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  1. #16
    Elder Member Blade X's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Vibranium View Post
    I have a former friend, smoked weed all through high school, moved on to coke, now sells coke and weed

    now not everyone is like that, but to say there is no link is a bit naive
    Quoted for the true. I know several people like that, and I grew up in a nice safe middle class neighborhood.

  2. #17
    for the lulz 7thangel's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Blade X View Post
    It's a valid question. Care to answer it?
    no, it's silly. are you asking me if i'm comfortable with a doctor that has a drink before surgery? or pops a 'scrip' before surgery? anything that alters the mind during work such as surgery or operating heavy machinery or driving puts people at risk, including cold medicine (hence the warnings for those that cause drowsiness)



    For moderate weed users, this is true. However, for heavier weed users it does damage the lungs. Here's a link to the recent findings that you were talking about.
    http://well.blogs.nytimes.com/2012/0...s-study-finds/[/quote]

    excess of damn near anything will be harmful. what else is new?

    Considering the fact that most hardcore drug users started out smoking weed, I think that it is safe to say that weed is indeed a gateway drug. Which, of course, is not to say that everyone who smokes weed will go onto use stronger drugs or become chronic hardcore weed smokers. However, most of the weed smokers I personally know either went on to stronger and more dangerous drugs or are hardcore weedheads, who spend most of their free time (many of them don't even work) getting high and/or selling weed. I'm sorry, but there is just no benefit to smoking weed.
    it's a theory based on causation which ignores all the other factors (such is the more predictive addictive personality trait) and tosses out data that doesn't fit. oh, million of weed users don't move on to harder drugs...ignore. oh, hardcore drug users used to drink coffee, liqs, or smoke cigarettes....ignore. there is a reason why it's called a theory and why anecdotal evidence is taken for a grain of salt. for every story of 'friend' started with weed now they're on crack' there's friend smoked weed and never tried anything else not even over-the-counter scrips'

    here's the wiki referencing two studies

    A 2005 comprehensive review of the literature on the cannabis gateway hypothesis found that pre-existing traits may predispose users to addiction in general, the availability of multiple drugs in a given setting confounds predictive patterns in their usage, and drug sub-cultures are more influential than cannabis itself. The study called for further research on "social context, individual characteristics, and drug effects" to discover the actual relationships between cannabis and the use of other drugs.[78]
    A 2010 study published in the Journal of Health and Social Behavior found that the main factors in users moving on to other drugs were age, wealth, unemployment status, and psychological stress. The study found there is no "gateway theory" and that drug use is more closely tied to a person's life situation, although cannabis users are more likely to use other drugs.[83]
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Marijuana


    funny thing is, due to the mixing of tobacco with weed, either by cig heads or by those that developed the habit of adding it to their blunt/spliff, has led some to start smoking cigarettes
    Last edited by 7thangel; 11-17-2012 at 09:32 AM.

  3. #18
    Elder Member Blade X's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by 7thangel View Post
    no, it's silly. are you asking me if i'm comfortable with a doctor that has a drink before surgery? or pops a 'scrip' before surgery? anything that alters the mind during work such as surgery or operating heavy machinery or driving puts people at risk, including cold medicine (hence the warnings for those that cause drowsiness)
    It's not silly question since you (and people who are in favor of legalizing weed use) are claiming that the drug is harmless and/or beneficial. If weed is harmless and/or beneficial, then you should have no problem with people smoking it any time they feel like, including before surgery or when operating heavy machinery. After all, I don't recall anyone botching a surgery or crashing a car immediately after smoking a cigarette,popping a couple of aspirin,or drinking 2 cups of coffee.

    excess of damn near anything will be harmful. what else is new?[/QUOTE]

    Very true. However, my point was that weed smoke can damage a persons lungs.

    it's a theory based on causation which ignores all the other factors (such is the more predictive addictive personality trait) and tosses out data that doesn't fit. oh, million of weed users don't move on to harder drugs...ignore. oh, hardcore drug users used to drink coffee, liqs, or smoke cigarettes....ignore. there is a reason why it's called a theory and why anecdotal evidence is taken for a grain of salt. for every story of 'friend' started with weed now they're on crack' there's friend smoked weed and never tried anything else not even over-the-counter scrips'

    here's the wiki referencing two studies




    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Marijuana
    And taken from that Wiki article you quoted and put in bold.

    The study found there is no "gateway theory" and that drug use is more closely tied to a person's life situation, although cannabis users are more likely to use other drugs.[83]

    Like I said in an earlier post that weed is the gateway drug for many people to start using stronger drugs.

    funny thing is, due to the mixing of tobacco with weed, either by cig heads or by those that developed the habit of adding it to their blunt/spliff, has led some to start smoking cigarettes
    I guess we can start calling weed a gateway to cancer sticks.

    I can't help wondering why haven't some scientists and big businesses haven't spent more time and money in developing ways to remove the negative mind altering effects and harmful health effects of weed,ciggarettes/tobacco,and alcohol. Hell, I'm still wondering why haven't the tobacco company's switched to only making plastic or glass cigarettes filled with flavored or plain water and laced with nicotine.

  4. #19
    Observer Vibranium's Avatar
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    electronic cigarettes are growing in popularity...but states see such a tax boon from tobacco, why cut that out of your pocket

    I think a more accurate statement would be "Marijuana CAN BE a gateway drug" not IS
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  5. #20
    for the lulz 7thangel's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Blade X View Post
    It's not silly question since you (and people who are in favor of legalizing weed use) are claiming that the drug is harmless and/or beneficial. If weed is harmless and/or beneficial, then you should have no problem with people smoking it any time they feel like, including before surgery or when operating heavy machinery. After all, I don't recall anyone botching a surgery or crashing a car immediately after smoking a cigarette,popping a couple of aspirin,or drinking 2 cups of coffee.
    please point to where i said it was harmless and while you're doing it, point to where i advocated legalization. or where anybody is claiming it's not a drug.

    also, it is beneficial for sufferers of cancer, AIDS, and other conditions (nausea and loss of appetite, as well as mild pain relief) which is why medical marijuana is used officially in more than a few places around the world as long as there is no political obstacle.

    Very true. However, my point was that weed smoke can damage a persons lungs.
    of course it can, taking in a foreign substance directly to your lungs will do some damage, adding to what we're already breathing



    And taken from that Wiki article you quoted and put in bold.

    The study found there is no "gateway theory" and that drug use is more closely tied to a person's life situation, although cannabis users are more likely to use other drugs.[83]

    Like I said in an earlier post that weed is the gateway drug for many people to start using stronger drugs.
    yes, the thing that might lead someone to start to smoke weed, or drink alcohol, or or any other drug may lead to them trying other drugs. the gateway is, their quote, "life situation". that is the point the of that sentence and their research.

    I guess we can start calling weed a gateway to cancer sticks.

    I can't help wondering why haven't some scientists and big businesses haven't spent more time and money in developing ways to remove the negative mind altering effects and harmful health effects of weed,ciggarettes/tobacco,and alcohol. Hell, I'm still wondering why haven't the tobacco company's switched to only making plastic or glass cigarettes filled with flavored or plain water and laced with nicotine.
    the tobacco industry adds so many more additives that are known to effect those with addictive behaviour, while some unscrupulous bodega may spray their week weed with some household cleaner, they have nothing on what they use for cigs, upwards of 599 additives reported http://quitsmoking.about.com/cs/nico...ngredients.htm. the purpose of their R&D is to create the most addictive product with the quickest high, a high most never remember experiencing (unless their forced to go anywhere from a day to a week without a drag. but most never call it a high).

  6. #21
    Cat smells like fish StoneGold's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Vibranium View Post
    I have a former friend, smoked weed all through high school, moved on to coke, now sells coke and weed

    now not everyone is like that, but to say there is no link is a bit naive
    That doesn't mean weed is a gateway drug, though. That means, more than likely, he has an addictive personality, and would have never bothered with weed had coke been more readily available. Weed's not a gateway drug, it's just the first illegal substance a future addict can get their hands on.
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  7. #22
    MXAAGVNIEETRO were right The Black Guardian's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Vibranium View Post
    I have a former friend, smoked weed all through high school, moved on to coke, now sells coke and weed

    now not everyone is like that, but to say there is no link is a bit naive
    Practically all of the pot smokers I've ever known continue(d) to stick only with pot, never venturing into other drugs. To suggest a link is naive. The very idea misses a crucial point: other factors are the actual gateway.

    And many more of the hardcore users I've known started with alcohol... or scripts. Heck, I've watched scripts destroy the lives of at least as many people as coke.

    I'd love nothing more than for a nationwide legalization (not just a decriminalization) of marijuana. And while they're at it, anyone whose served time for it should be paid for false imprisonment.
    Last edited by The Black Guardian; 11-18-2012 at 07:33 AM.
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  8. #23
    Elder Member Charles RB's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Blade X View Post
    If it was up to me, they would also be made illegal as well.
    Since they're not illegal though, it doesn't make sense for pot to be illegal when it's generally less harmful. (hell, caffeine is bad for us) The law is meant to be consistent with these things or people will laugh it off, which they do.
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  9. #24
    CotM Member Puma's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Vibranium View Post
    I have a former friend, smoked weed all through high school, moved on to coke, now sells coke and weed

    now not everyone is like that, but to say there is no link is a bit naive
    and how many of your friends smoked weed, stayed with weed (or quit)?

    and how many drank? and moved on to drugs? or still drink? and how many have life problems due to their drinking?

    What have I always believed? That, on the whole, and by and large, if a person lived properly, not according to what any priests said, but according to what seemed decent and honest inside, then it would, at the end, more or less, turn out ok.

    "In 1996, I was 36. And you're still a frothing moonbat." ~Paradox

  10. #25
    Nyah! Paradox's Avatar
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    It hasn't been mentioned yet, unless I missed it, but one of the reasons marijuana is a "gateway" (nonsense, of course) to other illegal drugs is that it itself is illegal, and introduces people to a wider illicit drug scene. It would not at all lead to coke or harder things if it were sold in the stores. It, in and of itself, had no "gateway" properties.
    'Dox out.

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  11. #26
    CotM Member Puma's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Paradox View Post
    It hasn't been mentioned yet, unless I missed it, but one of the reasons marijuana is a "gateway" (nonsense, of course) to other illegal drugs is that it itself is illegal, and introduces people to a wider illicit drug scene. It would not at all lead to coke or harder things if it were sold in the stores. It, in and of itself, had no "gateway" properties.
    Excellent overlooked point.
    What have I always believed? That, on the whole, and by and large, if a person lived properly, not according to what any priests said, but according to what seemed decent and honest inside, then it would, at the end, more or less, turn out ok.

    "In 1996, I was 36. And you're still a frothing moonbat." ~Paradox

  12. #27
    Senior Member Castel's Avatar
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    Hmm, well, who haven't smoke some ? I sure did. Lot of you here did try at least once i'm sure.

    Ok, be honest now. How many of you former pot smokers are currently dealing drugs ? Rise your hand, don't be shy, no one ? Nobody ?

    Damn !! Maybe this gateway theory is not so true after all.

    But weed can be dangerously addictive indeed. That's something i think shouldn't be taking too lightly. It can f*** up one's life mighty seriously.
    Last edited by Castel; 11-18-2012 at 08:29 AM.

  13. #28
    Nyah! Paradox's Avatar
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    Personally, my gateway drug was...going to high school in the late '70s.
    'Dox out.

    "But I think the difference is, when Democrats go crazy, they get shown the door. When Republicans go crazy they get appointed to the Science committee. " - Shawn Hopkins

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  14. #29
    CotM Member Puma's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Paradox View Post
    Personally, my gateway drug was...going to high school in the late '70s.
    yup
    What have I always believed? That, on the whole, and by and large, if a person lived properly, not according to what any priests said, but according to what seemed decent and honest inside, then it would, at the end, more or less, turn out ok.

    "In 1996, I was 36. And you're still a frothing moonbat." ~Paradox

  15. #30
    Elder Member Wjowski's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Blade X View Post
    Quoted for the true. I know several people like that, and I grew up in a nice safe middle class neighborhood.
    And I've known plenty of people who didn't. Correlation does not equal causation.

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