The Bad Guys of AvX?

[Hambone]

A sane and reasonable Cable would devise a better plan. He knocked out the weakest Avengers. You could leave Falcon until last. He's useless. Divide and conquer makes sense, but not with Falcon. Useless. But then he doesn't kill Falcon. Or Tony. Or Cap. Why would you need to group ALL AVENGERS together at one time to kill them. If you wanted to kill them, one at a time would be fine. However, Cable can't have been insane/illogical either, unless you think the Avengers are so incompetent as to be taken down a loony who can't formulate his plans correctly. The most obvious explanation is that he either never planned on killing or found that he couldn't do it (and just started collecting drugged Avengers for fun)

Hey, the Joker is insane and he's given the Dark Knight quite a run for his money time and time again. He seems to have no problem formulating his plans correctly. Heck, the same could be said for Green Goblin and Bullseye. So either Cable's sane and reasonable in that story or he isn't. You can't have it both ways. (Temporary insanity is still insanity when it occurs.)

You also seem to be ignoring the fact that he rigged the place to explode and the words in the book itself explaining that Cable intended to destroy them. Drugging Avengers and then dying 24 hours later wouldn't be a sure bet on his behalf that Hope would be "protected." (Unless he's really stupid, and didn't think that far ahead.)

[Hambone]

I don't think it would have been a good idea for Wanda to start altering reality on a global scale again. Too much at stake to risk another meltdown.

I was referring to Wanda's intentions these days, she's repentant for her crimes. Mike was insinuating that she's attacking Hope because she still wants a world without mutants.

[Genesis X]

and why is cyclops doing all of this, so his children aren't born.... Human (gasp) *thunder and lightning goes off in the distance*

[antiochene]

This thread kind of boggles me. No one's a bad guy in this storyline, with the exception maybe of Unit. No one's acting out of malice - Logan's acting like a moron, but it seems to be out of some weird combination of resentment of Cyclops/guilt over Jean. In fact the whole thing is kind of tragic - you've got heroes on both sides who feel like they're being backed into corners and have no other choice than what they're doing.

I have to admit my sympathies lay a little more with the X-Men, simply because of the unending stream of crap they've had to face since House of M, but that doesn't mean I don't think Steve and the Avengers feel that they're acting in the best interests of Earth's continued survival. They're making mistakes with the best of intentions, the X-Men are making mistakes because they're afraid their species is going to go extinct... I think the tragedy's the point of all of this.

[mikekerrIII]

Sorry, I've got to cut you off here.

You've got no credibility left.

With rude BS like that you prove once again that you never had any credibility

[mikekerrIII]

I was referring to Wanda's intentions these days, she's repentant for her crimes. Mike was insinuating that she's attacking Hope because she still wants a world without mutants.

Not that she intends to keep the world without mutants, but that her actions would lead to the same result. Just like Caps and Tony's actions would have if they were successful

[mikekerrIII]

This thread kind of boggles me. No one's a bad guy in this storyline, with the exception maybe of Unit. No one's acting out of malice - Logan's acting like a moron, but it seems to be out of some weird combination of resentment of Cyclops/guilt over Jean. In fact the whole thing is kind of tragic - you've got heroes on both sides who feel like they're being backed into corners and have no other choice than what they're doing.

I have to admit my sympathies lay a little more with the X-Men, simply because of the unending stream of crap they've had to face since House of M, but that doesn't mean I don't think Steve and the Avengers feel that they're acting in the best interests of Earth's continued survival. They're making mistakes with the best of intentions, the X-Men are making mistakes because they're afraid their species is going to go extinct... I think the tragedy's the point of all of this.

The problem with that logic that nobody is a bad guy unless they act out of malice is that most real villains act out of what they consider good intentions. I doubt that Pol Pot, Stalin or Mao acted out of malice. finding a villain that does real harm out of malice is a fairly challenging thing to do.

[Lascoden]

Get your facts right they meet in AVX 10 in team up, the fight they have take place in AVX 12. Boy you X fans have no idea what y'all are talking about.

Three things:
1. The Hope/Wanda fight takes place in AvX VS 6, not AvX 12.
2. Yes, I know that the fight issue takes place after their meeting. That's why I said that this could be showing their first meeting, as in flashback. These Vs fights might be out of order, if this Storm/BP fight is the one that happens off panel in Wakanda. This might also be a flashback. Considering it's so close to the end, they might not want to spoil anything.
3. I'm just throwing out a theory, not expounding this as fact. This is just one idea I had of what they might do, not saying this is for sure what's gonna happen. Hence, "This COULD be", not "It WILL be".

[Habis]

The problem with that logic that nobody is a bad guy unless they act out of malice is that most real villains act out of what they consider good intentions. I doubt that Pol Pot, Stalin or Mao acted out of malice. finding a villain that does real harm out of malice is a fairly challenging thing to do.

What about rapists, serial killers and sadist torturers? All of those get a kick out of the fear and suffering of others. What about organized crime? They know they are doing something wrong, but willingly ruin or destroy other people´s lives out of greed.

[timeismoney]

Three things:
1. The Hope/Wanda fight takes place in AvX VS 6, not AvX 12.
2. Yes, I know that the fight issue takes place after their meeting. That's why I said that this could be showing their first meeting, as in flashback. These Vs fights might be out of order, if this Storm/BP fight is the one that happens off panel in Wakanda. This might also be a flashback. Considering it's so close to the end, they might not want to spoil anything.
3. I'm just throwing out a theory, not expounding this as fact. This is just one idea I had of what they might do, not saying this is for sure what's gonna happen. Hence, "This COULD be", not "It WILL be".

You must missed the part where it said right out of the pages of AVX 12, go read and than comment.

[mikekerrIII]

What about rapists, serial killers and sadist torturers? All of those get a kick out of the fear and suffering of others. What about organized crime? They know they are doing something wrong, but willingly ruin or destroy other people´s lives out of greed.

I think that you will find, if you look at all most of those folks think what they are doing is justified in some twisted way. Knowing something is wrong and knowing it is illegal are two separate things

[timeismoney]

Not that she intends to keep the world without mutants, but that her actions would lead to the same result. Just like Caps and Tony's actions would have if they were successful

It is clear you have no idea of what you're talking about, none of what you post have any facts to back them up you're just pulling stuff out of your ass.

[RDMacQ]

can someone inform rdmacq that this isn't fox news, and he certainly is no sean hannity. the hilarity of him thinking he's blowing the credibility wide off of this thread is just too much.

So you're just as upset with Meehl when he blows off people in the same way?

[RDMacQ]

With rude BS like that you prove once again that you never had any credibility

Any reason why you ignored about 3/4 of that post?

[RDMacQ]

Not that she intends to keep the world without mutants, but that her actions would lead to the same result. Just like Caps and Tony's actions would have if they were successful

Any reason why you're overlooking the fact that she did try to restore Mutants to the world, but was stopped by Cyclops? And that- unlike Hope- it was a guarantee that Wanda could restore mutantkind whereas with Hope it really was just a guess?