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  1. #76
    Elder Member whiteshark's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by carabas View Post
    I have followed Darevil for years. Dropped it when it started getting caught up in Dark Reign and Shadowlands crap. Not really sure why I'd pick up the neew DD book.
    Seems like every single last Marvel book I pick up gets dragged into an event, or canceled, or both in the case of Spider-Woman. Or Thor, which lost its writer over it when Siege happenend.

    Hulk has been a particularily event-prone book in recent years. Wolverine is Wolverine. Last time I checked he is continuously involved in events. It's also an overpriced $4 book, which I refuse to pay on principle, no matter how good Jason Aaron's "Scalped" is.

    Let's see how long that lasts. The previous event derailed a couple of books.
    The current Daredevil have not been draged in any events at all.It have a own direction and narrative voice that sets that book apart.In fact have even been nominated to the Eisner awards.A shame that because you did not like the previous stories of DD by a diferent creative team you are missing one of the best comic books in the industry.
    And no neither,Hulk or Wolverine have not been draged in events at all recently.I concede the point that in the past there were comics that would be draged in events,but thats not the case anymore.
    As i said Avengers vs x-men have 6 titles that tie in with the event,thats all.
    All the other comics keep going in their own direction.
    So lets at least complain about something that happens in the comics and not keep going with old complains of things that are not even hapening anymore in the comics.
    Pull List:New Avengers,Thor,Superior Spider-Man,Mighty Avengers,Swamp Thing,Daredevil,Uncanny Avengers,Superior Foes of Spider-Man.

  2. #77
    Elder Member whiteshark's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nick Soapdish View Post
    I checked it out from the library a few months ago. Two issues of Venom sounds about right and they were more focused on Flash and Brock so maybe the important Venom parts were told in ASM.
    I have read Spider Island months ago.
    But from what i remember the main story was told in ASM.
    I did get a few tie ins issues but that was because i was collecting Venom on and off anyways.
    I do remember thinking while i was reading ASM that i could have just read the issues in that title and get the story just by reading ASM.
    And speaking of ASM,that comic book did not get draged to neither Fear Itself,Siege,Dark Reign.

    There have been some comics that lose their direction by being draged in events,but that have not been hapening with ASM.
    Not saying Marvel is perfect,for example i did not liked that upcomings limited series as Space Punisher and Infernal Man Thing were priced at 3.99 instead of being 2.99 since those Limited series are not mainstream comics.But marvel just being labeled as being bad is really not fair,since marvel as any other comic book company have both good and bad comics.
    Pull List:New Avengers,Thor,Superior Spider-Man,Mighty Avengers,Swamp Thing,Daredevil,Uncanny Avengers,Superior Foes of Spider-Man.

  3. #78
    Marquis de carabas's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Shellhead View Post
    I've been tempted to start reading Daredevil again. Mark Waid is supposedly doing some of the best writing of his career in Daredevil right now, and I really enjoyed his work for Boom! in recent years, on Irredeemable, Incorruptible and The Unknown. But I expect that Daredevil will get derailed by whatever event follows AvX.
    Yeah, same here. Once bitten, twice shy and all that. Although I have been bitten three or four times now and have finally learned the lesson: Marvel books will burn you badly once you start to love them.
    'The marquis. Well, you know, to be honest, he seems a little bit dodgy to me.'
    'Mm,' she agreed. 'He's a little bit dodgy in the same way that rats are a little bit covered in fur."

  4. #79
    Marquis de carabas's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by whiteshark View Post
    The current Daredevil have not been draged in any events at all.
    Yet. Give it time.

    Here's the thing: the better a book does and the more critical praise a book does, the bigger the chance that Marvel will get greedy and mess it up.
    See also JMS on Thor, JMS on Supreme Power, the very intrigueing Skrull storyline that had been running for a few years in New Avengers (because is Not-At-All-Secret Direct Attack was where Bendis was going ith this, then he's a way worse writer thn I gave him credit for. And re-reading earlier issues, absolutely no way was Spider-Woman planned to be a Skrull queen.)

    It have a own direction and narrative voice that sets that book apart.In fact have even been nominated to the Eisner awards.
    Yes, I seem to remember other Marvel books like that. That then were destroyed by events.

    And no neither,Hulk or Wolverine have not been draged in events at all recently.
    Define "recently"? In the last 6 months or so? Last I remember Daken was starring in the main Wolverine book.

    I concede the point that in the past there were comics that would be draged in events,but thats not the case anymore.
    Well, they're going to have to rebuild some trust in their products over the next two years or so before I give them another go...
    'The marquis. Well, you know, to be honest, he seems a little bit dodgy to me.'
    'Mm,' she agreed. 'He's a little bit dodgy in the same way that rats are a little bit covered in fur."

  5. #80
    Marquis de carabas's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by whiteshark View Post
    A shame that because you did not like the previous stories of DD by a diferent creative team
    Missed this bit earlier.

    I loved the creative team when I dropped the book. I don't think I ever read something by Andy Diggle I didn't at least like. I mean, the man made me love Adam Frelling Strange for crying out loud (a character entirely coincidentally Mark Waid made me hate before).

    It's just... Shadowland. Marvel events have a really bad reputation, and going by what I read about it, Shadowland really reinforced that.

    you are missing one of the best comic books in the industry...
    You know what, if he actually gets to finish his run unimpeded, I'll get the trades in a few years.
    'The marquis. Well, you know, to be honest, he seems a little bit dodgy to me.'
    'Mm,' she agreed. 'He's a little bit dodgy in the same way that rats are a little bit covered in fur."

  6. #81
    Too late Nick Soapdish's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by carabas View Post
    It's just... Shadowland. Marvel events have a really bad reputation, and going by what I read about it, Shadowland really reinforced that.
    I think that events for both Marvel and DC have a really bad reputation. But they do sell.

  7. #82
    Elder Member Shellhead's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nick Soapdish View Post
    I think that events for both Marvel and DC have a really bad reputation. But they do sell.
    White Castle hamburgers also sell well. I still won't eat them ever again. Once was enough.
    "Injustice anywhere is a threat to justice everywhere."
    Martin Luther King Jr., Letter from Birmingham Jail, April 16, 1963

  8. #83
    Marquis de carabas's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nick Soapdish View Post
    I think that events for both Marvel and DC have a really bad reputation. But they do sell.
    DC at least seems to usually have the good graces to put the main stuff in the actual events instaed of the tie-ins, and not have their 50+ issue sagas and on a frelling "To be coninued in our next 50+ issue trainwreck.
    'The marquis. Well, you know, to be honest, he seems a little bit dodgy to me.'
    'Mm,' she agreed. 'He's a little bit dodgy in the same way that rats are a little bit covered in fur."

  9. #84
    Too late Nick Soapdish's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Shellhead View Post
    White Castle hamburgers also sell well. I still won't eat them ever again. Once was enough.
    It wasn't an endorsement, merely an observation. I'm not buying any of either at the moment.

    Quote Originally Posted by carabas View Post
    DC at least seems to usually have the good graces to put the main stuff in the actual events instaed of the tie-ins, and not have their 50+ issue sagas and on a frelling "To be coninued in our next 50+ issue trainwreck.
    Wait, wasn't that the whole point of Countdown? To finish up 52?

  10. #85
    Marquis de carabas's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nick Soapdish View Post
    Wait, wasn't that the whole point of Countdown? To finish up 52?
    I said "usually".
    52 was finished up in its own run.
    'The marquis. Well, you know, to be honest, he seems a little bit dodgy to me.'
    'Mm,' she agreed. 'He's a little bit dodgy in the same way that rats are a little bit covered in fur."

  11. #86
    Elder Member whiteshark's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by carabas View Post
    Yet. Give it time.

    Here's the thing: the better a book does and the more critical praise a book does, the bigger the chance that Marvel will get greedy and mess it up.
    See also JMS on Thor, JMS on Supreme Power, the very intrigueing Skrull storyline that had been running for a few years in New Avengers (because is Not-At-All-Secret Direct Attack was where Bendis was going ith this, then he's a way worse writer thn I gave him credit for. And re-reading earlier issues, absolutely no way was Spider-Woman planned to be a Skrull queen.)

    Yes, I seem to remember other Marvel books like that. That then were destroyed by events.

    Define "recently"? In the last 6 months or so? Last I remember Daken was starring in the main Wolverine book.

    Well, they're going to have to rebuild some trust in their products over the next two years or so before I give them another go...
    So basically you criticize marvel not because they have many books tied to events (Because in reality AVX just have six comic books that are tied to that event) but your critics is because you think in the future Marvel will have many books draged in events.
    I got this right?
    Which is really not that fair,because you know the scenario you are saying is not even hapening.

    Would be like me saying that the Batman comics are terrible now because in the future i think they will be all illustrated by Rob Liefield.
    Pull List:New Avengers,Thor,Superior Spider-Man,Mighty Avengers,Swamp Thing,Daredevil,Uncanny Avengers,Superior Foes of Spider-Man.

  12. #87
    Marquis de carabas's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by whiteshark View Post
    So basically you criticize marvel not because they have many books tied to events (Because in reality AVX just have six comic books that are tied to that event) but your critics is because you think in the future Marvel will have many books draged in events.
    I got this right?
    Which is really not that fair,because you know the scenario you are saying is not even hapening.
    I'm not criticising Marvel. 4Im just saying why I won't give their books another chance, being burnt a few times too often.

    Would be like me saying that the Batman comics are terrible now because in the future i think they will be all illustrated by Rob Liefield.
    It would, if Rob Liefeld had been a major Batman artist during the last 10 or so years. Do note that I have never said that any book was lacking in quality. Just that they're not for me. Don't put words in my mouth.

    It's closer to not getting Amazing Spider-Man because I fear he'll stay unmarried for some time into the future, not because I fear he'll suddenly start to randowly killing cops with his Spider-Chainsaw.

    Would be like me saying that the Batman comics are terrible now because in the future i think they will be all illustrated by Rob Liefield.
    'The marquis. Well, you know, to be honest, he seems a little bit dodgy to me.'
    'Mm,' she agreed. 'He's a little bit dodgy in the same way that rats are a little bit covered in fur."

  13. #88
    Elder Member whiteshark's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by carabas View Post
    I'm not criticising Marvel. 4Im just saying why I won't give their books another chance, being burnt a few times too often.

    It would, if Rob Liefeld had been a major Batman artist during the last 10 or so years. Do note that I have never said that any book was lacking in quality. Just that they're not for me. Don't put words in my mouth.

    It's closer to not getting Amazing Spider-Man because I fear he'll stay unmarried for some time into the future, not because I fear he'll suddenly start to randowly killing cops with his Spider-Chainsaw.

    Would be like me saying that the Batman comics are terrible now because in the future i think they will be all illustrated by Rob Liefield.
    I was saying comics that have not been draged in events,and you said that in time they would be.
    But if Avx which is one of the bigest events of marvel in years,is not draging many titles to the event why would be it be diferent in the future?
    That critic of not reading any comic book of a comic book company just because of something that one thing might happen in the future is really not that fair and is a unfounded criticism which is not suported by what is actually hapening curently in the comics.
    One can have that prerogative but does not mean it is fair.

    Would be like me saying that i wont read any DC comics because i think in the future they will be all rebooted anyways again,so i might as well not read them now.
    Dc comics in the past have been rebooted several times,and to fans of continuity this is a concern.But this does not mean that in the future DC will do a major reboot again.
    Thus there is no reason why i should not read great dc comics now.
    Same thing with marvel,is there a posibility of many marvel titles being draged in a event?
    Could happen,but thats not hapening at the moment,and since marvel is not even going through that route now in a major marvel event i dont see how they would return to do that again in the near future.Especially now that with a more selcontained event worked better in sales that the previous events that had more tie ins to the event.
    Avengers and the other few titles that tie in to the event got better sales that the dozens of titles that were linked to previous marvel events in the past.

    So that criticism about marvel is really as fair as me saying that i will not get any dc comic now,because i think in the future all dc comics will be rebooted again.
    Last edited by whiteshark; 06-01-2012 at 04:16 AM.
    Pull List:New Avengers,Thor,Superior Spider-Man,Mighty Avengers,Swamp Thing,Daredevil,Uncanny Avengers,Superior Foes of Spider-Man.

  14. #89
    Too late Nick Soapdish's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by carabas View Post
    I said "usually".
    52 was finished up in its own run.
    My mistake. I couldn't remember which DC event completely tanked its own concept. So Countdown is the one that was a year-long and they needed to

    Quote Originally Posted by whiteshark View Post
    I was saying comics that have not been draged in events,and you said that in time they would be.
    But if Avx which is one of the bigest events of marvel in years,is not draging many titles to the event why would be it be diferent in the future?
    That critic of not reading any comic book of a comic book company just because of something that one thing might happen in the future is really not that fair and is a unfounded criticism which is not suported by what is actually hapening curently in the comics.
    One can have that prerogative but does not mean it is fair.

    Would be like me saying that i wont read any DC comics because i think in the future they will be all rebooted anyways again,so i might as well not read them now.
    Dc comics in the past have been rebooted several times,and to fans of continuity this is a concern.But this does not mean that in the future DC will do a major reboot again.
    Thus there is no reason why i should not read great dc comics now.
    Same thing with marvel,is there a posibility of many marvel titles being draged in a event?
    Could happen,but thats not hapening at the moment,and since marvel is not even going through that route now in a major marvel event i dont see how they would return to do that again in the near future.Especially now that with a more selcontained event worked better in sales that the previous events that had more tie ins to the event.
    Avengers and the other few titles that tie in to the event got better sales that the dozens of titles that were linked to previous marvel events in the past.

    So that criticism about marvel is really as fair as me saying that i will not get any dc comic now,because i think in the future all dc comics will be rebooted again.
    I agree that DC has been about as bad about events as Marvel, but managing to skip one year for a company-wide crossover isn't much of a streak to be hanging one's hat on. AvX is a big event, but it's the biggest event in two years. At least looking from the outside, Siege looked like a much bigger event - if for no other reason than that it did drag in a ton of Marvel books. And 2010 isn't that far back in the past. Marvel has had 24 crossover events since 2004. Some were fairly self-contained within a few comics, but that's still a pretty big number and I don't think that it's entirely out-of-line to be wary. I mean, DC has rebooted a bit, but not 24 times in the last decade. And they've had 13 crossover events in the same time, hardly a stellar record there either.

  15. #90
    Member Mr. Rice's Avatar
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    I have to doubt that the OP is still reading this, but my advice: Screw the big events and getting into the "Marvel Universe." Find a couple characters you like and look up what trades are good stating points for them. Stick your toe in, go in slow, and you won't waste any money on crap, like events.

    I started with Iron Man, read his early stuff, tried recent stuff, and then tried out Cable and Punisher, then got into teams like X-Force and X-Men, and now I'm steadily picking up trades for seven or eight character/teams that I really enjoy. Completely disregard event comics. People will try to claim that they "matter," but none of this matters. None of this is really. I've been reading comics for five years, and I've never picked up an event book, because they aren't enjoyable. Stick to the crossovers with the characters you enjoy, so you can gets pieces of the stories that "matter" without having to read about a bunch of characters you don't care about.

    Don't read this far, I'm going on and on for myself.

    I haven't read ANY events. But I have several trades that deal with those events, so I get bits and peices of another story, while still getting to deal with the characters that I enjoy.

    Let's see... I've read the Civil War tie-ins for Punisher and Cable and Deadpool, so I didn't have to deal with Iron Man's mis-characterization, or any of that bunk.

    Moon Knight tied in with the Initiative. So did T-Bolts

    For Secret Invasion, I read the prelude in GotG, and the event in Punisher and Thunderbolts

    For the whole Dark Reign period, I think Moon Knight played a part, and Remender's awesome Punisher started there. I enjoyed Iron Man and Cyclops' fights with the Iron Patriot.

    Haven't read anything about Siege, and don't kno if I ever will... Probably only Parker's T-Bolts stuff...

    I read Parker's Shadowland arc for T-Bolts. It was great.

    And then I come to Fear Itself. This will be the first event comic I'm ever going to read, due to Fraction, and as the paperback version sits in my amazon cart for pre-order, so do the ties for that event for T-Bolts, Iron Man, and X-Men.

    Blah blah, events are bunk, but the tie-ins let me get portions of the story while letting me read about the characters that I want to read. Fear Itself will be my first event comic, but will it be my last?? I want AvX because Fraction is writing it, but so is Bendis. This will truly be the hardest decision I've had to make in a while, after swearing off Bendis' "Moon Knight" charade. Blah blah.
    Comics enjoyed by my Old Lady: Chew, IKG, Saga, JTHM, Ex Machina, Gil Kane's Green Lantern, Wormwood, NYX, Jurgen and JMS's Thor, along with a few others.

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