Why Does Marvel Hate Fantasy/Horror Comics?

**Post Monster** · 08-02-2012, 02:48 PM

Originally Posted by carabas

Pssst. Vertigo is DC Comics. DC has been putting out tons of horror and fantasy books through Vertigo.

Vertigo is published by DC, but it isn't DC, if you know what I mean.

As for the new dark line, I'm less than impressed by what I've seen. I wanted to love Demon Knights, but it's just meh. I hate what they've done with Savage and dislike female Shining Knight. Justice League Dark is full of boring characters who are trying way too hard to be cool, dark and broody. Frankly I think horror is getting old anyway, and I'd like to see more myth and urban fantasy lines that aren't trying to be dark.

**aNamored** · 08-02-2012, 03:48 PM

Originally Posted by Post Monster

Vertigo is published by DC, but it isn't DC, if you know what I mean.

As for the new dark line, I'm less than impressed by what I've seen. I wanted to love Demon Knights, but it's just meh. I hate what they've done with Savage and dislike female Shining Knight. Justice League Dark is full of boring characters who are trying way too hard to be cool, dark and broody. Frankly I think horror is getting old anyway, and I'd like to see more myth and urban fantasy lines that aren't trying to be dark.

Wow I felt the exact same way about Demon Knights Post Monster. I can't stand Shining Knight and Savage while fun gets a little one-note after awhile. Yeah, I want fun fantasy/weird whatever (which is why I think I've grown to love Defenders as much as I do.)

**carabas** · 08-02-2012, 04:36 PM

Originally Posted by Post Monster

Vertigo is published by DC, but it isn't DC, if you know what I mean.

I really don't know what you mean.

How are these not DC?

**carabas** · 08-02-2012, 04:37 PM

And similarily, how are these not Vertigo?

**Scrach Fan** · 08-02-2012, 04:41 PM

You know when i first read Death of Dracula i thought it was gonna be Drac comes back from being kill by the council and starts his journey with Janus and kill every memmber until he faces his bastard son, but insted we get a bad mutan vs vamp, oh well. hey what happen to Dr.Strange friend Wong is he dead?

**Post Monster** · 08-02-2012, 05:32 PM

Originally Posted by carabas

I really don't know what you mean.

How are these not DC?

Vertigo has been AU to the superhero comics which are mainstream DC fair, hence the reason why they've been published by Vertigo not DC. Crossovers don't count since DC obviously wanted to distance these comics from their superhero lines. The merging into 52 is brand spanking new, not something that's been around for a long time. As far as I'm concerned DC is the superhero line, and Vertigo is it's estranged child. Dumping a bunch of Vertigo characters into DC's main superhero lines doesn't impress me.

**HectorP** · 08-02-2012, 05:52 PM

Originally Posted by The Animal Man

DC Consistently Releases Horror titles as apart of their dark line and starting september will add another fantasy title alongside demon knights yet when i look at marvel i just see a dozen avengers and x-men related titles with nothing fantasy or horror related in anyway the closet thing was Journey Into Mystery and that's coming to a close sadly...

does marvel just think fantasy and horror titles aren't that popular or something?

They can't possibly think that, when Walking Dead is one of the most popular comic titles nowadays, and it's horror.

I think balancing the genre with the shared universe and their built-in current audience is what makes it trickier.

**carabas** · 08-02-2012, 06:08 PM

Originally Posted by Post Monster

Vertigo has been AU to the superhero comics which are mainstream DC fair, hence the reason why they've been published by Vertigo not DC. Crossovers don't count since DC obviously wanted to distance these comics from their superhero lines. The merging into 52 is brand spanking new, not something that's been around for a long time. As far as I'm concerned DC is the superhero line, and Vertigo is it's estranged child. Dumping a bunch of Vertigo characters into DC's main superhero lines doesn't impress me.

History lesson: for a few decades, Vertigo was the home of former DCU characters like John Contantine, Swamp Thing, Sandman, Animal Man, the Doom Patrol etcetera as well as creator-owned work. Nevermind that Dream Of the Endless was in JLA and JSA arcs.
And the prodigal sons have now come home, starring in stories that not in any way at all different from when it said "Vertigo" in the top left corner of the cover. And since the New 52, Vertigo now is creator-owned, non-superhero, non DCU exclusively, with the exception of Hellblazer.

Not one single Vertigo-original character is appearing in a new 52 book.

**whiteshark** · 08-03-2012, 04:38 AM

Originally Posted by Wellman

Infernal Man-Thing is technically a reprint of unpublished material but that does count as horror or at least a type of horror and so does Marvel Zombies, although those are usually played as dark comedies. Journey into Mystery would also count as very much a fantasy book, probably the first Marvel attempt at such in years, not counting a few Thor mini series set in his and past.

The rest of the examples you and others have provided are not. A horror book can't just be a arc within a superhero title and fantasy isn't just weird occult/super science that Fraction's current Defenders usually deal with, which actually sort of a send up to pulp adventure books. The problem I think most fans (myself included) have is that there is not a dedicate push for these books. You might get a dedicated horror or fantasy mini series once every 2 and half years, not including reprints. Marvel Zombies books are usually dark comedies or straight action, some people that got into Marvel would prefer to see some of the classic horror/fantasy characters that were created actually used for more then just basic superhero stories.

Now the fantasy characters unfortunately are pretty bare due to Marvel no longer having the rights to Conan, Red Sonja and a number of their former properties that they licensed back in the day. But their horror and dark characters are there and outside of Man-Thing and Dr. Strange, usually not getting used much. Not even counting DC/Vertigo which has used its imprints to put out a number of books of the genre, smaller publishers like Image, Boom! and Dark Horse all outclass Marvel's output so the idea there is no market for it is pretty much crap.

You make good points.
There is no a push by Marvel to the horror comics.I think that can be explained that with the exceptions of the 70s in which comics as Dracula and in the start of the 90s in which the popularity of the new Ghost Rider comic the marvel horror comic books do not do well in sales.
Blade,Doctor Vodoo,Hellstorm,Morbius,Ghost Rider(recent volumes) Werewolf by night,these were all comics which were cancelled due poor sales.
So this explain the lack of a push by marvel in regards of horror comics i think.
Having said that,comics as Infernal Man Thing, are still good examples of marel publishing horror comics.The quantity of horror comics being published may be not much but that is a genre that keep being published by marvel anyways.

I think depending of the quality of the script and art even a super hero comic book which have a horror or fantasy driven story can be seen as good examples of that genre dureing the duration of that arc.
If it is a really good horror or fantasy story what diference does it make if the protagonist are super heroes?

**Expletive Deleted** · 08-03-2012, 04:59 AM

Originally Posted by carabas

How are these not DC?

Originally Posted by carabas

And similarily, how are these not Vertigo?

Well, they've got the wrong logos.

You're not wrong about the connections between the two or their historical roots, but do you really not see the full reintegration of these characters into the regular superhero line as a change in how the company is treating them?

**carabas** · 08-03-2012, 05:38 AM

Originally Posted by Expletive Deleted

Well, they've got the wrong logos.

That's a technicality.

You're not wrong about the connections between the two or their historical roots, but do you really not see the full reintegration of these characters into the regular superhero line as a change in how the company is treating them?

Well, I'm not really seeing much integration here. Swamp Thing's not guest-starring in JLA or Batman books, he's guest-starring in Animal Man.

And it's not a change, it's a reversal of a change. All of those characters were created as integral parts of the DCU. And even when the iron curtain between Vertigo and the DCU was at its strongest you still had characters from Sandman appearing in JLA and JSA, and Zatanna popping up in Hellblazer.

**turtletrekker** · 08-03-2012, 07:37 PM

Originally Posted by Leocomix

For fantasy, there is Journey Into Mystery. And that's one of the best fantasy book since Sandman.

Exactly. I'm gonna miss JiM.

**Wellman** · 08-03-2012, 08:29 PM

I've come to share the latest from this week's Axel-In-Charge...

On the creative side, Just Endless wanted to know, "The distinguished competition over there has had a lot of success lately with their 'Dark' line, critically, and even in sales. Are there any plans for the Marvel universe to have it's own counterpart, ie. a book, or group of books with a fantasy/horror vibe? With the conclusion of JiM underway, such a movement would certainly be much appreciated."

Alonso: While there are no current plans for a “dark” line, as you put it, we continue to publish a lot of darker, edgier, fantasy and horror titles in both the Marvel Universe and MAX universe. Cullen Bunn and Dalibor Talijic’s weekly-shipping “Deadpool Kills the Marvel Universe” sold out its first two issues and is Marvel’s second-highest digital download this month. Frank Tieri and Mark Texeira’s “Space: Punisher” – think Buck Rogers as Dirty Harry – has been one of our best-reviewed series of the year. And you’ve haven’t seen the last of the apocalyptic, cannibalistic universe created by Jonathan Maberry in “Marvel Universe vs. Wolverine.” I could keep going…