Downtown Khazan: Siriel's Temporary Edition

[Omegalith]

Speaking of Exalted, is there much difference between First and Second Edition storywise, or was it mainly a rules overhaul?

There's a few differences: For one thing, in first edition they played up the "EVERYTHING IS DOOMED!" angle more, implying that for all their power the Exalts would never be able to stop the world from spiraling into destruction forever. They also heavily implied that Creation would, after the apocalypse to come, be restructured into the Old World of Darkness that Vampire the Masquerade and it's sister games were set in. (There's even an obscure pair of cosmic entities in the OWoD who are very obviously the Scarlet Empress and the Ebon Dragon) This angle was quickly dropped for 2E.

2nd Edition swaps a few things up: Now the focus is on the PC's making a difference, with a bit of a Gurren Lagannish "Do the impossible, Fight the power" theme to everything. The Yozi's are fleshed out more (Though they kinda screwed up by making them too malevolent in a setting where the general vibe of each faction tends to be mostly strong-willed jerks with a few outnumbered and outvoted decent guys), it really sucks to be an Abyssal now, Alchemicals have had a complete overhaul and Infernals are new.

As for Keychain of Creation: I prefer it to the actual setting. Keeps most of the cool stuff, but is more lighthearted, not so grimdark. When you've finished it, you can find the same author's currently running Exalted story Lunar Quest here.

Basically it's about an Amnesiac Lunar called Saulanna Rockblossom who's had a fragment of a Primordial experimentally grafted to her soul, and it's set after the Ebon Dragon has successfully escaped his prison and conquered the world.

[Sharkerbob]

There's a few differences: For one thing, in first edition they played up the "EVERYTHING IS DOOMED!" angle more, implying that for all their power the Exalts would never be able to stop the world from spiraling into destruction forever. They also heavily implied that Creation would, after the apocalypse to come, be restructured into the Old World of Darkness that Vampire the Masquerade and it's sister games were set in. (There's even an obscure pair of cosmic entities in the OWoD who are very obviously the Scarlet Empress and the Ebon Dragon) This angle was quickly dropped for 2E.

2nd Edition swaps a few things up: Now the focus is on the PC's making a difference, with a bit of a Gurren Lagannish "Do the impossible, Fight the power" theme to everything. The Yozi's are fleshed out more (Though they kinda screwed up by making them too malevolent in a setting where the general vibe of each faction tends to be mostly strong-willed jerks with a few outnumbered and outvoted decent guys), it really sucks to be an Abyssal now, Alchemicals have had a complete overhaul and Infernals are new.

Huh. Yeah, I recall mention of the connection between Creation-1 and oWoD, but it always seemed kind of off to me. Unless maybe you went with the "reality determined by mass belief" from old Mage, the two realities seem too fundamentally different in structure.

As for Keychain of Creation: I prefer it to the actual setting. Keeps most of the cool stuff, but is more lighthearted, not so grimdark. When you've finished it, you can find the same author's currently running Exalted story Lunar Quest here.

Basically it's about an Amnesiac Lunar called Saulanna Rockblossom who's had a fragment of a Primordial experimentally grafted to her soul, and it's set after the Ebon Dragon has successfully escaped his prison and conquered the world.

Neat. About two-thirds done with the comic, will check out this other thing. Yeah, KoC seems to balance drama, humor, and meta pretty well.

Makes me want to go back and pick up that world-building project I keep trying to start again. I have a bunch of these planets I made up, but haven't fleshed out, am wondering if it would be smarter to just knock them all down into smaller continents and staple them onto a single planet. I rather dislike the whole "Planet of Hats" trope as it is, and if its a big enough planet, there's a lot one could cram in there.

[Omegalith]

Makes me want to go back and pick up that world-building project I keep trying to start again. I have a bunch of these planets I made up, but haven't fleshed out, am wondering if it would be smarter to just knock them all down into smaller continents and staple them onto a single planet. I rather dislike the whole "Planet of Hats" trope as it is, and if its a big enough planet, there's a lot one could cram in there.

Well, if a society has evolved to the point of a united world government and space travel, then you can probably form a stereotype about them much as large countries such as the USA have stereotypes... But much as Americans are in fact a large number of people with varying attitudes, personalities, communities and so forth, an entire planetary population would be even more diverse.

...Actually, I don't think I've ever seen a Sci-Fi show with interstellar communities that does have separate space-capable societies on the same world. If you treat the Federation type organization as the UN rather than as a central government, there's no reason why you can't have a few planets with two or three different countries with their own ship designs, alliances and colonies.

If I get around to writing my own idea for a medieval fantasy world evolved into a space-faring empire with magic, I should try to keep the idea of characters not being racial stereotypes in mind. Just because, for a possible example, all Elves are psychologically incapable of feeling sadness due to their brain structure doesn't mean they all act the same.

Huh. Yeah, I recall mention of the connection between Creation-1 and oWoD, but it always seemed kind of off to me. Unless maybe you went with the "reality determined by mass belief" from old Mage, the two realities seem too fundamentally different in structure.

That is what they seemed to be going with. Basically the idea is that somewhere along the line, humans were convinced that magic was fake and everything became massively less magical as a result.

Heck, Vampires were Abyssals, Werewolves were Lunars and Mages were meant to be using the shattered remains of Sidereal Exaltations as the spark that gave them power, apparently.

[Sharkerbob]

Well, if a society has evolved to the point of a united world government and space travel, then you can probably form a stereotype about them much as large countries such as the USA have stereotypes... But much as Americans are in fact a large number of people with varying attitudes, personalities, communities and so forth, an entire planetary population would be even more diverse.

Exactly. And from an environmental standpoint, desert planets aside, it's unlikely you'll find a world completely covered in rainforests or swampland unless some sort of artificial maintenance is required.

...Actually, I don't think I've ever seen a Sci-Fi show with interstellar communities that does have separate space-capable societies on the same world. If you treat the Federation type organization as the UN rather than as a central government, there's no reason why you can't have a few planets with two or three different countries with their own ship designs, alliances and colonies.

No, but it's hard enough just creating one planet without taking shortcuts. Plus, more continents seems like it would be easier to add more interesting geological features, than just spreading all the ideas out across a dozen planets.

Well, part of it is also that I just have zero interest in space opera, and half these planets are magical anyway, and I'd like an easier way to get the species to interact that doesn't require Faster Than Light travel.

If I get around to writing my own idea for a medieval fantasy world evolved into a space-faring empire with magic, I should try to keep the idea of characters not being racial stereotypes in mind. Just because, for a possible example, all Elves are psychologically incapable of feeling sadness due to their brain structure doesn't mean they all act the same.

That, too, another thing I want to avoid.

That is what they seemed to be going with. Basically the idea is that somewhere along the line, humans were convinced that magic was fake and everything became massively less magical as a result.

I dunno, they do say that sufficiently advanced magic is indistinguishable from SCIENCE!

Heck, Vampires were Abyssals, Werewolves were Lunars and Mages were meant to be using the shattered remains of Sidereal Exaltations as the spark that gave them power, apparently.

Huh. Is there a book that specifically states this, or is it all vague implications?

[Omegalith]

Huh. Is there a book that specifically states this, or is it all vague implications?

No idea, honestly. I've considered buying the First Edition book Games of Divinity as a PDF because it sounds fairly interesting, but all my knowledge of Exalted 1st Edition and either World of Darkness is pretty vague and from online sources.

You can definitely see the Lunar/Abyssal link though, Abyssals are blood-drinking Undead working as pawns for ancient lords with plots beyond their ability to truly escape and Lunars have obvious moon ties, similar tribal structures, and a disproportionately large number of Wolf Totem characters despite them being technically able to have any Totem Animal.

[Omegalith]

*Watches new pony episode*

Well, my interest seems to have died back considerably. Oh well. Still enjoyable, just not a big deal at this point. Heck, I wasn't even aware in advance the episode was out today.

Apparently turning your enemy into a tidal wave of darkness is a bad idea. Not that he actually gets any characterization whatsoever.

Oh, and unicorns can learn to shoot beams of darkness and fear from their horns. Apparently this isn't a big deal.

[Sharpandpointies]

The Lunar part is plausible, as are the mages. The Kuei-jin certainly have their place in Exalted Lore.

The Vampires, however, have actual significant history - traceable and verifiable from people who were there, including Cain himself, who is more than powerful enough to say 'I'm sorry, I remember correctly' :) - as descending from a mortal cursed by God himself.

The Exalted writers might have tried to tie in the kindred with their stuff, but it doesn't actually work at all (unlike, for example, Magery, where the Avatar shards might very well correspond quite nicely with stuff from Exalted).

It's worth pointing out that the whole business of the vampire origin happens some twenty to thirty thousand years ago, whereas from what I understand Exalted happens LOOOONG before that.

[The MunchKING]

*Watches new pony episode*

Oh, and unicorns can learn to shoot beams of darkness and fear from their horns. Apparently this isn't a big deal.

Pinkie as the spy can get creepy.

Twilight's nerdgasm though was HILLARIOUS!!

[The MunchKING]

So... ummm... Why was the two powers thread locked?

[Omegalith]

The Vampires, however, have actual significant history - traceable and verifiable from people who were there, including Cain himself, who is more than powerful enough to say 'I'm sorry, I remember correctly' :) - as descending from a mortal cursed by God himself.

The Exalted writers might have tried to tie in the kindred with their stuff, but it doesn't actually work at all (unlike, for example, Magery, where the Avatar shards might very well correspond quite nicely with stuff from Exalted).

Well, there's not necessarily anything keeping him from being cursed with the last intact Abyssal shard long after they died out, I suppose. It's worth noting that the Abyssals are meant to cast themselves into Oblivion once their duties are complete, with one remaining behind to watch and make sure the rest go through with it.

On the other hand, the Abyssal's duties are only considered complete with the complete destruction of all reality, so we're back to not making sense.

[Sharpandpointies]

Probably something to do with 'too many non-rumbles things on page one', or the like.

[Sharpandpointies]

Well, there's not necessarily anything keeping him from being cursed with the last intact Abyssal shard long after they died out, I suppose. It's worth noting that the Abyssals are meant to cast themselves into Oblivion once their duties are complete, with one remaining behind to watch and make sure the rest go through with it.

On the other hand, the Abyssal's duties are only considered complete with the complete destruction of all reality, so we're back to not making sense.

Yeah...doesn't really fit.

Not that it needs to fit. Shoehorning just hurts. There's some stuff that works, some stuff that doesn't.

[Omegalith]

Yeah...doesn't really fit.

Not that it needs to fit. Shoehorning just hurts. There's some stuff that works, some stuff that doesn't.

Well, the thing about them making the line as a history of the world before reality shifted to be less magical is that they didn't need to shoehorn because they could have made it work better in the first place. Make Caine the first Abyssal, the second generation Vampires he eventually wiped out the Deathlords and then work to make that not contradict his established history.

Heck, Theion and the Unconquered Sun are both decent stand ins for the God figure from World of Darkness, with a bit of tweaking. Theion far more so, though he'd have to recover from the maiming that turned him into Malfeas first.

[Omegalith]

...Actually, now that I stop to think about it, the Unconquered Sun is more of a Lucifer figure, only with his rebellion actually succeeding followed by him not being able to handle the pressures of running the universe and shutting himself in the Jade Pleasure Dome.

This becomes more apparent when compared to who he overthrew: Theion, the Omnipresent and unquestionable King of all Creation who manifests only as shining white light and a booming voice of command.

[Beadle]

Ok. It's official. This has been a shitty weekend.

One friend's mother died yesterday.
Another got dumped. By text.

And then today. My wife's just read something another close friend just posted on Facebook. Walking home today, she managed to catch an old lady who tripped over, even getting her hand under the lady's head to stop it hitting the pavement. She got not a single word of thanks, but thought "That's ok. At least I've banked a few karmic points." Ten minutes further up the road, and a middle-aged man with his family decided to cross the road, just for the purpose of yelling at her to call her a "fat c**t" twice.

So yeah.

Shitty weekend.