DC fans why do you dislike Marvel comics?

**Lemurion** · 11-03-2012, 11:30 AM

Originally Posted by Kizmet

I switched to digital for the purpose of saving space in my apartment. With their print + digital, Marvel's trying to justify a higher price by offering a bonus that I consider a drawback. I don't buy any of DC's books for $3.99, it's more than I want to spend on a comic book, but I do buy JL and Action a month late for $2.99.

With DC there are more options, if I think a book is worth the higher tag to get it the day it comes out and not risk spoilers I can. If I want to wait a month and buy it more cheaply that's an option. If I want digital or print only that doesn't mean paying extra for something I'm not looking for.

I agree with you for the most part, and buy a lot more DC than Marvel. My point on the $3.99 Marvel print+digital books is that they don't trip my "rip-off alert" when I buy print, the way the $3.99 digital only Marvel books do. I much prefer DC's model, but if I really want a $3.99 Marvel book I'm buying it in print, not getting ripped off with pure digital.

Originally Posted by SteveGus

I don't terribly mind the higher cost of following Marvel books right now. Part of the nu52 fallout is that I am much less tolerant of books whose story, tone, or art I am not enjoying. Dropping pretty much all of DC cut my monthly pulls by at least half. The fact that Marvel books are a buck more and some of them double ship does not faze me, especially since there aren't that many titles I follow there either.

I agree with you on the tolerance factor, where we differ is in what books we're enjoying. For me, the New 52 is providing more books I enjoy than Marvel, and with a few exceptions I enjoy most DC books more than the Marvel books I like. Fraction's Hawkeye is brilliant, but it's also a $2.99 book that doesn't double ship.

In your case, I would argue that you are getting your "CBG(tm)" from Marvel, so it's worth it to you. For me, the problem is that so many Marvel books, especially the $3.99 ones, are on the cusp, and paying a dollar more per issue for twice as many issues a month is guaranteed to turn "that looks interesting, maybe I should try it out," into "Nope."

**theDarkestKnight** · 11-03-2012, 02:10 PM

The only thing I dislike about Marvel is their 3.99 pricing for most of their books. At least when DC makes their books 3.99 they add extra content to them.

**LEADER DESSLOK** · 11-04-2012, 01:46 AM

Originally Posted by theDarkestKnight

The only thing I dislike about Marvel is their 3.99 pricing for most of their books. At least when DC makes their books 3.99 they add extra content to them.

Thank you for saying the obvious. No matter how Marvel fans try to spin it--Four dollars for LESS pages is still paying more for less no matter what the "content" on the page. Compared to the old EC Comics or even older MARVEL comics from the 80s there was considerably more "content" back then than what we're getting from the House of Ideas these days. Many of today's writers don't use captions and generally, you can read a modern AMZSM in half the time you would take to read a "chapter" (issue) within, let's say ESSENTIAL SPIDER-MAN Vols. 1-6.

**stk** · 11-04-2012, 01:58 AM

Originally Posted by LEADER DESSLOK

Thank you for saying the obvious. No matter how Marvel fans try to spin it--Four dollars for LESS pages is still paying more for less no matter what the "content" on the page. Compared to the old EC Comics or even older MARVEL comics from the 80s there was considerably more "content" back then than what we're getting from the House of Ideas these days. Many of today's writers don't use captions and generally, you can read a modern AMZSM in half the time you would take to read a "chapter" (issue) within, let's say ESSENTIAL SPIDER-MAN Vols. 1-6.

Yeah, and my feeling is, as we enter the digital age, that if I can read a comic in 4 minutes, I shouldn't be paying more for it than a song from iTunes or something. 4 minutes of entertainment is 4 minutes of entertainment. And does it cost as much to produce one issue of a comic book as it does to write, perform, engineer, produce a single track on an album? There is no way it does. So Marvel's pricing when it comes to digital is completely out of whack.

**sunofdarkchild** · 11-04-2012, 01:12 AM

Originally Posted by stk

Yeah, and my feeling is, as we enter the digital age, that if I can read a comic in 4 minutes, I shouldn't be paying more for it than a song from iTunes or something. 4 minutes of entertainment is 4 minutes of entertainment. And does it cost as much to produce one issue of a comic book as it does to write, perform, engineer, produce a single track on an album? There is no way it does. So Marvel's pricing when it comes to digital is completely out of whack.

How many sales does a typical song normally make? Comics selling 50,000 copies a month are not bringing in very much money no matter how much they cost.

**tony ingram** · 11-04-2012, 01:34 AM

Originally Posted by stk

Yeah, and my feeling is, as we enter the digital age, that if I can read a comic in 4 minutes, I shouldn't be paying more for it than a song from iTunes or something. 4 minutes of entertainment is 4 minutes of entertainment. And does it cost as much to produce one issue of a comic book as it does to write, perform, engineer, produce a single track on an album? There is no way it does. So Marvel's pricing when it comes to digital is completely out of whack.

That is a very simplistic view comparing two totally different methods of production. Whether the comic is being bought digitally or as a paper copy, the actual production process is the same and the creators have to be paid for their work at the same rate, for a start.

**stk** · 11-04-2012, 02:16 AM

Originally Posted by tony ingram

That is a very simplistic view comparing two totally different methods of production. Whether the comic is being bought digitally or as a paper copy, the actual production process is the same and the creators have to be paid for their work at the same rate, for a start.

You think the people creating songs, whether behind the mic or the soundboard, or the producers and record company execs and stuff aren't getting paid?

**sunofdarkchild** · 11-04-2012, 02:19 AM

Originally Posted by stk

You think the people creating songs, whether behind the mic or the soundboard, or the producers and record company execs and stuff aren't getting paid?

I think they're getting paid a ton more than the average comic writer/inker/penciller. But I also think they can afford to sell their product for much cheaper because their product sells many times what even a 'good' selling comic sells.

**stk** · 11-04-2012, 02:23 AM

Originally Posted by sunofdarkchild

I think they're getting paid a ton more than the average comic writer/inker/penciller. But I also think they can afford to sell their product for much cheaper because their product sells many times what even a 'good' selling comic sells.

Yeah, but part of that is a distribution problem that is going to be eased a bit as we shift more into digital.

We need to stop simply accepting, "Well, songs sell more units than comics," and start spending more energy figuring out why that is, while thinking outside the box as to how that can be addressed. If the business model or format needs to change, so be it.

**tony ingram** · 11-04-2012, 02:26 AM

Originally Posted by stk

Yeah, but part of that is a distribution problem that is going to be eased a bit as we shift more into digital.

Which isn't going to happen anytime soon, thankfully. Digital comics sell only a fraction of what paper copies sell. And if they ever went digital only, many readers would give up on the hobby.

We need to stop simply accepting, "Well, songs sell more units than comics," and start spending more energy figuring out why that is, while thinking outside the box as to how that can be addressed. If the business model or format needs to change, so be it.

It's because comics are more of a niche interest. Simple.

**DrFever** · 11-04-2012, 02:39 AM

I came back at New 52, I've picked up a couple of Image titles, I was going to do the Valiant Relaunch, and I decided it was only fair to give Marvel a shot now that I was back to monthly books.

Avengers v. X-Men

After it ended, so did my Marvel comics buying.

Overall I liked the story. I didn't mind the 4 issue build up to the 13 Part Series. But then there was all the tie in each month at 3.99 a pop, the weekly epilogue, the launch of Marvel NOW.....

Marvel NOW itself didn't bother me. But I was confused as to what I was to try and read. Did I just start with #1 or was the stuff that was still going on in other titles still a factor as the #1s started hitting the shelf? 3.99 still? 2 books a month? 2 X-Forces? What books are in what group? Where the hell does Spider-Man fit into all of this? It wasn't one click info I could find online.

Yes, I'm lazy. I don't want to spend time online trying to dig around to find info about comics. I want it right in my face with - here is what it is, what it cost, who's making it, where it fits in, etc.

I know some people like the slower roll out of Marvel NOW but I loved the mega New 52 launch.

If DC would have rolled it's stuff out over months I wouldn't have tried one single book more then what I tried at the start in Sept 2011.

One thing I did know....was how many different covers and who was making them for Uncanny Avengers #1. That info couldn't be missed.

EVEN WITH ALL OF THAT.....I said to myself, "self get over the little stuff that's added up and just read a damn comic, you like AVX, comic comes out you can read it. All will be good."

Uncanny Avengers #2 Delayed A Couple Of Weeks

Bail. This is going to be more headache then fun. I'm out.

**tony ingram** · 11-04-2012, 02:44 AM

Not exactly a fan of delayed gratification, DrFever?

**vampiric_cannibal** · 11-04-2012, 03:30 AM

Well, DrFever's problem was that he was that he didn't just look at the cover and creative team and decide whether that book was worth getting. You can work out exactly what you need to find out, then find it out later. NOW! isn't replacing most of the higher quality series, other than Uncanny X-Men and Force. Both of which are being replaced. Hawkeye, X-Factor, Daredevil, Ultimate X-Men and Spiderman are still continuing, all of whom on the same numbering.

I don't think the slow roll out of titles is particularly effective, but analysing each teaser as it comes allows greater breadth of discussion. And constant reworking of planned pull lists. Followed by releases, followed by re-reworkings. Just as something is about to come out, something better is on the horizon. ANXM looks OK, and WatXM looks decent, but why get those when each of the X-Forces are coming out in a couple of months and look fantastic? Uncanny Avengers looks good, but an equally talented creative team is on Avengers, with fewer X-traitors, but then Young Avengers looks like it will be even better and Avengers Arena looks like distilled trauma that might make a whole bunch of characters more interesting or more dead. Thus far I have not bought a Marvel NOW! book because I think another series yet to appear looks like a surer bet.