The Mighty, Mighty Infinite Consolidated One-Stop New 52 Complaint Thread

[CaptCleghorn]

Absolutely.

I'm not really into the new 52. But looking at this at least a little objectively, it's obvious that it's working relatively well. I mean, we've nailed down the 2 biggest counterarguments at this point to 'sales are only a little bit better' and 'there are a couple hundred people unhappy about it on the internet!'

Mythologies are tailor-made for revision and rethought. It's almost bizarre how people that grew up with the 80s/90s DCU seem to be having the hardest time letting go of it, since it's analogous to what's happening now. I totally get missing books and characters you once enjoyed. But there was never a commitment that they were going to produce a particular book or take forever and forever.

Things change. Things end.

And things come back.

I don't think it's bizarre about the fans from the post-Crisis days being very vocal about wanting certain characters and concepts back. Supergirl was dead. Superman was the ONLY survivor of Krypton. Barry Allen was dead; Wally West was the new Flash. That changed.

The anti-nu52 people have a problem with the books. You seem to have a problem with the anti-nu52 people.

[tylenoljones]

I mean, we've nailed down the 2 biggest counterarguments at this point to 'sales are only a little bit better' and 'there are a couple hundred people unhappy about it on the internet!'

Congratulations on nailing down those counter arguments. I think a pat on the back is well deserved.

I totally get missing books and characters you once enjoyed. But there was never a commitment that they were going to produce a particular book or take forever and forever.

Things change. Things end.

And change isn't always for the better. Look, we're comic fans. Not a one of us has a hard time understanding that things change from time to time. Acknowledging that isn't a great way to come off as more enlightened than the rest of us. You might as well just come on out and say "Can't we all just get along?"

Of course there was never a commitment between any of us and DC. They can publish whatever they want, and I can spend my money however I choose.

Personally, i'm more than a little tired of the preaching, the name calling (grumpy old men? Thanks for that one...), and the false concern "it's unhealthy. I'm just worried. No one should take this stuff so seriously" garbage.

Edit: Got this thread confused with the Alan Scott one :)

[fishbonex]

I'm sure it is. But we're not all new readers.

I'm a long time reader and bought the original Crisis monthly, I love the nu52 and am reading more DC now than I ever have.

[Sandor Clegane]

I don't think it's bizarre about the fans from the post-Crisis days being very vocal about wanting certain characters and concepts back.

I understand wanting them back, as I said above. Heck, I'm one of those fans that grew up with 80s/90s DC.

Which is exactly why I know, rationally speaking, these types of changes have all happened before, and will happen many more times over. That's really the point - each version of the DCU of the past 50+ years is version 2, or 3, etc.

Why would any one revision be permanent?

[Sandor Clegane]

Congratulations on nailing down those counter arguments. I think a pat on the back is well deserved.

Thanks. Next up: World peace in 4 moves.

[Zeeguy91]

I feel like one of the only ones who appreciates the new 52, its a great starting point for new reader's.

Dude, you're absolutely not the only one who enjoys the New 52. I've been reading DC on and off for several years and I am enjoying it very much. Its left some of the stuff alone that didn't need any fixing and its cleaned up some of what was confusing or unnecessary. Of course, there was some collateral damage, but for the most part I think more good came out of it than bad.

There was actually a poll recently that showed that the vast majority of people that visit this site like the New 52. The naysayers only appear as if they are in the majority because they are VERY vocal about it, but when you observe closely, you can see that it is only the same few posters complaining again, and again, and again, and again.....till infinity.

[CaptCleghorn]

Dude, you're absolutely not the only one who enjoys the New 52. I've been reading DC on and off for several years and I am enjoying it very much. Its left some of the stuff alone that didn't need any fixing and its cleaned up some of what was confusing or unnecessary. Of course, there was some collateral damage, but for the most part I think more good came out of it than bad.

There was actually a poll recently that showed that the vast majority of people that visit this site like the New 52. The naysayers only appear as if they are in the majority because they are VERY vocal about it, but when you observe closely, you can see that it is only the same few posters complaining again, and again, and again, and again.....till infinity.

Thread: Why are people so mad about the new 52

Did you expect something different in this thread?

[tylenoljones]

Dude, you're absolutely not the only one who enjoys the New 52. I've been reading DC on and off for several years and I am enjoying it very much. Its left some of the stuff alone that didn't need any fixing and its cleaned up some of what was confusing or unnecessary. Of course, there was some collateral damage, but for the most part I think more good came out of it than bad.

There was actually a poll recently that showed that the vast majority of people that visit this site like the New 52. The naysayers only appear as if they are in the majority because they are VERY vocal about it, but when you observe closely, you can see that it is only the same few posters complaining again, and again, and again, and again.....till infinity.

And when has anyone claimed that people that dislike the new52 are the majority? It's like you bring up counter arguments to things that not one single person has stated, and use it to claim some kind of victory. I'm more than happy to shut up about all this, under one condition: I get to go to any thread you post in and say "oh look, it's this guy again. Loves the new52. Brags about it again and again and again...... til infinity."

Also love that negativity on this site is dismissed as "naysayers complaining all the time", but a poll from this same site that supports your beliefs is PROOF.

[tony ingram]

Don't resent them. The newbies didn't cause this. Factors beyond their control caused this.

Yeah, I know that, rationally. But when you're annoyed at characters you've followed your whole life being changed beyond recognition and someone dismisses it with "I never read this character before, but I like the new version", it's infuriating.

The real challenge is how are they going to react when the mess that started all this-big events start happening and characters they like start getting trashed like we saw in the Teen Titan franchise. When they experience what we all had to put up with for 3 years will they stay or go?

What do you think? I don't think the answer's really in doubt...

[Zeeguy91]

And when has anyone claimed that people that dislike the new52 are the majority? It's like you bring up counter arguments to things that not one single person has stated, and use it to claim some kind of victory. I'm more than happy to shut up about all this, under one condition: I get to go to any thread you post in and say "oh look, it's this guy again. Loves the new52. Brags about it again and again and again...... til infinity."

Also love that negativity on this site is dismissed as "naysayers complaining all the time", but a poll from this same site that supports your beliefs is PROOF.

First, no need to be hostile.

Second, um yeah, the person I was responding to said that they felt that they were the only one who appreciated it. I was simply showing him that he wasn't and that a lot of us do.

And, yeah, I do count a poll as proof while a few comments are easy dismiss because when I usually see a comment thats negative toward the entire premise of the New 52, its usually from one of the few posters that I already know are against it.

And yeah, you can follow me into any forum and post that. Because at least when you do that, it shows that I'm being positive and looking at what's good about the reboot and that I'm not dwelling on negatives or letting something trivial and meant for enjoyment, like comics, ruin my entire life.

[Zeeguy91]

Yeah, I know that, rationally. But when you're annoyed at characters you've followed your whole life being changed beyond recognition and someone dismisses it with "I never read this character before, but I like the new version", it's infuriating.

Except many fans of the New 52 have come on here and said themselves that they aren't in fact "newbies" as you'd like to think. I've been a fan of DC Comics ever since I was about 10 years old, so I hardly qualify as a newbie. And its infuriating to see someone dismiss the new 52 as "oh, its only for newbies. If you were a fan before, you wouldn't be a fan of this and if you do like this, you were never a real fan."

[glennsim]

Yeah, I know that, rationally. But when you're annoyed at characters you've followed your whole life being changed beyond recognition and someone dismisses it with "I never read this character before, but I like the new version", it's infuriating.

Well now that's an interesting bit of wording. Because the quotation you use (which I assume you created to sum up what other people are saying) doesn't sound like it's meant to address your concern. Yet you see it as "dismissing" yours. What is the opposite of "dismissing" in your eyes? What should fans of the new52 be doing to make your life better? Should they be saying "Gosh, I didn't realize that not everybody was happying with this. If we're not all going to be on board with this, I'm just going to have to quit buying DC too." - ?

You keep saying you have a right to complain. I know you might claim you believe that people who do enjoy it can say they do. But when you categorize liking it as "dismissing" your complaints, that assumes that one has something to do with the other, which they do not.

Now, the more pertinent issue might be countering your disapproval with making points about sales or marketability. But even that isn't meant to say that you don't have a right to disapprove. It's to say that your disapproval isn't likely to make a difference to DC. Which brings one back to railing against things one has no control over.

[PennyDreadful]

Mythologies are tailor-made for revision and rethought. It's almost bizarre how people that grew up with the 80s/90s DCU seem to be having the hardest time letting go of it, since it's analogous to what's happening now. I totally get missing books and characters you once enjoyed. But there was never a commitment that they were going to produce a particular book or take forever and forever.

Things change. Things end.

Well, I started reading comics in the early 1980s, before COIE. If there's something I miss about the post-COIE era, it was a sense of adventure. DC was willing to try new stuff. IMO, that sense of adventure has been lost following the reboot; it does not feel like a revision to me. It feels, in some respects, as if DC is turning back the clock. And there's a sense of "more of the same" as well.

I think it remains to be seen how the reboot works, creatively and sales wise, in the long run. COIE also had some duds in the beginning.

If people like it, fine. But I also think it's silly to refer to detractors as "grumpy old men." I'm probably younger than a lot of readers in this thread, and I'm not a man. I'm also not that grumpy.

Which leads me to my biggest issue (besides some favorite characters missing): where's the FUN in these books? You look at the lineup and it is utterly devoid of humor. I picked up the new Blue Beetle hoping for fun, and...well...there isn't any. What gives?

[PennyDreadful]

Except many fans of the New 52 have come on here and said themselves that they aren't in fact "newbies" as you'd like to think. I've been a fan of DC Comics ever since I was about 10 years old, so I hardly qualify as a newbie. And its infuriating to see someone dismiss the new 52 as "oh, its only for newbies. If you were a fan before, you wouldn't be a fan of this and if you do like this, you were never a real fan."

I don't like that either. And it reminds me of all the disagreements I was involved with as a Trek fangirl. I didn't watch Enterprise, the last Trek spinoff, but I love DS9 with TOS as a very close second. To me, a fan is a fan is a fan, and fans have different reasons for liking a product. (Me, I got lambasted by a Trek old-timer for loving the DS9 episode "Trials and Tribble-ations." Seriously.)

I do think that these days, DC fans are more likely to be drawn in by other media (films, cartoons, etc.). The new 52 seems to operate as an island unto itself.

[The Darknight Detective]

(Me, I got lambasted by a Trek old-timer for loving the DS9 episode "Trials and Tribble-ations." Seriously.)

As someone who actually can recall watching TOS as a preschooler when it was still on NBC, I liked that episode, too.