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  1. #91
    BUY LOKI: AGENT OF ASGARD Kieran_Frost's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Vibranium View Post
    depends on who is making the casting decisions....but (at the risk of being indelicate) white people have had the upper hand in Hollywood, both behind the camera and in front of it, since the start of the industry so making a white character another race is really not worth any sort of uproar
    but you know how white privelige is
    Quote Originally Posted by maskedavenger View Post
    Because of the range of available roles for black males (females) roles in movies...it is totally unbalanced. If there was even a remote balance of white actors and people of color in movies you would have a plausible argument. The fact that you can name the number of black actors in moves on one hand goes against your notion of double standard when the initial standard is not close to being equal.
    Now, if you have a problem with the methodology to balance the inequality then that's fine, but to scream "PC" is what racists do when they feel their white male privilege being threatened. I mean do you think Jamie Foxx honestly wanted to make and be apart of "booty call"?
    Quote Originally Posted by Free-Man View Post
    Not quite, no. The reason why the "Well would you be okay with a white guy playing Black Panther?!" argument falls flat is because there's still a massive gender and racial imbalance in Hollywood in general, but especially superhero movies. All of the Marvel heroes so far (with the exception of War Machine) have been white folk, so the implications behind race-switching a black superhero simply are not the same at all. There's already only a handfull of minority heroes who have a shot of appearing in the films period, so no, casting a black guy as Electro is not even remotely on the same level as deciding to make Black Panther or Luke Cage or Shang-Chi into white people.
    So you are all agreeing that their SHOULD be this double standard, based on the excess of roles for white actors? Am I right in saying that? Because of the imbalance, non-white actors should be allowed to play white character roles, BUT non-specific raced actors should not and cannot take any role that is not their race? (SEE: Zoe Saldana)

    Quote Originally Posted by Voss View Post
    As for Magneto, we both might have different interpretation of that character. My understanding of his origin comes from the outstanding graphic novel Magneto: Testament. Even if that book wasn't canon, we are past that. The X-Men movies were a success and most of the general population from this generation has the understanding that this character comes from Poland during the WW2 era. Moreso, even if no one knew that it's still an extremely important story for that character. He has seen discrimination all of his life, it's something that has shaped his ideals, that has followed him into his adult life that made him who he is today. Neglecting all of that goes against the spirit of his character.
    Quote Originally Posted by Vibranium View Post
    Magneto's culture/religion is not important? Storm's background in context to the 70's and new Xmen is not important? Should I even argue the obvious reasons why those two characters' backgrounds do matter.
    Magneto's loss stems from the family the Nazi's executed. The Nazis killed people in concentration camps for being gypsies, Jewish, gay, Russian, Catholic, disabled, etc... his ethnicity can be changed, and the stimulus (loss of loved ones in concentration camps) can still be maintained. How would his character change if his family was executed for being Catholics, rather than gypsies?

    Quote Originally Posted by Surtur View Post
    But about him wanting to make Booty Call..don't pretty much all actors at one point do stuff they don't want to do? Isn't that how you get ahead in the business to the point of getting roles you *do* want?
    Also isn't this boiling down to trying to make things equal by making them unequal? Maybe I'm misunderstanding.
    Pretty much... you CAN build a career doing fringe work, that is a great script or concept, but will have little "blockbuster" appeal. It takes a lot longer, but often garners more respect. Joseph Gordon-Levitt has A LOT of respect in Hollywood, for building his career on powerful performances, in low-budget movies. Doing the rom-coms, the mindless action movies is a great way to catapult to fame; but often not that stable a career path (SEE: Taylor Kitscher). This is how Meryl Streep became the most loved actress in Hollywood, despite never being in a film that broke $100 million until the 00's.

    Quote Originally Posted by J. Robb View Post
    You're assuming Jamie Foxx isn't the best choice.
    This argument only seems to come up when a minority gets a role. Even Michael Clarke Duncan, even though it was hard to imagine anyone else who could fill the Kingpin's giant suit.
    Quote Originally Posted by Free-Man View Post
    And again as J.Robb pointed out your argument assumes that Foxx wasn't chosen for his acting ability, but instead his race. I can't see how anyone would think making the villain black would be politically correct.
    I don't get where you are under the impression I don't think Jamie Foxx was cast on his acting ability??? My first post on this topic: LOVE Jamie Foxx; so I'm 100% on board. With modern CGI, Electro can finally be done right. I'm super excited!. I 100% believe he was cast PURELY on his great acting ability and the star power he will use, bringing in newer fans. I'm all for him playing Electro.

    My stance has always been: cast the best person for the job. And I fully believe Jamie Foxx is the best person for the job, and nobody can do Kingpin as well as Michael Clarke Duncan (even with a weak script, he was epic! -- SEE BELOW --)

    Quote Originally Posted by Voss View Post
    I hope you're right but I'm not expecting much. You can be the best actor in the world but if your director and script suck it doesn't matter. The best thing I can say about the Amazing Spider-Man is that it was watchable.
    I like to believe great actors can deliver (at the very least) decent work in a bad script. Judi Dench was still fun and I believed her character in Chronicles of Riddick (2004). Alec Guiness made the occasional AWFUL dialogue in Star Wars (1977) sound like poetry. Great actors should really never give "bad" performances, unless they have a) just given up trying and resting on your laurels (sadly... Anthony Hopkins falls into recently), or b) the director micro-managed them, and would not let-up until they delivered the dialogue or scene how the director wanted (even if it's an awful choice/idea).

    Quote Originally Posted by Voss View Post
    Hmm, not understanding you here. Peter Parker and Miles Morales are two different people. Miles is also a character created by Bendis that exist in the Ultimate universe. I thought we were talking about casting characters out of race.
    My wording of "what would be the point" is Miles Morales IS the black Spiderman. Making him white is pointless, just use Peter Parker.

    Quote Originally Posted by Voss View Post
    Interestingly enough, BKV is totally against casting any of the original Runaways outside of their race especially Nico and Alex. He made that group diverse for a reason, he purposefully used the ethnic name Minoru for that character and had her parents talk Japanese in various panels to emphasis the point. You may not agree with the logic, (and it's fine if you don't) but casting Nico outside of her race goes against the spirit of that character.
    What the original writer intends is not set in stone (SEE: Shatterstar), nor should it be. On no level does Nico Monroe NEED to be Asian. Her parents are evil magicians living in L.A. Race isn't a part of what makes her character tick.

    Quote Originally Posted by 7thangel View Post
    who said it's 'allowed'? the same amount of complaints when a minor or supporting cast character is changed from white to non-white.
    where are these assaults? let's differentiate between those that had problems with the Heimdall casting and those outright bigots who made it known they were bigots i.e. st*rmfront, and who people were calling out.
    When someone said "he can't play Heimdell, because he's not white" what was your response?
    Last edited by Kieran_Frost; 11-05-2012 at 01:26 AM.
    "I don't know how to please you Lord, but I think the fact I try to please you, pleases you."

  2. #92
    FRENCH Frank's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Surtur View Post
    But about him wanting to make Booty Call..don't pretty much all actors at one point do stuff they don't want to do? Isn't that how you get ahead in the business to the point of getting roles you *do* want?

    Also isn't this boiling down to trying to make things equal by making them unequal? Maybe I'm misunderstanding.
    You're saying he didn't want to do Booty Call? Have you seen his girlfriend in Booty Call? She was mighty fine! Eh Ho!
    Legato - Frank, Calm Down Your Nerd Rage!

  3. #93
    Napoleon of Crime Professor Moriarty's Avatar
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    i'm open to the idea of Jamie Foxx as Electro.

  4. #94
    Money Inc. TShark82's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Legato View Post
    Bwahahahaha!
    Scoff if you want,he is one of Spidermans first arch enemies,been standing since 1964.
    Tiger Shark:
    "That's what it is really about ! I *hate* heroes ! Everything I am today is because some idiot tried to be a hero... and wound up a cripple !

  5. #95
    Money Inc. TShark82's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Voss View Post
    -As far as casting characters outside of their race, I would ask the following two questions:
    How iconic is this character?
    This isn't as subjective as you may think. Some characters are extremely iconic and known to the general public. You know who these characters are: Superman, Batman, Lex Luthor, Wonder Woman, Storm, Wolverine, Blade (because of the movie) etc... In these cases I think it's fair to say that the characters race is apart of their look. I understand that the vast majority of comic book characters were made during a time period where being something other then white male wasn't considered heroic. But when we are talking about figures who are well known by the general public to have a certain look, you should stick with it. Going back on topic, someone like Electro doesn't fit into this category. Most people don't know or care who he is so casting out of race isn't a big deal. To further illustrate my point here are some other examples that I'd also consider fair game: Cannonball, Spider-Woman, Ant-Man, Wasp, Mockingbird, Dr. Nemesis, and Domino

    -Is this characters race integral to his/her history?
    That's why the question, "how would you like it if random white guy is Black Panther?" is so ignorant to me. Black Panthers race is important because it's vital to his origin story. The same would go for Colossus, Storm, Magneto, Miles Morales, Niko Minoru, etc. Some characters may be known primarily for their race. Falcon and Luke Cage are both examples of this as they were early pioneers of black super heroes. On the flip side, a character like Thunderball or Coldcast casted outside of race isn't really a big deal. Neither race nor background play an integral part of who the character is.
    You make some valid points,thats all I was really trying to say.
    Last edited by TShark82; 11-05-2012 at 08:50 AM.
    Tiger Shark:
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  6. #96
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    Quote Originally Posted by Free-Man View Post
    Not quite, no. The reason why the "Well would you be okay with a white guy playing Black Panther?!" argument falls flat is because there's still a massive gender and racial imbalance in Hollywood in general, but especially superhero movies. All of the Marvel heroes so far (with the exception of War Machine) have been white folk, so the implications behind race-switching a black superhero simply are not the same at all. There's already only a handfull of minority heroes who have a shot of appearing in the films period, so no, casting a black guy as Electro is not even remotely on the same level as deciding to make Black Panther or Luke Cage or Shang-Chi into white people.

    And again as J.Robb pointed out your argument assumes that Foxx wasn't chosen for his acting ability, but instead his race. I can't see how anyone would think making the villain black would be politically correct.
    This argument is unassailable. It's not even an argument. It's the truth.

  7. #97
    Elder Member thwhtGuardian's Avatar
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    Let's go ahead and remove "honey" and 'babe" from the list of acceptable ways to address one another shall we? Stopping hostile rhetoric while you're at that would also be much appreciated. And Insulting another poster's intelligence? Yeah, that's a no-no as well.

  8. #98
    Observer Vibranium's Avatar
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    can Electro be a spicy Latin woman?
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  9. #99
    Elder Member thwhtGuardian's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Vibranium View Post
    can Electro be a spicy Latin woman?
    Only if it's Sofia Vergara.

  10. #100
    Eastside! Nate Grey's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Vibranium View Post
    can Electro be a spicy Latin woman?
    Quote Originally Posted by thwhtGuardian View Post
    Only if it's Sofia Vergara.
    Never saw the first one, but I'd be sure to see this one if that happened.
    I have this idea for the next X-teme Games Gold Medal Event--Bear Tickling. Its like Bull riding but more X-treme! You are timed on how long you can tickle a bear before he attacks you.

    -Excelsior

  11. #101
    Elder Member thwhtGuardian's Avatar
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    Joking aside, I wouldn't have been opposed in the slightest if they had cast a woman(of any ethnicity) in the role of Electro. With characters of his caliber I don't see gender as an issue.

  12. #102
    Best In The World Legato's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by thwhtGuardian View Post
    Joking aside, I wouldn't have been opposed in the slightest if they had cast a woman(of any ethnicity) in the role of Electro. With characters of his caliber I don't see gender as an issue.
    You know since people are all about double standard and such when it comes to casting a character that was originally [insert race here] as [insert race here] then why not Hollywood gender reverse a comic character? They did it in Battlestar Galactica with the Starbuck character. Dizzy was turned into a woman for the film adaptation of Starship Troopers as the character in the novel version is a male. Hell the role of M in the Bond films was originally a guy. Although the same as race changing it depends on the character.
    "It isn't jumping the shark if you never come back down." Chuck

  13. #103
    Observer Vibranium's Avatar
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    and Judi Dench kicks ass as M...she's definitely memorable in the role, I don't remember even caring about M in the previous films
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  14. #104
    Money Inc. TShark82's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by thwhtGuardian View Post
    Joking aside, I wouldn't have been opposed in the slightest if they had cast a woman(of any ethnicity) in the role of Electro. With characters of his caliber I don't see gender as an issue.
    Are you kidding me, why stop there why not have a child actor play him while your at it.


    Quote Originally Posted by Legato View Post
    You know since people are all about double standard and such when it comes to casting a character that was originally [insert race here] as [insert race here] then why not Hollywood gender reverse a comic character? They did it in Battlestar Galactica with the Starbuck character. Dizzy was turned into a woman for the film adaptation of Starship Troopers as the character in the novel version is a male. Hell the role of M in the Bond films was originally a guy. Although the same as race changing it depends on the character.
    Where about keeping true to the character. I dont want white actors to play black characters either.
    Last edited by TShark82; 11-05-2012 at 04:12 PM.
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  15. #105
    Money Inc. TShark82's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DennyK View Post
    Jamie Foxx would be to Electro what Jim Carrey was to the Riddler.
    This is true
    Tiger Shark:
    "That's what it is really about ! I *hate* heroes ! Everything I am today is because some idiot tried to be a hero... and wound up a cripple !

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