Is "Batman Forever" misunderstood?

[Statham]

What kind of funny is that in Burton stuff (especially in the first batman) the 1980's stuff stand out more than the 1930's stuff

Probably more so for those who lived through the 1980s, though. I mean, if you're under thirty then it's just a mash-up of various eras.

I think that depends on how good your knowledge is. I'm twenty six and can pick out the anachronisms in the '89 film, beyond the stand-outs of using, say, Prince as the Joker's backing music. But I still think those anachronisms are apparent - and still deliberate - in Batman Returns, where the Penguin's Red Triangle gang almost feel.. I don't know, Victorian, in their appearance.

[Statham]

I never got the BR one, sadly. I read the Batman one to pieces before the film even came out! It was the first I'd ever heard of Bob Kane, too. Seriously, I think '89 Batmania did more for discussions about comics creators than anything that came since, because news stations were running full pieces about Kane and, to a lesser extent, other contributors.

I love the visuals for BR, too. Especially with the snow, which provides an eery feeling. I mean, it's Christmas, and all this creepy stuff is going down with the Penguin.

The BR one's going fairly cheaply - albeit used - on Amazon. I'm hoping it's as good as I remember the '89 one being.

But.. Yeah. It's darker, definitely darker, but I love the visuals for Batman Returns. The Christmas feel makes it really quite sombre and allows for some really good sequences - like Bruce picking up the black cat at the end and knowing Selina's out there, the initial Red Triangle fight, and the really rather creepy bit with the Ice Princess being murdered.

[Mac!]

Yeah, if any Batman film is misunderstood, it's Batman Returns. It has a really weird fairy tale vibe, and Danny Devito's take on the Penguin is the most interesting he's ever been.

[Mr. Holmes]

I thought I was only the minority opinion for thinking Batman Returns was trash.

[David Walton]

The BR one's going fairly cheaply - albeit used - on Amazon. I'm hoping it's as good as I remember the '89 one being.

But.. Yeah. It's darker, definitely darker, but I love the visuals for Batman Returns. The Christmas feel makes it really quite sombre and allows for some really good sequences - like Bruce picking up the black cat at the end and knowing Selina's out there, the initial Red Triangle fight, and the really rather creepy bit with the Ice Princess being murdered.

The tone is very inspired and I love it.

Yeah, if any Batman film is misunderstood, it's Batman Returns. It has a really weird fairy tale vibe, and Danny Devito's take on the Penguin is the most interesting he's ever been.

I think it's one that took some time to be fully appreciated. When it first came out, I think audiences were turned off by the Penguin, which had no touch of Burgess Meredith (Nicholson, on the other hand, threw in a bit of Casear Romero).

Funny thing is, the Burton films covered pretty much all the ground Nolan is praised for.

Batman '89 is about the transition from gangsters to freaks.

Batman Returns forces Batman to be the hunted outcast.

[jesse_custer]

I haven't watched Batman Forever. For some reason, it just doesn't interest me. I have watched Batman and Robin, though!

Bale's Bruce was just as boring, if not more so, than Kilmer's. The way he shot holes in Nygma's brain wave theory was better and more source material accurate than anything Bale's Bruce did in any of the Nolan films. And at least there was some sexual chemistry between his love interest. When Bale's Bruce was doing the playboy thing, he just came across like a stuck up arsehole. That's not Bruce Wayne. He's supposed to be charming with it, likeable.

In some scenes, Bale's Bruce is nothing more than the role he played in the Shaft remake.

[Blue_Beetle]

From what I remember, it's just as bad as Batman and Robin.

[TheBalzan]

People still forget that Joel Schumacher wanted to keep the tone of Burton's Batman, it was the producers who wanted him to make it more merchandise friendly. The movie that he truly wanted you can see glimpses of when you look at the deleted scenes. I would love to see a true Joel Schumacher cut of Batman Forever. In one of the special features on the Blu-Ray disc Val Kilmer's talking about playing Batman, it's clearly several years past as his Cushing's Syndrome has started to take it's toll, but he says to himself "It's a really good script", I get the feeling he honestly thought that.

[Predator jp]

yeah, i don't blame Schumacher that much. he basically did what he was told.

[speedline]

People still forget that Joel Schumacher wanted to keep the tone of Burton's Batman, it was the producers who wanted him to make it more merchandise friendly. The movie that he truly wanted you can see glimpses of when you look at the deleted scenes. I would love to see a true Joel Schumacher cut of Batman Forever. In one of the special features on the Blu-Ray disc Val Kilmer's talking about playing Batman, it's clearly several years past as his Cushing's Syndrome has started to take it's toll, but he says to himself "It's a really good script", I get the feeling he honestly thought that.

Yeah, I think the interviews were done in 2005-- the whole cast was really proud of the film and commented on how amazing everything was, something was lost in translation somewhere. In contrast, everyone knew Batman and Robin was a nightmare and no one was proud to be a part of that disaster.

[wu-tang warrior]

Even though Jim Carrey pretty much stars as himself and not the Riddler, that dude cracks me up.

[Fire Knight]

Its not misunderstood at all, its just less shitty than B&R

[Jim Thompson]

I understood what was going on in the film; it just wasn't what I was looking for out of a Batman movie.

[philcho]

This movie was NOWHERE near as bad as Batman & Robin. I wouldn't even consider it to be bad - it was "okay" in my estimation. It's a great film for kids and teens, but past that, you'd need to suspend a lot of disbelief to get past some of the stuff that happens. Even still, I like watching it sometimes. Batman & Robin on the other hand makes me cringe every scene - literally every single scene. There was a "De-assified" fan-edit version that was cut down to about 30 minutes, but even that was hard to watch.

But all things considered, it's a damn shame that people won't recognize Batman Forever at all just because of its tragedy of a sequel.

Now that we have all this Batman stuff out there, if you watch Batman Forever with mindset that it's like a live action version of Batman: the Brave and the Bold, then it sort of works. Some things can't be forgiven (like Two-Face's portrayal, over the top music, neon lights, nipples, etc), but if you can somehow let all that slide, it's really not that bad. I wouldn't say it's misunderstood...it's just not given a chance anymore - which sucks because it's not even that bad.

[net06]

Those movies came out as I was growing up, and I never liked them because they were basically one dimensional action films, except for Batman Returns. I felt that one had some depth to it. To me Batman Forever was the safe, marketable Batman film the studio had always dreamed of having. That being said Val Kilmer doesn't get the credit he deserves for knowing better than to return to the role in B&R. lol