mod! Plawsky's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by sage6paths View Post
    Also Wyokid why didn't you drop the book when Professor X or Magneto was shown? At that time we had no way of knowing it was Apocalypse so everyone would have thought it was a resurrection. And it could still be. Everyone is assuming they are illusions but there were Egyptian people hearing Magneto. Unless they are illusions too.
    Well, with Magneto, Scarlet Witch, Xavier, and Cyclops, I think it's pretty clear that there's something up with them, because they made a point of mentioning it. But Spencer did no such thing with Madrox.
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  15. #45
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    Quote Originally Posted by Plawsky View Post
    Well, with Magneto, Scarlet Witch, Xavier, and Cyclops, I think it's pretty clear that there's something up with them, because they made a point of mentioning it. But Spencer did no such thing with Madrox.
    Yah it was said there was something up but it never directly stated that they were illusions. Illusions usually don't disintagrate people when they get near them. Also I should mention that loeb was the one who ressurected the scarlet witch why is wyokid still reading loeb? Also she didn't look like an illusion considering the brotherhood was there to see her.

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