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  1. #706
    Share the Love! Starfish's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by AntiPatriot View Post
    'Double standart' doesn't even begin to cover it.
    The Scarlet Bitch was manipulated by a mere man, Cyclops was controlled by an entity mightier than freakin' Galactus.
    The Scarlet Bitch nearly erased a whole species and killed many, many people in the process, Cyclops killed one man exactly, in self-defense, and sought to bring the world peace, free water and food, plus he helped to re-create the mutants.

    The Avengers are, plain and simple, a bunch of self-righteous hypocrites.
    Curious. AvX #12 painted a little different picture, with Cyclops destroying several cities as he attempted to end the world and create his own. Also, he contributed nothing to the repowering of mutants. That was entirely Hope and Wanda's doing, and to achieve that goal they first had to go through Cyclops and take the PF by force.

  2. #707
    Senior Member AntiPatriot's Avatar
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    So what?
    The Avengers destroy buildings 24/7 and nobody ever complains.
    Buildings destroy !=! Casualties in comic books
    http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.ph...EndorHolocaust or
    http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.ph...yEmptyBuilding
    As long as there is no mention or concrete pictures (like f.E. when Namor attacked Wakanda) there is no proof he killed anyone.

    And off course he contributed something. He was the one who was right the entire time about the PF recreating mutants.
    If it would have gone like the Avengers (to whom Wanda belongs) wanted it, the PF would have been destroyed in space.
    Last edited by AntiPatriot; 11-20-2012 at 04:38 AM.

  3. #708
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    Quote Originally Posted by AntiPatriot View Post
    So what?
    The Avengers destroy buildings 24/7 and nobody ever complains.
    Buildings destroy !=! Casualties in comic books
    http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.ph...EndorHolocaust or
    http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.ph...yEmptyBuilding
    As long as there is no mention or concrete pictures (like f.E. when Namor attacked Wakanda) there is no proof he killed anyone.

    And off course he contributed something. He was the one who was right the entire time about the PF recreating mutants.
    If it would have gone like the Avengers (to whom Wanda belongs) wanted it, the PF would have been destroyed in space.
    So, you're going to show images of the Avengers ACTUALLY destroying buildings in their battles rather than just cite the TV Tropes pages which DESCRIBE that trope, right? And also show that the X-Men never, ever, EVER did the EXACT same thing during THEIR battles, right?

    And- at the end of the day- Cyclops did nothing with the Phoenix power to restore mutants. That'd be the Scarlet Witch and Hope. So, pretty much FAIL all around once again.

  4. #709
    Senior Member AntiPatriot's Avatar
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    1. I never said the X-Men never did it.

    2. I didn't want to show examples with those links, I wanted to explain further by linking the tropes.
    In short = Destroyed Buildings do NOT equal death in Comic Books.

    3. Read better. What I wrote was
    plus he helped to re-create the mutants.
    Bottom Line is just, Wanda did FAR more damage in her career than Cyclops ever could.
    But she is always excused with the same nonsense all over again, while Cyclops is the bogeyman for things he didn't even willingly do.
    That's what I mean when I say the Avengers are a bunch of Hypocrites.

  5. #710
    Few days on drugs? Lovely pepper's Avatar
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    This thread is still going on?! AvX is over people!

    Quote Originally Posted by AntiPatriot View Post
    So what?
    The Avengers destroy buildings 24/7 and nobody ever complains.
    Buildings destroy !=! Casualties in comic books
    http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.ph...EndorHolocaust or
    http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.ph...yEmptyBuilding
    As long as there is no mention or concrete pictures (like f.E. when Namor attacked Wakanda) there is no proof he killed anyone.
    Cyclops destroying buildings in AvX #12 is not a trope because he was doing it purposely. Even if no one was killed or injured, people have to clean up after the mess. People don't complain when the Avengers destroy buildings because a threat to the people is taken care of, lives are saved.

    Quote Originally Posted by AntiPatriot View Post
    The Avengers are, plain and simple, a bunch of self-righteous hypocrites.
    Everybody, real or fictional, is hypocritical. It's only human. However, this isn't quality isn't purposely stressed by the writers. It's not what you're supposed to focus on.

    For the Wanda-Cyclops situation, put yourself in Cap's shoes. He knows Wanda a lot better than Cyclops. He trusts Wanda and knows that she isn't evil. He cannot say the same for Cyclops. Also, it wasn't just Cap's decision to lock up Cyclops (Consequences #3).

    Oh, and don't you dare call DOOM a mere man!

  6. #711

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    Quote Originally Posted by JaggedFel View Post
    Winners decide who gets punished not the losers.
    I think there's a strong element of truth to this
    ...but.... did Scott not also make horrible crimes?

  7. #712
    Elder Member XPac's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by AntiPatriot View Post
    1. I never said the X-Men never did it.

    2. I didn't want to show examples with those links, I wanted to explain further by linking the tropes.
    In short = Destroyed Buildings do NOT equal death in Comic Books.

    3. Read better. What I wrote was


    Bottom Line is just, Wanda did FAR more damage in her career than Cyclops ever could.
    But she is always excused with the same nonsense all over again, while Cyclops is the bogeyman for things he didn't even willingly do.
    That's what I mean when I say the Avengers are a bunch of Hypocrites.
    Wanda got excused a few years after her actions, and Cyclops will do.

    There's no real preferencial treatment going on... all heroes basically go through the same thing when this sort of thing happens. Happened with Wanda. Happened with Hal Jordan. Currently happening with Scott. Give it a few years and Scott will basically get his free pass just like Wanda and Hal Jordan and every other hero who has been in a comparable situation.

    Hell, in some ways Scott lucked out. Wanda and Hal were taken off the board for years.

  8. #713
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    Quote Originally Posted by AntiPatriot View Post
    'Double standart' doesn't even begin to cover it.
    The Scarlet Bitch was manipulated by a mere man, Cyclops was controlled by an entity mightier than freakin' Galactus.
    The Scarlet Bitch nearly erased a whole species and killed many, many people in the process, Cyclops killed one man exactly, in self-defense, and sought to bring the world peace, free water and food, plus he helped to re-create the mutants.

    The Avengers are, plain and simple, a bunch of self-righteous hypocrites.
    Double stand art? I wouldn't even put that art on one stand! Ohohoho!

  9. #714
    Elder Member mikekerrIII's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by XPac View Post
    Wanda got excused a few years after her actions, and Cyclops will do.
    I think that a majority or at least a large plurality of his fans think he doesn't need to be excused for his actions,
    Pain shared is divided, joy shared is multiplied

  10. #715

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    Quote Originally Posted by AntiPatriot View Post
    'Double standart' doesn't even begin to cover it.
    The Scarlet Bitch was manipulated by a mere man, Cyclops was controlled by an entity mightier than freakin' Galactus.
    The Scarlet Bitch nearly erased a whole species and killed many, many people in the process, Cyclops killed one man exactly, in self-defense, and sought to bring the world peace, free water and food, plus he helped to re-create the mutants.

    The Avengers are, plain and simple, a bunch of self-righteous hypocrites.
    Thank you for writting down my thoughts in such an accurate way. That is exactly what I think.

  11. #716
    Elder Member XPac's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by mikekerrIII View Post
    I think that a majority or at least a large plurality of his fans think he doesn't need to be excused for his actions,
    And that's often the case for situation like this. Stark went through the same thing after Civil War, where some people felt he did nothing wrong while others wanted his head mounted on a pole.

    Regardless, it'll probably play out the same way. They'll run with the story for a few years, then Scott will have his "what have I done moment," apologize, admit he was wrong, and rejoin the rest of his teammates like nothing happened. Not unlike Stark, or Hal Jordan. Wanda is in the middle of that right now.

    For those that feel Scott deserves a pass, he'll get it... eventually. And for those that feel he was in the wrong, they'll get what they want too. It pretty much always works out that way in the end.

  12. #717
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    Quote Originally Posted by mikekerrIII View Post
    I think that a majority or at least a large plurality of his fans think he doesn't need to be excused for his actions,
    Don't fret, Cyclops will never get killed off or put in limbo and will always hang around the X-Books in some capacity. There's a good reason for this - he's probably the easiest Marvel character to draw ever. As long as artists are lazy, and deadlines need to be met, there will always be demand for characters with simple designs that can be quickly shoved into as many panels as possible. And nobody can stand there and take up space quite like Ol' Cyke.

  13. #718
    Elder Member mikekerrIII's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by XPac View Post
    And that's often the case for situation like this. Stark went through the same thing after Civil War, where some people felt he did nothing wrong while others wanted his head mounted on a pole.

    Regardless, it'll probably play out the same way. They'll run with the story for a few years, then Scott will have his "what have I done moment," apologize, admit he was wrong, and rejoin the rest of his teammates like nothing happened. Not unlike Stark, or Hal Jordan. Wanda is in the middle of that right now.

    For those that feel Scott deserves a pass, he'll get it... eventually. And for those that feel he was in the wrong, they'll get what they want too. It pretty much always works out that way in the end.
    Stark has said he would do it again, no apologizes to anyone but Thor and Cap

    I dount they will have him have a what have I done moment and regret his victory, He wonand his race still exists despite the efforts of some dim-witted Heroes to prevent that
    Pain shared is divided, joy shared is multiplied

  14. #719
    Elder Member XPac's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by mikekerrIII View Post
    Stark has said he would do it again, no apologizes to anyone but Thor and Cap

    I dount they will have him have a what have I done moment and regret his victory, He wonand his race still exists despite the efforts of some dim-witted Heroes to prevent that
    I think Scott already has regrets. He said to Eva in All New X-Men 1: "The thing is, Eva. I have much.. so much to atone for."

    So on some level he already knows. He just hasn't owned it yet, or really admitted it to the rest of his peers. Give Bendis a few years to run with the current status quo, and Scott will get there. Then he can rejoin his X buddies at the Jean Grey school and things will be relatively back to normal.

  15. #720
    Elder Member celticguy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by XPac View Post
    I think Scott already has regrets. He said to Eva in All New X-Men 1: "The thing is, Eva. I have much.. so much to atone for."

    So on some level he already knows. He just hasn't owned it yet, or really admitted it to the rest of his peers. Give Bendis a few years to run with the current status quo, and Scott will get there. Then he can rejoin his X buddies at the Jean Grey school and things will be relatively back to normal.
    yeah he was pretty happy except for his murder of Prof X he seemed top be ok with everything else than happened. Now he is building another army, to accomplish what who knows. He has added to the hatred of mutants and helped set the Red Skulls plan in motion or at least set the stage for it to be effective.

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