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Thread: Raven is gone?

  1. #46
    King of Atlantis Doctor Voodoo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by HawkBoy View Post
    Raven could end up being Darkseid's daughter
    Making Trigon her mother?
    Last.FM || Favorite Hero: Aquaman || Favorite Neutral: Red Hood || Favorite Villain: Black Manta

  2. #47

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    Quote Originally Posted by Outside_85 View Post
    I hope not...
    I hope not also! I don't know if I'd like that very much or not. Just no.

  3. #48
    Senior Member Lorendiac's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by HawkBoy View Post
    Raven could end up being Darkseid's daughter
    Quote Originally Posted by Doctor Voodoo View Post
    Making Trigon her mother?

    For what it's worth: It was only a few years ago (I think) that I learned from her Wikipedia entry that when Raven first debuted (1980), the way she always had the upper portion of her face hidden by the shadow of her hooded cloak was a point which led some fans to write in letters to DC asking: "Just who is this spooky Raven chick -- a long-lost daughter of The Phantom Stranger?" (Because the upper portion of his face was always, or almost always, hidden by the shadow from his hatbrim -- and he was an enigmatic figure who could mysteriously teleport in and out of a conversation at the drop of a hat, and so forth . . .)

    Apparently Wolfman and Perez hadn't even considered that possibility when they created her! Any apparent resemblance between the looks and M.O.'s of the two characters was sheer coincidence!

  4. #49
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lorendiac View Post
    For what it's worth: It was only a few years ago (I think) that I learned from her Wikipedia entry that when Raven first debuted (1980), the way she always had the upper portion of her face hidden by the shadow of her hooded cloak was a point which led some fans to write in letters to DC asking: "Just who is this spooky Raven chick -- a long-lost daughter of The Phantom Stranger?" (Because the upper portion of his face was always, or almost always, hidden by the shadow from his hatbrim -- and he was an enigmatic figure who could mysteriously teleport in and out of a conversation at the drop of a hat, and so forth . . .)

    Apparently Wolfman and Perez hadn't even considered that possibility when they created her! Any apparent resemblance between the looks and M.O.'s of the two characters was sheer coincidence!
    Actually Wolfman was trying to create a new kind of mystic for the NTT cast when he created Raven, he didn't want a mystic to begin with because he kept thinking Dr. Strange and Phantom Stranger, their editor at the time however 'dared' him to come up with a new kind of mystic and Raven is the result. Interesting fact is that Raven is sort of a pioneer character since at the time of creation there were no mystics on any group books (which puts this planning some time before Zatanna first joined the JLA in 78), and well, she's hardly ever been off a team since. It is however Perez' fault that she visually appears so similar to the Stranger. Funny thing is that they initially planned on never showing how her face looked, but the many questions it raised and the comparisons to the Stranger made them reveal it pretty early on.

  5. #50
    Senior Member Lorendiac's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Outside_85 View Post
    Actually Wolfman was trying to create a new kind of mystic for the NTT cast when he created Raven, he didn't want a mystic to begin with because he kept thinking Dr. Strange and Phantom Stranger, their editor at the time however 'dared' him to come up with a new kind of mystic and Raven is the result. Interesting fact is that Raven is sort of a pioneer character since at the time of creation there were no mystics on any group books (which puts this planning some time before Zatanna first joined the JLA in 78), and well, she's hardly ever been off a team since. It is however Perez' fault that she visually appears so similar to the Stranger. Funny thing is that they initially planned on never showing how her face looked, but the many questions it raised and the comparisons to the Stranger made them reveal it pretty early on.
    Been awhile since I looked at that Wikipedia article -- but I had remembered the bit about how they ended up showing the readers her unhooded face a heck of a lot sooner than originally intended, largely because of all the questions about a possible blood tie to The Phantom Stranger. I had the impression that such questions from fans, however, had come as complete surprises to Wolfman and Perez -- I may have been wrong about that!

    The suggestion that Raven was a pioneer in the field of "regular mystic members of superhero teams" is surprising -- it forced me to think back to what I knew about the other team titles of the 1970s.

    The Phantom Stranger had intermittently worked with the JLA in the 1970s -- but not as a "regular team player" who'd show up in their adventures practically every month for a year or more at a stretch, no. I don't think they had any way to call him up on a communications device each time the world was in dire peril; he'd just suddenly materialize out of the shadows once in a blue moon when he happened to feel the need!

    I guess you're not counting Marvel books -- Dr. Strange was a founding member of the Defenders in the early 70s and continued to work with them for a long time (although not in every single issue, I believe).

    On the other hand, despite her choice of alias, The Scarlet Witch was just supposed to be a "probability-warping mutant who has joined the Avengers" for a long time before she started developing her full "mystic potential" and becoming more of a true witch -- sometime in the late 70s or thereabouts?

    The old Legion of Super-Heroes was also awfully short on "mystics" unless we count Dream Girl's precognitive visions, which most people probably don't -- I don't think the prevalence of precognition on her homeworld was stated to be a "magic" talent.

    Hmmm. Does the original Uncle Sam (from Quality's Golden Age comics, and later from DC's Earth-X) qualify as a "mystic"? He was definitely a regular in the "Freedom Fighters" title of the late 70s. Granted, it didn't last all that long . . . (as in, I'm sure it had faded away into limbo well before the Wolfman/Perez New Teen Titans got going . . .)

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    Well, by pioneer I was thinking Wolfman meant as her being a first as a character designed for the role of being the team mystic...since Dr. Strange, Dr. Fate, Scarlet Witch and most of the others started off as either independent characters or were support characters in other books. Or ofc he could have meant that DC didnt have a serving mystic on any team...or that he didnt count Marvel as you said. (Finally, it could be that his admitted terrible memory for dates and such has him wrong)

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