Wonder Woman 9 (SPOILERS)

[Retro315]

These are just random comments, but they might spoil details for people who haven't read yet--so, you are warned!




I liked that Heph, Hermes, Eros, Lennox and Zola sound like us arguing about last issue.

I LOVE what Heph whispers to Zola: "Don't worry about Wonder Woman. She doesn't need saving." Again, I almost think he's telling that to us. It seems pretty clear that Heph has a plan; he jokes (I hope!) that he doesn't know what he was thinking when he gave WW the guns. I think Eros may be the companion who is not to be trusted, and the hints at Hermes may have been misdirection.

What Heph says to Zola about Hermes (just before the "don't worry" comment) is also interesting, though:"And you, girl, are very lucky to have a champion so steadfast, even though it pains him to be." Pains him because it's not his nature to be steadfast, or because he wishes he could go rescue Wonder Woman? Both? Azz is doing a good job of making this ambiguous (azzbiguous?). And yes, i see that as a good thing--though it's the kind of thing that makes it hard to wait for the next issue.

So, if she doesn't need saving, what is this "gift" that Heph and company are delivering to Hades? Something that will stop Hades from being able to bring Zola back?

Hades to Wonder Woman: "Is your will that strong?" Um, yeah. Yes, I believe that it is.

Maybe Heph's comments about the lasso a couple of issues ago will be the key to her surviving Strife's little scheme. Wonder Woman won't be "intimidated," and perhaps her will is so strong that she can resist her own lasso.

Or maybe Wonder Woman's mortal form will be destroyed and her godly self will be unleashed--which might be too bad for Hades, and might be part of Strife's plan.

The scenes with Persephone reminded me of Marston's Wonder Woman 2--Wonder Woman's first visit to a hell (Mars' prison of souls). Diana is given Lord Conquest's ex-wife as her slave-girl attendant; Diana would free her, but the girl won't leave. (As Diana tells Steve, "The silly thing went back to her husband. She said Lord Conquest would be interested in conquering her again because she had escaped.) I think Azz reads some of the old issues closer than people think. And I hope Azz's Wonder Woman will have better luck and will spring Persephone out of hell. Maybe she'll become a regular part of the supporting cast.

Diana didn't say a bunch this issue, but what people said about her paint a huge picture. Is her will that strong? You better believe it. What about love? Oh man the love stuff was just pure epic foreshadowing. Hades apparently isn't very good at the whole love thing. And shooting Diana of all people, with an Eros projectile?

Diana already has enough love in her heart for just about everybody ... it may well be a false-effect, and Hephaestus might've known it. But there are other ways for it to play out as well, incorporating the love in Diana's heart for all living things. Can't be a coincidence, Aphrodite showing up this issue and teasing that Hephaestus "has his charms" and understands love. He's married to her, his son is Eros. The guy must know that Diana is a powerful force for love. The "censored Venus" was a funny way of playing Aphrodite, I thought. Seriously though, if one of these issues isn't titled "Love is a Battlefield" ...

Lennox still strikes me as a little weird and useless, plot-wise. I don't hate him, but I'm waiting to find out what exactly he's here for. Diana's ridiculous dress was great as well, and seeing that beastie guy rowing the boat across Styx for them surprised me - where was Charon? But it seemed like the beast might be filling in because Charon was doing the honors.

Oh, and the Kronos-throne was just an insane concept. It does possibly explain Hades' current child-like appearance, though.

[Javier Velasco]

Regarding Aphrodite.

People may wish to be a cynical as they like but the Greek Gods were not just gods of the negative bad stuff in our lives. They also had oversight of the positives. If every god is Azzarello's pantheon is a nasty monster, then it would bespeak of a narrow minded view of the world and two dimensional writing.

Aphrodite is the goddess of love and beauty. In many cases, she is portrayed as a goddess even older than the Olympians. Rucka even implied in his run that Aphrodite was the most powerful god, but her indifference made her not take advantage of it.

As such, giving her a "timeless" quality makes a lot of sense. Our view of death, war, strife, etc may have changed, but beauty and love are for the most part the same as they always have been. Sure than have been slight changes in what we consider attractive, but Aphrodite's design still needs to make as much sense as the rest of the gods.

Unless Azzarello and Chaing have a really good reason to portray her as anything other than a beautiful sexual woman, they are best to leave her as she is.

[Rob_Olivera]

Regarding Aphrodite.

People may wish to be a cynical as they like but the Greek Gods were not just gods of the negative bad stuff in our lives. They also had oversight of the positives. If every god is Azzarello's pantheon is a nasty monster, then it would bespeak of a narrow minded view of the world and two dimensional writing.

Aphrodite is the goddess of love and beauty. In many cases, she is portrayed as a goddess even older than the Olympians. Rucka even implied in his run that Aphrodite was the most powerful god, but her indifference made her not take advantage of it.

As such, giving her a "timeless" quality makes a lot of sense. Our view of death, war, strife, etc may have changed, but beauty and love are for the most part the same as they always have been. Sure than have been slight changes in what we consider attractive, but Aphrodite's design still needs to make as much sense as the rest of the gods.

Unless Azzarello and Chaing have a really good reason to portray her as anything other than a beautiful sexual woman, they are best to leave her as she is.

Isn't this where someone invariably chimes in with "beauty is in the eye of the beholder"?

[Maximum Impact]

That's an interesting thought. Maybe YOU should write WW. And then you can move things along a little faster as well.

I thought the Aphrodite look was surprisingly straight-forward too, as opposed to all the other God characters. I'm not surprised that she was nude. Yet another woman who is nude. I said this about WW in the beginning and am still finding this problem with all the nudity for woman only. I know, it's the goddess of love. Whatever. Now, it's 2 goddesses who don't know what clothes are. It'll be interesting to see what other goddessess look like, if any more appear.

Aphrodite was Rucka's version with brown hair and her nudity obscured by panel placement instead of floating ribbons. It was very uninspired. It would have been better if they had gone with the Botticelli version.

Here's the thing, this is supposed to be a horror comic. In myth Aphrodite was birthed when Cronus severed Uranus' testicles and threw them in the sea. The water began to bubble and Aphrodite arose from the foam floating fully grown on a scallop shell. The Erinyes (Furies) grew from drops of Uranus' blood.

"Aphrodite was Adonis' lover and a surrogate mother to him. Cinyras, the King of Cyprus, had an intoxicatingly beautiful daughter named Myrrha. When Myrrha's mother commits Hubris against Aphrodite by claiming her daughter is more beautiful than the famed goddess, Myrrha is punished with a never ending lust for her own father. Cinyras is repulsed by this, but Myrrha disguises herself as a prostitute, and secretly sleeps with her father at night.

Eventually, Myrrha becomes pregnant and is discovered by Cinyras. In a rage, he chases her out of the house with a knife. Myrrha flees from him, praying to the gods for mercy as she runs. The gods hear her plea, and change her into a Myrrh tree so her father cannot kill her. Eventually, Cinyras takes his own life in an attempt to restore the family's honor.

Myrrha gives birth to a baby boy named Adonis. Aphrodite happens by the Myrrh tree and, seeing him, takes pity on the infant. She places Adonis in a box, and takes him down to Hades so that Persephone can care for him. Adonis grows into a strikingly handsome young man, and Aphrodite eventually returns for him. Persephone, however, is loath to give him up, and wishes Adonis would stay with her in the underworld. The two goddesses begin such a quarrel that Zeus is forced to intercede. He decrees that Adonis will spend a third of the year with Aphrodite, a third of the year with Persephone, and a third of the year with whomever he wishes. Adonis, of course, chooses Aphrodite.

Adonis begins his year on the earth with Aphrodite. One of his greatest passions is hunting, and although Aphrodite is not naturally a hunter, she takes up the sport just so she can be with Adonis. They spend every waking hour with one another, and Aphrodite is enraptured with him. However, her anxiety begins to grow over her neglected duties, and she is forced to leave him for a short time. Before she leaves, she gives Adonis one warning: do not attack an animal who shows no fear. Adonis agrees to her advice, but, secretly doubting her skills as a huntress, quickly forgets her warning.

Not long after Aphrodite leaves, Adonis comes across an enormous wild boar, much larger than any he has ever seen. It is suggested that the boar is the god Ares, one of Aphrodite's lovers made jealous through her constant doting on Adonis. Although boars are dangerous and will charge a hunter if provoked, Adonis disregards Aphrodite's warning and pursues the giant creature. Soon, however, Adonis is the one being pursued; he is no match for the giant boar.

In the attack, Adonis is castrated by the boar, and dies from a loss of blood. Aphrodite rushes back to his side, but she is too late to save him and can only mourn over his body. Wherever Adonis' blood falls, Aphrodite causes anemones to grow in his memory. She vows that on the anniversary of his death, every year there will be a festival held in his honor.

On his death, Adonis goes back to the underworld, and Persephone is delighted to see him again. Eventually, Aphrodite realizes that he is there, and rushes back to retrieve him. Again, she and Persephone bicker over who is allowed to keep Adonis until Zeus intervenes. This time, he says that Adonis must spend six months with Aphrodite and six months with Persephone, the way it should have been in the first place."

Those a great f#@%ing stories!

In Rucka's run when Diana severed Medousa's head Pegasus grew out of her blood just like in mythology. Why can't Azzarello use the more gruesome aspects of mythology to give us something truly horrifying instead of all the weak play on words and parlor tricks?

[Dr. Hurt]

Aphrodite was Rucka's version with brown hair and her nudity obscured by panel placement instead of floating ribbons. It was very uninspired. It would have been better if they had gone with the Botticelli version.

Here's the thing, this is supposed to be a horror comic. In myth Aphrodite was birthed when Cronus severed Uranus' testicles and threw them in the sea. The water began to bubble and Aphrodite arose from the foam floating fully grown on a scallop shell. The Erinyes (Furies) grew from drops of Uranus' blood.

"Aphrodite was Adonis' lover and a surrogate mother to him. Cinyras, the King of Cyprus, had an intoxicatingly beautiful daughter named Myrrha. When Myrrha's mother commits Hubris against Aphrodite by claiming her daughter is more beautiful than the famed goddess, Myrrha is punished with a never ending lust for her own father. Cinyras is repulsed by this, but Myrrha disguises herself as a prostitute, and secretly sleeps with her father at night.

Eventually, Myrrha becomes pregnant and is discovered by Cinyras. In a rage, he chases her out of the house with a knife. Myrrha flees from him, praying to the gods for mercy as she runs. The gods hear her plea, and change her into a Myrrh tree so her father cannot kill her. Eventually, Cinyras takes his own life in an attempt to restore the family's honor.

Myrrha gives birth to a baby boy named Adonis. Aphrodite happens by the Myrrh tree and, seeing him, takes pity on the infant. She places Adonis in a box, and takes him down to Hades so that Persephone can care for him. Adonis grows into a strikingly handsome young man, and Aphrodite eventually returns for him. Persephone, however, is loath to give him up, and wishes Adonis would stay with her in the underworld. The two goddesses begin such a quarrel that Zeus is forced to intercede. He decrees that Adonis will spend a third of the year with Aphrodite, a third of the year with Persephone, and a third of the year with whomever he wishes. Adonis, of course, chooses Aphrodite.

Adonis begins his year on the earth with Aphrodite. One of his greatest passions is hunting, and although Aphrodite is not naturally a hunter, she takes up the sport just so she can be with Adonis. They spend every waking hour with one another, and Aphrodite is enraptured with him. However, her anxiety begins to grow over her neglected duties, and she is forced to leave him for a short time. Before she leaves, she gives Adonis one warning: do not attack an animal who shows no fear. Adonis agrees to her advice, but, secretly doubting her skills as a huntress, quickly forgets her warning.

Not long after Aphrodite leaves, Adonis comes across an enormous wild boar, much larger than any he has ever seen. It is suggested that the boar is the god Ares, one of Aphrodite's lovers made jealous through her constant doting on Adonis. Although boars are dangerous and will charge a hunter if provoked, Adonis disregards Aphrodite's warning and pursues the giant creature. Soon, however, Adonis is the one being pursued; he is no match for the giant boar.

In the attack, Adonis is castrated by the boar, and dies from a loss of blood. Aphrodite rushes back to his side, but she is too late to save him and can only mourn over his body. Wherever Adonis' blood falls, Aphrodite causes anemones to grow in his memory. She vows that on the anniversary of his death, every year there will be a festival held in his honor.

On his death, Adonis goes back to the underworld, and Persephone is delighted to see him again. Eventually, Aphrodite realizes that he is there, and rushes back to retrieve him. Again, she and Persephone bicker over who is allowed to keep Adonis until Zeus intervenes. This time, he says that Adonis must spend six months with Aphrodite and six months with Persephone, the way it should have been in the first place."

Those a great f#@%ing stories!

In Rucka's run when Diana severed Medousa's head Pegasus grew out of her blood just like in mythology. Why can't Azzarello use the more gruesome aspects of mythology to give us something truly horrifying instead of all the weak play on words and parlor tricks?

Azz gives us darkness? You whine.
Azz doesnt give us darkness? You whine again.

What is it that you want anyway?

[slvn]

2. I thought your other reason was perhaps a tad insensitive to Akins and I understand it wasn't meant that way. Although I do agree with you that for my own personal tastes, Chiang's work pleases me more.

This may be the first time I've been accused of being insensitive to a member of this book's creative team. I'll have to quote this comment next time someone says I'm one-sided. :)

I do like Akins' art a lot better in this issue.

[OBrianTallent]

one issue that I really wish had been drawn by Chiang. The only thing I like less that Azzarello's story is Akins art. The story this issue did seem to pick up in creativity this issue, but it's moving along just way too slow and coupled with Akins artwork this issue...

I realize I am in a hugely massive minority here, but I dont think I've ever been let down so much in a run since Jodi Picoult took over the book for a few issues.

[Maximum Impact]

Azz gives us darkness? You whine.
Azz doesnt give us darkness? You whine again.

What is it that you want anyway?

I have NEVER eschewed darkness. I'm dark my damn self, I just like good stories and hate bad puns. Before I was 15 I read every Stephen King book, all the children's classics, the Chronicles of Narnia, the Oz books, Mary Shelley's Frankenstein, Bram Stoker's Dracula, the Strange Case of Dr Jekyll and Mr Hyde, the Time Machine, all the Maya Angelo autobiographies, To Kill a Mockingbird, the Autobiography of Malcolm X and "Gone With the Wind" and "Valley of the Dolls" when I was on punishment in boarding school and it was all I could get my hands on. My favorite authors are Tananarive Due and Dominick Dunne, one because of her supernatural darkness, and the other because of his clever turns of phrase and crime commentary.

I know good writing and this isn't it.

[garion]

i see some nice, long posts and want to read them. Will do so later. Evidently, y'all are experts on Greek Mythology (I skimmed the posts). :)

I just wanted to post, that I did find this issue and the last one more interesting than all the others. But I do think WW is not a main character in this book (or she is part of an ensemble of main characters) and the book should be called The World of WW. I also won't go into how I think this WW Character is not really the WW I know and love. Y'all heard those thoughts before.

[slvn]

In Rucka's run when Diana severed Medousa's head Pegasus grew out of her blood just like in mythology. Why can't Azzarello use the more gruesome aspects of mythology to give us something truly horrifying instead of all the weak play on words and parlor tricks?

I thought the mucking about in horse innards in issue 1 was pretty much in the spirit of the more gruesome aspects of mythology. Hades using his starving father as a chair also qualifies.

[garion]

I thought the mucking about in horse innards in issue 1 was pretty much in the spirit of the more gruesome aspects of mythology. Hades using his starving father as a chair also qualifies.

I agree those were gruesome.

And that it's obvious that this is WWHorror. So, the point the above poster said about Aphrodite is good and all but it does seem out of character... all the Gods are cleverly designed to be different that how we usually expect them to be. Aphrodite is just an headless babe.

[Javier Velasco]

Isn't this where someone invariably chimes in with "beauty is in the eye of the beholder"?

Whether or not or whether it is, it is still "beautiful."
To intentionally, make a character "hideous" when they are supposed to be beautiful, is a direct comment on the writer's idea of the validity of beauty.
As dark as Azzarello is, perhaps he still does believe that beauty exists and that it is a valued thing. Remember Aphrodite is the goddess of beauty in total. Not just human beauty but that innate quality in things that are beautiful.
Yes, ALL of Perez's gods and goddesses were beautiful and bland. Azzarello's War works because rather than making him a powerful stud, he has made a direct comment on war. In this case, we have seen four Olympians (Zeus, Hera, Apollo, Eros) who are supposed to be attractive, portrayed in an attractive way. 4 (Hermes, Poseidon, Hades, Hephasteus) have been portrayed as monster types. 2 have been portrayed as unconventional humans (Strife and War). None have been portrayed in such a way to directly contradict who and what the god stands for.

[Dr. Hurt]

I have NEVER eschewed darkness. I'm dark my damn self, I just like good stories and hate bad puns. Before I was 15 I read every Stephen King book, all the children's classics, the Chronicles of Narnia, the Oz books, Mary Shelley's Frankenstein, Bram Stoker's Dracula, the Strange Case of Dr Jekyll and Mr Hyde, the Time Machine, all the Maya Angelo autobiographies, To Kill a Mockingbird, the Autobiography of Malcolm X and "Gone With the Wind" and "Valley of the Dolls" when I was on punishment in boarding school and it was all I could get my hands on. My favorite authors are Tananarive Due and Dominick Dunne, one because of her supernatural darkness, and the other because of his clever turns of phrase and crime commentary.

I know good writing and this isn't it.

No i mean, werent you complaining that this story is too dark and gloom for a WW book?

[Maximum Impact]

No i mean, werent you complaining that this story is too dark and gloom for a WW book?

No that wasn't me. I like dark and gloomy, it just shouldn't be Diana's personality.

[Dr. Hurt]

No that wasn't me. I like dark and gloomy, it just shouldn't be Diana's personality.

Oh fair enough then. My bad.