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  1. #181
    Senior Member Superlad93's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MFitzH2O View Post
    Okay, 'thinking about it' isn't subconscious, that's actually conscious.



    Your right; fear is actually the body's physiological response to the unknown. Things that are different and things people fear don't interest everybody, many people just want to read / watch / witness everyday life with (or without) a wildly dramatic twist. Why? We like our own reflection. You're right about that. We like things that remind us of ourselves and things through which we've gone, that which me have or will likely experience, sure. But that's not to say that everything is an allegory.



    Yes, there is a connection that helps fiction be relatable, but does this mean that every story has a deeper significance, or can a story be told simply because it busies an idle mind? That is: simply to entertain?


    Fear was an example. I didn't say it was allegory. Fiction will always deal with primal things to the human condition....always.

  2. #182
    Junior Member asiansupes's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Superlad93 View Post
    Fear was an example. I didn't say it was allegory. Fiction will always deal with primal things to the human condition....always.

    First off, hanks for the history lesson, MfitzH20. :)
    I do agree that some books are there to entertain but real-life does seep in as some inspiration for whether it be character background to environment. Comics may be an escape but it can sometimes give insight to the human condition. For example, I think Superman will always be a representation of the era his in. Look at his first appearance in the depression era and in the 80s, he was a yuppie. The current version is a representation of the times.

  3. #183
    Senior Member MFitzH2O's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by asiansupes View Post
    First off, thanks for the history lesson, MfitzH20. :)
    I live to complicate things through bits of useless information. I just hope my argument was sound, logical, and understandable!

    I do agree that some books are there to entertain but real-life does seep in as some inspiration for whether it be character background to environment. Comics may be an escape but it can sometimes give insight to the human condition.
    Can be, absolutely, and it makes for strong reading. Literature is based on that and it's the reason why comics, especially in the form of graphic novels, are gaining acceptance. They're typically the books I lean toward and are definitely the books I read time and again. I think you put that really well and wouldn't dream of disagreeing with that statement. Escapes often grant insight.

    I think Superman will always be a representation of the era his in. Look at his first appearance in the depression era and in the 80s, he was a yuppie. The current version is a representation of the times.
    He was a bit of a yuppie in the 80s (I'd say 90s...), wasn't he? I would say the stories, more than the character, was representative of the time until we came to the 80s when we hit the first of many hard and soft reboots of Superman continuity. Through it all, he's been representative of Truth and Justice. When Morrison said (and I'm paraphrasing, same as y'all) Superman's always been representative of the times, he was talking about running themes within the stories more than the character itself. That's the reason the costume remained the same: the stories were being properly told and this allowed the character to evolve naturally.

    Then again, the attitude of 'forget all that' and 'now look over here' might be very representative of our times; all those reboots and retcons from Byrne to today might say more about modern times than the stories being told...

    But I look at the design of the new costume and I see the 90's ... WildC.A.T.s ... Spartan. I look at the jeans and boots and see the 80's ... Springsteen ... Born in the USA. I don't see today, I see yesterday.
    Last edited by MFitzH2O; 09-19-2012 at 08:39 PM.
    A robotic journey toward the American Dream: MADE in USA.

  4. #184
    Senior Member MFitzH2O's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Superlad93 View Post
    Fear was an example. I didn't say it was allegory.
    Right-right, but what was said earlier implies allegory. Examples: 'jimmy is being messed with by a mean kid and the girl he likes doesn't like him. So he goes home and changes all that on paper and makes the bad guy a super villan and the girl a damsel in distress and he is the big strong Superman who saves they day from the villan evil plan.' Allegory. 'Guys that don't like you=arch enemy's. Superhero groups=your friends.' Allegory.

    Now, I've no PhD in psychology, but I don't believe that fiction is necessarily representative of reality. It's great to extrapolate bits of meaning, but you've gotta be careful not to read into it that which isn't there. Even if its creator tells you it is.

    Fiction will always deal with primal things to the human condition....always.
    I will argue that good fiction will likely deal in intelligent, subtle ways with ideas related to the human condition, but not always ... Wait, let's get this back on topic! Relate all this back to the costume! QUICK!
    Last edited by MFitzH2O; 09-19-2012 at 08:40 PM.
    A robotic journey toward the American Dream: MADE in USA.

  5. #185
    Senior Member Superlad93's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MFitzH2O View Post
    Right-right, but what was said earlier implies allegory. Examples: 'jimmy is being messed with by a mean kid and the girl he likes doesn't like him. So he goes home and changes all that on paper and makes the bad guy a super villan and the girl a damsel in distress and he is the big strong Superman who saves they day from the villan evil plan.' Allegory. 'Guys that don't like you=arch enemy's. Superhero groups=your friends.' Allegory.

    Now, I've no PhD in psychology, but I don't believe that fiction is necessarily representative of reality. It's great to extrapolate bits of meaning, but you've gotta be careful not to read into it that which isn't there.



    I will argue that good fiction will likely deal in intelligent, subtle ways with ideas related to the human condition, but not always ... Wait, let's get this back on topic! Relate all this back to the costume! QUICK!
    Ok comic books are very much linked to the real world and get their base from there so naturally fashion will come too.

  6. #186
    Optic Blast, Optic Blast B. Kuwanger's Avatar
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    "Real" as it applies to the old costume:

    Any material tight enough to show striations and muscle definition to that extent would be uncomfortable with trunks underneath, and downright obscene without trunks at all.

  7. #187
    Senior Member Superlad93's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by B. Kuwanger View Post
    "Real" as it applies to the old costume:

    Any material tight enough to show striations and muscle definition to that extent would be uncomfortable with trunks underneath, and downright obscene without trunks at all.

    I agree, that's why the new suit is alien armor.

  8. #188
    Salacious Propriety Tandaemonium's Avatar
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    Anyone notice the new costume is starting to look a little better now that artists are being allowed to draw and color it more fabric-y and less shiny metallic armor? Not to mention posing Superman or drawing as many scenes possible that avoid showing his neck?

  9. #189
    S.P.E.C.T.R.E. destro's Avatar
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    I feel that there is VERY little difference between the two. The only substantial change is losing the trunks in favor of a red belt. All of the other changes like seams, over stylization of the boots etc.. are just details that don't add or take away much.

    Show anybody a picture of the new suit and they will instantly know it is Superman.
    Life looks better in black and white.

  10. #190
    Veteran Member Sacred Knight's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tandaemonium View Post
    Anyone notice the new costume is starting to look a little better now that artists are being allowed to draw and color it more fabric-y and less shiny metallic armor? Not to mention posing Superman or drawing as many scenes possible that avoid showing his neck?
    In some sense yeah, but then you have artists like Rocafort, who don't go for a fabric look at all and in my opinion it still looks fantastic. So i think its more the individual artists just getting used to it, is all, and adapting it to their individual styles much easier than in the beginning. Artists like Reis and Daniel however I think have the perfect middle-ground of a heavier, textured look compared to the old suit, but still not overly bulky by any stretch.
    Last edited by Sacred Knight; 01-17-2013 at 11:12 AM.

  11. #191
    Advocate of Steel JayBay's Avatar
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    Old costume. No contest.

  12. #192
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    Old costume. I despise the heavily lined look and the removal of the red trunks leaves the costume with far too much blue. I could see going with a few seams to give it a look more like a thicker cloth. I can also see the reason behind removing the trunks, but I would rather they gone the other direction and just given him red "pants" or used different shades of blue to break up the costume.

    I really don't see the point in giving an armored look to Superman as it doesn't fit with his power set and it doesn't fit thematically.
    Last edited by DracoDracul; 01-17-2013 at 02:55 PM.

  13. #193
    Senior Member Angilas-Man's Avatar
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    Old costume, no question about it.

    But my fav Supes costume is a piece of fanart, a redesign by Aaron Diaz.

    http://www.comicsalliance.com/2011/1...gn-aaron-diaz/

    The idea of him being a shape-shifting alien ala Martian Manhunter is blegh, but that Superman costume is the bee's knees.

  14. #194
    Paladin Kurosawa's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by destro View Post
    I feel that there is VERY little difference between the two. The only substantial change is losing the trunks in favor of a red belt. All of the other changes like seams, over stylization of the boots etc.. are just details that don't add or take away much.

    Show anybody a picture of the new suit and they will instantly know it is Superman.
    Only because of the \S/.
    Doomed Planet. Desperate Scientists. Last Hope. Kindly Couple.

  15. #195

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    Six/Half Dozen. I have been reading Superman comics since 1978 and I never even notice when I'm engaged in readin an issue.

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