Shelf Life - May 11, 2012

[CBR News]

Marvel's "Avengers" series holds a special and unique place in Ron Marz's heart, one which the writer explores before weighing in with his thoughts on the current big screen incarnation of the team.


Full article here.

[Codah]

I couldn't agree more. That's exactly the emptiness I've been trying to explain to my friends. They keep telling me it's better for the medium and blah blah but I can't shake that exact feeling Ron wrote about. Great column.

[rev sully]

Ron,

Thanks for this. Great article. My first Avengers experience was in the mid-to-late 70s as a little kid in the hospital with asthma. I got my paws on a digest-sized B&W reprint book somehow with no cover. Lots of Vision and Ultron too. I remember just how spooky Ultron was then...::shudders:: I took it home and it got a lot of mileage for a lot of years.

To quote Whedon's own Buffy, "Know how you can be overwhelmed or underwhelmed? Can you be just Whelmed?"
In the end I felt as though it was like watching someone else play a videogame...but I think that pretty much of All CGI-Reliant cinema. I feel Mark Ruffalo & Scarlett Johansson really stole the show...and I think I'm going again just to watch this really nifty Hulk story and well-portrayed by Mr. Ruffalo as well. I was not expecting that. My favorite moments in Avengers got Banner or Hulk in them. And Scarlett...what a great job she did bringing Natasha to life.
I have come to the conclusion that I do want to see it again. For the good stuff.

kriya shakti,
Rev Sully

Eric O'Sullivan
Boston, MA USA
@revsully on Twitter

[bobellis75]

Good article...well said. I do think there are still some things we will have to come back to the comics for...movies are only a couple of hours long, where comics can flesh out a story of a year's worth of issues, can include more characters without fear of being "too much" and so on. And there is still only so far I think a movie audience is willing to let the story go without thinking it's too comic book-y or too "corny".

That said...you talking about your first run in with Avengers got me thinking about mine. As a kid...I loved both DC and Marvel, but grew up in an age where Marvel seemed the dominant publisher...and since I had a limited budget (although I had a family - parents and grandparents) who were willing to help support my habit...I opted for the Avengers, as I could get more bang for my buck (all those great characters in one book!).

I would pick up current issues at my local comic shop and dig through back issues...mostly looking for favorite characters on the covers or looking for those great "new lineup" issues....then I'd build from there, filling in the blanks between the issues that jumped out at me.

Anyway...fun to remember digging around in the bins for those old books...

[Darth Tigris]

Movies could never fulfill the long form storytelling, monthly (or weekly) fix that comics can, though. And they can never fully capture the introspective, narrative strength of prose. The Avengers felt more like a gateway into the wild imagination of comics for the masses and a 2½ hour thrill for us pure fans than a sign that the medium has now been officially marginalized.

To me, these comments are more of a fear inspired expression of the stereotypical self esteem deficiency of geekdom than anything. It'll be okay. ENJOY this moment.

[Paladin King]

Seeing Ron Marz use pro wrestling terminology made me smile.

And I see the point, but I still somehow feel that comics offer a different experience from film. Comics is the happy medium between the visual and the literary. For me, comics and film are too different to encroach upon one another.

[Boabie]

I have to echo Paladin King to a large degree.

I thoroughly enjoyed the film (I've seen it twice and will probably go tomorrow again) and it ticked a lot of fanboy boxes - Cap and Thor catching their respective weapons at the same time, etc.

HOWEVER I prefer comicbooks to film as a form of communication. Given a choice between a good (Marvel) comic and a good film, I'll take the comic every day of the week.

[jemurr]

"To me, these comments are more of a fear inspired expression of the stereotypical self esteem deficiency of geekdom than anything. It'll be okay. ENJOY this moment."

Exactly. In the article when he says what makes them "ours," that's referring to the maybe 1% of the population that reads comics regularly, which includes me by the way. Now the whole world is enjoying Avengers. Why complain, enjoy the moment.

[sandwich eater]

I understand what he's getting at by saying comics are no longer unique because they've finally been faithfully translated to the screen. I get that it's kind of sad for some people that movies have finally caught up with comics in terms of spectacle, but I think that it's incredible that it took so many decades for special effects technology to catch up with the imaginations of writers and artists from the 30s to 60s. I'm also glad that Hollywood is taking the source material seriously now and the movies don't seem to be embarrassed by their comic book roots anymore. Even X-Men cracked jokes about the real X-Men costumes when they donned black leather, but just ten years later First Class put the X-Men in uniforms pretty close to the original comic book uniforms.

I don't think superhero movies have helped sell comics. However they have created fans of various characters. I know a bunch of people who love Batman and consider themselves fans despite never having touched a comic book in their lives. The Batman movies and the video games were enough for these people. I think that what comic book movies have done is make superheroes cool. I'm sure everyone has been made fun of liking comics at some point (for me it was only once or twice as a kid), but now everyone else gets why the Avengers are awesome and Batman is really cool.

[johnnyrocket]

I'm going to come down on the glass half full side of this.. There's absolutely no reason for this achievement to diminish the comic book. Grant you, I'm from roughly the same generation as Ron, maybe even a bit older, so the comic holds a special place for me as opposed to say from the perspective of someone who grew up in the Video Game Age of the last 15 years.. I can reasonably attribute comic books for my sense of wonder.. and for also establishing a foundation for morality. But I can also attribute Star Trek TOS in much the same way....But comics also gave me fundamentals TV could not; not the least of which was a foundation of basic reading comprehension: As my first comic ( a reprint combo of FF 46-47 with the Inhumans) was discovered right at the age I started reading. So my sense of nostalgia and reverence is no less palpable for the medium..

But to say this movie detracts and diminishes comics more than glorifies them is pessimistic. Did Superman in 1977? Did Spiderman in 2002? No, of course not. Nor has all the serialized animation that has also allowed television to go where only the printed art could previously tread. (The only thing that consistently detracts from say, the comic book JLA.. and the JLA series from Warner Bors.. is that I wish the writing in the comic books was as good as the consistent writing in the cartoons.. including the current Young Justice..) Anyway, in a different context, this same lament has been used to site the possible demise of the traditionally acted movie, in favor of only CGI characters.. But as we've learned from AVATAR.. and from The Avengers.. acting and story are still important... Necessary in fact. Indeed the CGI is hollow without the actors underneath. This is why a Transformers movie is so disposable.. Or the latter Star Wars trilogy pales to the original.. but the heart of a movie like Avengers will make it last the test of time.. And maybe send some kids off to find some comic books this weekend.

[west3man]

Obligatory SPOILER warning (despite the spoilage from the article).

"To me, these comments are more of a fear inspired expression of the stereotypical self esteem deficiency of geekdom than anything. It'll be okay. ENJOY this moment."

Exactly. In the article when he says what makes them "ours," that's referring to the maybe 1% of the population that reads comics regularly, which includes me by the way. Now the whole world is enjoying Avengers. Why complain, enjoy the moment.

Nah. It's not about self-esteem, for me anyway. It's simply that comics are kind of a special thing. As you say, 1%.

There was something special (and unfortunate) about being among the relative few who knew about these characters before their big-screen debuts. Now, everybody and their grandmother (thinks she) knows Iron Man, Hulk, etc.

That's kind of bitter-sweet. I makes us a part of a far less exclusive club but there are many more people respecting the power of these characters, enjoying their stories, and,msurprisngly, turning around in the theater to hear the old geek (me) tell them who the hell that purple guy with the chin was.

[traind]

(spoilers below) Nice article. I had the odd feeling that everyone gets to see this without 'paying their dues'... loving the comics first. Logically I don't really think this but I felt it when sitting, waiting in the theater.

I liked the movie-- very entertaining. As much as I liked it, I do agree that it wasn't perfect and could have pretty easily been even better. My main gripe is that in the end, the big battle didn't really present the Avengers with enough of a struggle. Hulk (very coolly) smashes a big baddie with one punch, Thor takes two out at once with lightning.... so where is the challenge? You need an enemy tough enough to put the Avengers in danger and that never quite happened in the movie. The closest it came was when Loki was messing with everyone's mind on the helicarrier and they came to blows etc. Of course if we get a real knockdown with Thanos in Avengers 2 (and judging from the box-office Whedon will have an enormous budget) we should get a villain who really presents a threat and can take out any one Avenger without too much of a problem.

Everyone cheers when the Hulk beats Loki... but again... where is the threat? That scene was essentially ripped from Ultimates with Loki replacing the leader of the Chitauri in the scene. In the comic, Cap was taking a real beating and then the Hulk saves him. The scene with Loki should have gone the same way... Loki presents a real danger to Cap and then Hulk could come in and save him.

I disagree with the comment above on the Black Widow. I felt that performance was really off and know others who agree. Not sure exactly what was missing but I think she was just too cold-- too much like a robot. Too perfect, no emotion, and really, despite her beauty, no sensuality. I keep thinking of Gene Colan's rendition of Black Widow and that we did not see...

[west3man]

I disagree with the comment above on the Black Widow. I felt that performance was really off and know others who agree. Not sure exactly what was missing but I think she was just too cold-- too much like a robot. Too perfect, no emotion, and really, despite her beauty, no sensuality. I keep thinking of Gene Colan's rendition of Black Widow and that we did not see...

I think there were subtleties to her performance that some may have missed. She was emotionally moved by Hawkeye's plight. When Hulk came after her, she was scared senseless, but forced herself to recover due to her training/professionalism. The things Loki said got to her, despite acting like she was JUST milking him for info. She DID milk him for info but she also was not perfectly immune to the things he said. That's what the totality of her performance said to me, anyway.

I wasn't expecting much sensuality from her, to be honest. Maybe that's partially because I don't find her face all that attractive (although those shots of her butt weren't too bad). It may be difficult to believe but I never thought about that once, in-advance of the film. I expected her, Cap, and Barton to be capable. It never occurred to me that they ought to be sensual, however one might define that.

For what it's worth, I thought Maria Hill was one of those characters who, despite her capabilities, immediately looked like SHIELD hired some damned model for the job. That takes me out of the moment and bugs me a tiny bit. Oh well. People like looking at good-looking people. That's how it is. I guess I'd rather look at her than the actress who played Chloe on "24" so I'm just as guilty.

[stuck_e]

I'm not sure what about face you are refering to with the Hulk. Loki was messing with everyone on the helicarrier. When Banner hulked out it was due to Loki messing with his head, Hulk in turn, wants to leave and be left alone, the other Avengers got in his way. When Banner came to, he was free from Loki's influence and stepped up to be the hero that he is.