B.P.R.D. Hell on Earth: The Abyss of Time

[thwhtGuardian]

Yeah, I don't see the connection yet either, but still an awesome issue.

I really loved those cavemen characters and the Tor vibe was even greater in this issue with that last panel of the guy on the woolly mammoth feeling almost like a homage of Kubert's work.

[Middenway]

This story just left me hungry for more. I loved it. I think it'll read even better in the trade with no chapter break. Yeah, I definitely want more prehistoric stories.

[dreadcthulhu]

Man, I really could not get into this one. I wanted to but I just couldn't drum up the enthusiasm.

I think the central problem I had was, like 'Pickens', 'The Devil's Engine' and 'JH O'Donnell' pretty much nothing happened. It had a potentially interesting setup but then a total non-conclusion (a problem that pops up in BPRD on occassion unfortunately). Yes, we learned a bit more about the Witchfinder sword but that was never a pressing concern narratively speaking. We never got a sense of who these redshirts were, or what the Cold people are (does it mattter?) or if that thing at the end was an Ogdru Hem (and how did it 'die' exactly? The evil shaman dude died, true, but it didn't seem he had anything to do with it).

James Harren is very good at fight scenes and here is no different, but unlike the 'Long Death' I did not have any investment in what was going on so it ended up a total page flipper. The series needs more answers not questions - especially when the answers we get are questions nobody is asking.

Sorry to be a downer!

EDIT: I agree with the above though - the last panel was great.

[didism]

I Guess and Hope <Wasteland> will give us more answers for the questions.

But after reading this issue, I felt they'd better to make TPB by using <Exorcism + Pickens + Transformation of J.H.- > aside <The Return of The Master>,
and later, <The Abyss of Time + Wasteland>.

I know <The Abyss-> is the event before <The Return of The master>, But...

[Middenway]

A Cold Day in Hell will be coupled with Wasteland, both directly dealing with the fallout from The Return of the Master before the next big arc. I'm sure Exorcism will find it's home eventually, probably with other Cameron Stewart stories.

[Middenway]

We never got a sense of who these redshirts were, or what the Cold people are (does it mattter?)

Maybe you missed it, but the Cold People are most likely the earliest vampires. I think you'll find The Abyss of Time will be one of those stories that has set up a lot of important things that will be playing out for years in the series. We've always known Hecate has had a strong association with vampires since she first appeared in Wake the Devil. She may be the Witch Queen, but in 1947 the vampires also referred to her as "The Source", and here in The Abyss of Time we learn that the Cold People worship "Heccata" sister of the Ogdru Jahad. I wonder how much she had to do with their creation.

...or if that thing at the end was an Ogdru Hem (and how did it 'die' exactly? The evil shaman dude died, true, but it didn't seem he had anything to do with it).

It was an old god, which is an Ogdru Hem. It was creeping into the world similar to the way we've seen in Born Again and New World. That it was still made up of mist means it hadn't fully regained its physical body, so it had to be drawing from something as we've seen in previous stories. Obviously that thing was the Shaman that had summoned it, so when he died, it could no longer hold itself together and dissipated.

I think the central problem I had was, like 'Pickens', 'The Devil's Engine' and 'JH O'Donnell' pretty much nothing happened. It had a potentially interesting setup but then a total non-conclusion (a problem that pops up in BPRD on occassion unfortunately).

I didn't go in with the same expectations, I think. This story was all set-up. It doesn't have a conclusion because it's only an introduction. We got introduced to Gall Dennar and his world, we learned what troubles he and his people face and we saw them fight it. It's all classic first act structure. Even the stuff in the present is just a beginning. And we already know there is a lot more coming. Everything about the way this issue was structured said, "to be continued". Think of it as a pilot to a TV series. It's just to give you a taste of this world and introduce the conflict, not resolve it.

The plot and exposition did overwhelm the characters though. Most of the character work for Gall Dennar was in the first issue, with very little of it in this issue. I would have liked to get to know them a little better. I hope Karr survived.

The series needs more answers not questions - especially when the answers we get are questions nobody is asking.

I felt totally the opposite. This two-issue arc answered some questions I'd been wondering about for a long time. And the questions it did ask, such as the stuff about Sir Edward Grey and the Heliopic Brotherhood of Ra are questions I've wanted raised. I really hope the next Witchfinder is on its way and soon.

I had so much fun with this one, I really did. I've been wondering about the Hyperborean Era for a long time, and been hoping they'd do a story set in this time period since the first Witchfinder miniseries came out. And Wasteland will be picking up on the present day plot threads of this story in only three months time. The prehistory part though might be a longer wait (not too long, I hope!)

[cantide]

Great answers from Middenway as always!

This story has ties to a hell of a lot going on in BPRD right now. The plot thread of the vampires runs through 1947 and 1948 (and will obviously be continued soon in Vampire), not to mention all the talk of the Vampire Apocalypse from the researcher in Pickens County Horror. We're starting to learn where they came from, and maybe that will soon feed into where they are and where they're going.

Then the Hyperborean weapon--the same one that passed through Edward Grey's hands, and briefly Memnan Saa's, and soon after entered the hands of the Heliopic Brotherhood of Ra over the course of In the Service of Angels. Now we know where it came from, and perhaps what the source of its power is. It seems to be capable of harnessing Vril energy, much the same way as that odd artifact Roger found in Born Again, or the suit seen in Iron Prometheus that might be making a return in Sledgehammer '44--and same as the weapon wielded by the King of Fear in Hollow Earth when he tried to take the Vril energy out of Liz.

I've been wondering about the Hyperborean Era for a long time, and been hoping they'd do a story set in this time period since the first Witchfinder miniseries came out. And Wasteland will be picking up on the present day plot threads of this story in only three months time. The prehistory part though might be a longer wait (not too long, I hope!)

To be fair, this isn't really the Hyperborean Era--this is long after the fall of Hyperborea, set in the time of the earliest humans, which I guess are the 'second' race of mankind. So this is more in the time of the shaman guy Liz has been in communication with.

Although we've heard a lot about the fall of Hyperborea at Heca Emen Ra/Hecate's hands, I do hope we get a story actually set in that time someday, and maybe something that will better explain the whole 'right hand'/'left hand'/slave revolt/little red dude thing. I've never quite understood how or when or where that actually took place, but I haven't gone back to reread in a long time. Maybe they're actually the descendants of the original Hyperboreans or something? Can't recall.

Anyway--I wasn't feeling this arc at first, but now that I've taken the time to notice the threads, I'm really excited to see what's going to come of them. I've been won over completely by the pre-historic era and I want more of it. Soon!

[cantide]

Also, I'm curious to see what that new project mentioned at the beginning of the letter column will be! As I recall, the majority of people's complaints about the 'direction of the book'--complaints that I don't really share--centered on the fact that the story was moving further from its core cast of non-humans to one of average people. Maybe that's what that's about...

I don't want to think about it too much, though, if I figure it out for myself that would spoil the surprise!

And do we know when/if Tyler Crook is going to be back for another arc? When Davis left, he was kind of introduced to us as his successor, but it's obvious that there is no single artist for the main storyline of BPRD anymore. And I don't think I've seen him on any of the upcoming solicits. I hope we get to see more of his art soon!

That said, everyone on this book right now is absolutely amazing. Couldn't ask for a better set of artists for these stories.

[Middenway]

To be fair, this isn't really the Hyperborean Era--this is long after the fall of Hyperborea, set in the time of the earliest humans, which I guess are the 'second' race of mankind. So this is more in the time of the shaman guy Liz has been in communication with.

Yeah, I fudged the details for the sake of simplicity. I meant Shonchin's era though.

You mention the Vril energy and I think that's key to all of this. Mignola seems to be shining a light on different Vril weapons throughout the ages. These are the only things truly effective against the Ogdru Hem.

And do we know when/if Tyler Crook is going to be back for another arc? When Davis left, he was kind of introduced to us as his successor, but it's obvious that there is no single artist for the main storyline of BPRD anymore. And I don't think I've seen him on any of the upcoming solicits. I hope we get to see more of his art soon!

Not until after Wasteland at the very least. He had to move house and according to Scott Allie he is currently waaaaaaay ahead of schedule. Which is cool.

[Kees_L]

Great answers from Middenway as always!

This is true,
great answers or questions and enjoyment among everything both as everyone else, as how that'd count,

as how such would be the same from earlier combo's on this forum such as Maija / Petriacce / Neil Hill / Gary Bolt / Kelly Tindall ao,
or more previously Nick W / Spydaweb / Tad Stones / JNapper / Hellboyone etc.,
both as combo's off-board whom we might not even feel aware of.

Or either just the "originals" themselves also.
Like all these books and stories and drawings get enjoyed so heavily for as long as they'll have come about,
as even the makers or collaborators both as their households will likely be remaining full of the mythos .

Like somewhere this minute a fullgrown respected professional plus their partner while doing the dishes or moving laundry or the trash will be appropriately both as affectionately discussing some insight on the Ogdru Hem or be it Vril .

It seems to get only the more cool and telling how for instance Scott Allie or others speak more and more directly about the titles or what they'd mean to them.

[dreadcthulhu]

The plot and exposition did overwhelm the characters though. Most of the character work for Gall Dennar was in the first issue, with very little of it in this issue. I would have liked to get to know them a little better

This is one of the reasons I just could not enjoy these comics as single issue reading experiences. Your points are excellently made and while I agree with most of them I still can't get behind 'Abyss of Time'. BPRD has far too much 'setup' as it is and I don't think it needed anymore.

Still, a good defence middenway!

[thwhtGuardian]

It seemed more about world building than characterization to me and that's a valid reason for a story, especially when the world is so darn awesome.

[Artie Ness]

Great answers from Middenway as always!

Made me enjoy the books much more in retrospective (though I had already been thrilled by the art).

[Libaax]

It seemed more about world building than characterization to me and that's a valid reason for a story, especially when the world is so darn awesome.

I actually enjoyed Abyss of Time part one more than the ending chapter of Return of Master which felt too chaotic, messy for me. I enjoyed the world building, the time travel and the cool art. I read BPRD for world,story and not for epic happening only.

I have just catched up to latest BRPD issue by reading Return of Master part 2-5 and this.

[Middenway]

A piece by James Harren.